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  1. To everyone on scouter.com, Now that girls are already in the cub program and they are about to enter the scout program it's time to welcome them. That's a nice way of saying stop complaining about girls in the BSA. Every thread that is about girls entering troops has gone off the rails. There have been complaints about how the decision was made, the negative impact on boys, what's wrong with the BSA, and just a lot of anger. I understand that people want to complain in general but we can't have complaints about the decision to include girls any more. The reason is simple. No scout should
    21 points
  2. Our family came terrifyingly close to tragedy last night. We were on our way home from a birthday dinner for my nephew when my cell rang and it was my oldest son, who had been in a car accident. He was still trapped in the wreckage. He had stopped on the Interstate for another wreck, and a youngster plowed into the back of his car doing at least 65 mph. I immediately turned around and headed his way and got trapped in the traffic gridlock, as we watched police cars, ambulances and wreckers try to get to the scene. Then got another call saying he was in the ambulance headed to the ER. As
    18 points
  3. Last time I camped out with the troop, sitting round the campfire, some of the older scouts asked for a scout story from the old days. So I told them one or two , then turned to go. They asked for another, then another. Surprised and somewhat pleased they were so interested I never once thought I was getting myself in trouble. But the next PLC it seemed all the scouts demanded to know why they couldn't do fun stuff like Mr Oldscout did. I dont think I'm gonna be allowed to tell stories without supervision anymore. And I had left out all the crazy ones. When I joi
    14 points
  4. After years of watching her 3 brothers have all the fun, my daughter has decided she wants to join Scouts BSA. My wife and I (both WB trained) have marshaled enough support in our community to start a non-linked Scouts BSA troop for her and her friends... We turn in all of our charter paperwork on Thursday, and I will officially be the Scoutmaster of Troop 19. Wish me / us luck! -DK
    13 points
  5. LOL..reminds me of the time when I was Cubmaster and a parent called to demand to know when meetings were going to start. I said, "as soon as you volunteer to become a Den Leader"...she got furious and demanded to speak to my "supervisor"...so I handed the phone to my wife.
    13 points
  6. My breaking point happened 10+ years ago when My wife, who volunteered on our crew's committee, came home from a youth protection class where a fellow student tossed out the, "I thought we had Girl Scouts for girls." One scouter told me I was wrecking the program (promoting venturing) when in fact I was giving our boys more hiking/camping hours. Adults blew smoke over local adult-contrived boundaries that youth rightly found to bIe stupid Yet on each adventure, in a dozen different ways each time, I reaped youths' smiles. I broke. I did. I broke in favor of as many
    13 points
  7. This is Doug Kennedy, a member of the TCC. First, I want to thank all of you for your comments over the past 18 months. Your comments and those in other forums, whether I disagree with them or not, have helped inform me as I work to represent all Survivors. As many of you know, the Coalition has made some statements both in the hearing yesterday and in a press release this morning. I find them horrible and the rest of the TCC does as well. Tonight is a TCC Town Hall and I invite you to attend so that you can hear directly how we feel about several issues. As well, we are going to hold mo
    12 points
  8. The SCOUTER.com virtual campfire has been lighting our community now for more than 25 years. It's hard for me to imagine that so much time has passed, and the thousands of Scouts and Scouters around the world that have learned and shared together. These are obviously incredibly trying times for Scouting and enormous transition for the organization. But I have always believed that the very best of Scouting was at the grassroots, found in the mentoring relationship of a leader and young Scout, honed on cold winter campouts and sharpened by the lessons of leadership and service. And these fo
    12 points
  9. Hi everyone, it's me, again, a moderator. It seems that the temperature on social media has gone up in the past week. I've seen some really ugly things posted on facebook recently by scouters I know. Bad enough that I'm wondering why I should even be in scouting anymore, much less trying to keep the peace on this forum. But then I remember that scouting is good for the world and I try for another day. While things are not too ugly here, I see people talking past each other. Buried down in the core of this argument is something worth discussing but instead people get hung up on periph
    12 points
  10. I've been thinking a lot about this over the past few days. I do indeed see things differently, though not in the ways many seem to think. I know this may not be the thread for this, but it is in response to a comment made in this thread, so I knew not where else to post it - moderators may remove it to a more appropriate thread without objection from me if that better serves the integrity of this topic. First of all, people are trying to "sequence" events, trying to determine which came first - a church move to exit Scouting, or incoming policy changes which the church found object
    12 points
  11. The bankruptcy discussion is depressing me. So I have need to focus of good news, like last night. While I have been involved in Scouting as a Scouter for almost 30 years now, and have worked with I don't know how many Scouts over the years, last night was special. I sat on an EBOR for a Scout who was in my first Tiger Cub den back in the day. He is the second one in my den to make Eagle (the first being my oldest), and having watched him grow up I am really proud of him. Especially with the challenges at home he faced. This is a young man who will go far in life.
