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Eagle1993

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Eagle1993 last won the day on February 28

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About Eagle1993

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    Senior Member
  • Birthday 04/19/1977

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    Male
  • Location
    Alaska
  • Occupation
    Director of Engineering
  • Interests
    Fishing, hiking, camping, scouts with my son, watching Chicago professional sports teams & spending time with my family
  • Biography
    Earned Eagle in 1992, aged out then returned to Scouting when my son joined as aTiger. Committee Chair of my Pack since 2015. ADL of all girls den, daughter is Lion.

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  1. I doubt a nationwide shutdown will occur until September. This will go to a state by state, city by city call. Many countries, including China, are operating with the virus. This is a pause while we catch up on testing to find out what areas are actually hit hard. Areas not hit hard will release and monitor. If the testing shows cases rise above a certain level, they shut down again. I would expect limits, but most scout camps are probably <1000 people, so hopefully they could go on. Just a guess … probably more hope … of what will happen. I do agree that many units will fold, especially those that were on the brink. Perhaps there will be some sort of surge as well, especially if BSA can ramp up service aspects that could come out of this.
  2. What was interesting, is that we never placed a value on those paintings in our filings … just listed that we have them. I would be in favor of selling them if it helps protect some camps from sales. What I found interesting, is that for the first time I have read, an attorney representing victims said something could be protected. He likened it a bit to not touching "cherished religious relics". In terms of scouting, my "cherished religious relic" would be my summer camp I went to as a youth .. or perhaps Philmont … not a painting. Perhaps those outside the organization don't understand scouting if they think paintings should be protected but land disposed of.
  3. While I sometimes wish we would defend current practices more, I have to agree with @Cburkhardt. Trying to fight the narrative now is like spitting into the wind. We have to take our lumps. I was surprised to have a couple parents come up and vigorously (in anger) defend the BSA. I think BSA's response, "we believe you, we are upset about the sins of the past and we want you to come forward" works. In the short term, we will be hit, but after bankruptcy, we can start anew and while holding true to the scout oath & law.
  4. How does the Michigan Crossroads council work? It looks like an interesting structure 1 mega council, smaller service centers & multiple districts per service center. Does that result in a good balance between optimizing finances while still preventing the downsides of mega councils? What is the role of the service center vs council?
  5. This was mentioned in the article; however, that means Council assets (buildings, camps, investments) could be included. "Garabedian said individual councils could petition the bankruptcy judge to join BSA’s filing with a “channeling injunction” and their assets would be subject to being collateralized to pay into BSA’s victims’ compensation trust. " Note that courts have not been consistent on agreeing on which assets are unencumbered (just look at the Milwaukee Archdiocese cemetery fund case. My only point is that before we start suggesting mergers between councils, we need to get through bankruptcy (including councils). Let this settle out and then reform councils with the remaining assets.
  6. @HashTagScouts and @carebear3895 … I didn't even think of the increased nation fees on councils that will be coming, but you are right. There was a lawyer asking how the BSA plans to pay their massive legal fees given the income was relatively low. But I was thinking the state lawsuits that will be placed. This article below is