    11 points
  12. Forums work well in many ways, but it is probably not the best way to discuss the difficult feelings of this bankruptcy while also discussing the impact to child sex abuse survivors. However, there are not a lot of avenues for this discussion so as long as it remains scoutlike it can continue. That said, I do ask everyone to be patient with each other and not necessarily jump on a single word or phrase as a line of attack. Again, if we were sitting in person, it would be easier to read tone or intent in messaging. Forums are a bit unartful to communicate emotion. I really don't b
    11 points
  13. What is legally right is not always morally right.
    11 points
  14. Well, most of them aren't very tall to begin with. 😁
    11 points
  15. The friendship knot, especially tied loose like those will come undone very easily, you only need to pull one tail out and the whole thing falls apart. I blame the World Jamboree of course, all those foreign degenerates with their casual unit t-shirts, friendship knots, and gaudy patches, leading your fine upstanding smart Boy Scouts astray, and now they've taken the trend back to their units, spreading the abborance like a virus.
    11 points
  16. It's ironic that the BSA claims it knows how to develop leadership.
    11 points
  17. While there is less community it certainly isn't less relevant (look at suicide rates over the past 50 years), and I think that's the key to your last question: what image should the BSA project? There may be fewer parents interested in developing responsibility and self sufficiency in their kids, but the BSA isn't even close to getting the attention of those that are left. But I do agree that the image problem is a wreck. Part of the problem is the need for some better PR. Maybe we can get our UK friends to ask the Duchess of Cambridge if she'd pop on over and visit some scout troops aro
    11 points
  18. I had my ECOH earlier today (right as I got home from staffing a camp, I was and still am tired), and it was a great experience! I thought I didn’t want one at first, but now I realized it would’ve been a mistake if I didn’t. We had a dinner buffet and a cake. I was at camp, so I wasn’t involved in much of the rehearsals or anything but it went pretty good. I was shocked with the town officials coming and everything.
    11 points
  19. A patrol with two adults supervising it is no longer a patrol. It's a den.
    11 points
  20. Hello Everyone... Sorry to bring an old post back to life, but I wanted to share an update, and maybe crow a bit. It started out as a slog, but our 2017-2018 program year wound up great. We did lose scouts when we decided to raise dues. I expected that, but I think it was okay. It cleaned out a lot of the people who were really using us as a babysitting service. I feel a little bad to say it, but people find tome and money for the things that are important to them. And scouting just wasn't important to the families that left. But most families, when they saw a budget and a breakdown
    11 points
  21. LDS units form a HUGE percentage of Scouting units in the Western region especially. States like Idaho, Arizona and Wyoming, and large portions of California and Oregon have exceptionally large numbers of LDS units. I am sorry to hear you have had those kind of experiences, but in all my time Scouting as both a youth and an adult, and having observed the MASSIVE size and rich dynamics of Scouting in thickly LDS areas like Utah and Idaho, I can say confidently that, in the majority of cases both historically and regionally, LDS units are powerhouses both in membership and advancement.
    11 points
  22. Three generations of Eagle Scouts happened tonight.
    11 points
  23. I don't think anyone said that. What they said is that we shouldn't just do weekly meetings and eliminate the outdoor program. Honestly, scouting without an outdoor program is not scouting ... its school. So why continue? Risk management is not eliminating all risks. It is mitigating them while still ensuring the program/process/product can continue. My son downhill skis. Yes, he can die. He could get seriously injured. He wears safety equipment and skis within his ability ... but there is still the risk. The ski club makes me sign a wavier to tell me of the risks. My
    10 points
  24. Taking over? Sounds like it already took over for you. Ask your wife. I know of many people that got in too deep, never said no, got burned out and then got angry. They left scouts, never to help out again and are bitter as well. To be honest, I've seen this often enough that I've come to the conclusion that there's something wrong with the program. It takes too many adults to make it work.
    10 points
  25. After over 4 years of working in the field, today was my last day as a Professional Scouter. It's been an incredible ride, but it's time for me to move on and start the next chapter in my life. Thank you to everyone on this forum over the past years who helped me grow as a Pro. If you ever have any questions about Professional side of Scouting, or "the Dark Side", please don't hesitate to reach out. Volunteers are some of the kindest, most selfless people you will ever meet in this world. It was truly an honor to serve them, and I will miss working with them dearly.
    10 points
  26. So I have been given a lot of awards in scouting. More knots than allowed on a uniform, never thought much about them and kinda blew them off. Well tonight at our Bridge of Honor, I was awarded the Unit Leader Award of Merit. The thing that makes this stand out to me is that I was nominated and recommended for the award by my scouts. That makes it special to me.
    10 points
  27. ... physical evidence to prove that we—a rogue, high-adventure Boy Scouts of America Explorer troop of teenage girls in the 1970s—existed. As a group, we hiked the Appalachian Trail, paddled more than 1,000 miles of rivers in the Carolinas, and climbed some of the highest peaks in the Smokies on horseback. My quest was spurred by the October announcement from the BSA that it would begin accepting girls as Cub and Eagle scouts for the first time in its 107-year history. The media trumpeted that the gender barrier was falling, but I knew the Girl Rangers brought it down more than 48 years ago...
    10 points
  28. No dog in this fight (BTW - do not support dog fighting but it's a great old expression) as our unit has eschewed any camporees, etc. The judging of "best" troop or "best" patrol at events when there are NOT objective measurements is suspect at best. Have a camporee competition where Scouts paddle a canoe out and back, lowest time wins, great. Tie 8 knots in a relay, lowest time wins, super. When you start adding mystery "Bonus" points for patrol spirit, team effort, appearance, etc etc, then the competition becomes no longer a competition, but an anointing by the camporee adults
    10 points
  29. (Long true story, stay to the end) Surreal lunch today for me. It brought bake memories that had slowly faded from my memory. In September of 2016, I was on a bike ride with my loving wife and a group of riders passed us. Moments later, there was an accident, a horrible accident. The rider in front had a blowout and crashed, next thing we see is a rider fly over the barrier on the bridge and fall 50 feet onto limestone. Most were in shock, and my co-worker got down to him to help him. I called 911, started directing traffic and someone called for someone who knew CPR. I raced down thinking th
    10 points
  30. The Boy Scouts of America national organization is not the Scouting Movement, nor are the local councils. The Scouting Movement is made up of the youth and their volunteer leaders out there in the schools and church basements and hiking trails and canoes and food pantries and local parades. Families join local troops and packs because they are drawn in by the good reports of their friends and neighbors and a yearning to do something meaningful. Scouting existed in America well before the Boy Scouts of America was incorporated. Maybe this is an opportunity to remember that Scouting does
    10 points
  31. Thankfully I gave a copy to the district with the signatures and my reviewer gave me it no problem. He was such a great guy! After I go to council to get everything scanned the report signed, I’ll be scheduling my EBOR!
    10 points
  32. Follow-up: Assembly was this last weekend. My son went through Ordeal and did great IMHO. The old SM was there but didn't interact with him at all so that was perfect. Best thing of all, my son came home super jazzed about OA and Scouting. So it was a great outcome.
    10 points
  33. As with any bully, the solution is simple. Ignore her. Do not respond to any of her emails on this subject. If she confronts you in person, simply tell her kindly and calmly "the issue is already decided." Do not offer up any other explanation, do not attempt to satisfy her demands, do not engage with her on this matter at all. She has absolutely no right nor authority nor legitimate reason to make any of these demands on you nor your son, so just let her scream and holler till her voice is hoarse and she collapses in frustration. These people always tend to dig their own graves, so
    10 points
  34. I haven't been around the forums for about a year. I was too busy with the Troop, the Crew, raising a son and working a paying job in between all of that. I also figured there would be a lot of drama with all of the changes in the BSA program. I came back yesterday only to realize that, according to most of the threads and posts on the forum, THE SKY IS FALLING, SCOUTING IS DOOMED and everyone is RUNNING, not walking, FOR THE EXITS. Just WOW. Former House Speaker Tip O'Neal would say that all politics are local, I would say all Scouting is local. Scouting is thriving where I am
    10 points
  35. I have been passionate about Scouting for my whole life, but my motivation is driven entirely from interaction with the boys. I know there are many Scouters out there who derive great personal satisfaction from their relationships with other Scouters. BSA seems almost like a fraternal order to them. This is going to sound terrible and I mean no offense to anyone on this forum, but I really hate hanging out with other Scouters. That is why I have always dodged things like Wood Badge. If a Scouting event is not centered on the boys, I'd rather spend my time at home remodeling my kitchen - l
    10 points
  36. 1- Stop driving their existing membership away with ridiculous changes to their core principles in order to be 'liked' by a fickle politically correct group of progressives who HATE what the BSA stood for. 2- Do what they say that they are going to do, and stop changing their 'written in stone' positions every six months. 3- Reduce the redundant CYA paperwork and useless training that drives away seasoned volunteers. 4- Push a program that goes back into the woods. BSA needs to compete against digital and social attractions, not try to emulate them. The outdoors and nature wer
    10 points
  37. Well, that's sort of where I am going with this, and I do not think the "gender correlation" is anywhere near 100% - or more to the point, is not likely to be anywhere near 100% with the girls who are going to join the Cub Scouts or the Whatever (11-17) Scouts. Boys (and girls) are already pretty different just within their own genders. Some are much more athletic than others (and everything in between.) Same thing with their enthusiasm for different parts of the program. (I have seen boys who actually liked the Eagle-required "homework-badges", and liked camping and hiking and backpacking
    10 points
  38. One of the grandkids explained it to me tonight. She always has dinner with us before going to Religious Education on Wednesday evenings. She doesn't play with "Magic" cards, but she knows about them. She has a completely different take on the issue. She thinks that those of us who are opposed to having girls in boy scouting should embrace the idea of boys playing nerdy fantasy card games at scout campouts. Nothing could be more effective at keeping the girls out.
    10 points
  39. @CynicalScouter Thanks from me and frankly, surely everyone, for tracking on the status of National's bankruptcy pleadings, and the procedural steps, past and pending, in the Bankruptcy case. And your commentary thereon. It is no small task to monitor, summarize, and report on the significance of pleadings filed. Your efforts surely enable many non-lawyers to meaningfully follow along on a largely otherwise indecipherable process. Thank you.
    9 points
  40. The mental fallout from my abuse was mostly dormant prior to the current lawsuit. It would still torment me in idle moments. Or at night sometimes when I lay in bed trying not to blame myself after so many years for something I didn’t even understand at age 11. After I signed onto the lawsuit I began to scavenge info from the web, constantly looking for updates. It became almost an obsession. Thats how I found this forum. The dialog here calms me to a degree. Perhaps being among birds of a feather, both as a survivor and as a former Scout. Please don’t lock the thread. It’s a va
    9 points
  41. He turns 18 in a couple of months. I watched him go up and receive a couple of MB’s that he has earned. The SM asked him to talk about his Eagle Project that he is going to try to get completed over the next two months. He is such a confident and well spoken young man. Scouting had a big part to play in that...leadership roles in the troop (including SPL), weekends camping with his troop, weeks at summer camp, working a summer at summer camp, a trip to the National Jamboree, relationships with his adult leaders. I am positive that these things have been net positives for him in his growth
    9 points
  42. I concur with @Eagle94-A1, I've got bad feeling too. I'm glad to see the gains, but they are modest at best. They mostly represent motivated girls, the ones who have been waiting to join the BSA and did so as soon as they could. While there are still more girls that will join and excel, I doubt the additions will offset the other much larger losses the BSA is facing. Factor in other issues: 1. Adult volunteer fatigue/burnout/resignations 2. National's woeful financial status; its commitment to bureaucracy and poor communication; its ham-fisted management style with volu
    9 points
  43. Why does this disease that everything has to be bigger, better, blingy-er always infect organizations? Instead of Bechtel, BSA could have done so much more good if it had developed a program to help retain Council level camps and properties on a regional basis. Property management expertise, help in setting up regional joint purchasing agreements to maximize cost efficiencies, marketing help, seed money to help transition some holdings into public ownership rather than being lost to sale and development. We are not scouts if we can't get kids outside. We are losing too many council camp proper
    9 points
  44. One thing I learned as a scoutmaster: get all the information before having an opinion. We don't have all the information. We can guess but won't help. Something else that has helped my sanity; realizing that eagle is nothing but a bauble at the end of a list of check boxes. While most scouts get what we'd like them to get out of it there are those that just see it as one big check box. I have a lot more respect for those scouts that volunteer to be SPL or PL because they know it's a job that needs to be done than an eagle scout that only held a POR long enough to get the check box signed
    9 points
  45. Surely a parent that doesn't do everything for their child is just a Conditional Parent. Ian
    9 points
  46. Many of us not wholly excited about the changes to the program are heavily involved in the program and have been now for many many (oh so many) years. We are running / working in our units day in day out, week in week out, monthly outings, Saturday night campfires, taps being played in the evenings, flag ceremonies, Courts of Honors, meeting with Scouts on advancement, running merit badge sessions, engaging the troop in high adventure, developing leadership among the boys, working to have them in patrols...all the scouting stuff one does out in the mud and the woods. We see the changes
    9 points
  47. I am not at all squeamish about BSA having separate units for boys and girls. I just don't believe it is going to happen. Once these linked units are firmly established, BSA will announce that they no longer see any reason for separate units, and they will all be officially merged into co-ed units. BSA is taking an incremental approach to changing over to co-ed scouting. It has no intention to keep the girl units permanently segregated.
    9 points
  48. Well, our 83 year old Pack just had our first girl den meeting... and I believe the Earth is still rotating. No media present but we did have some pictures taken of the girls. Most were in uniform and no skorts. Overall it was a lot calmer than a boy den meeting. We have 3 den leaders working the 3 separate age groups present. All of us we experienced in the Pack and we remarked that we need to prepare more as the girls got through the material more quickly than we planned. That could be due to smaller groups, but they were also a bit more focused. Several of the girls were tal
    9 points
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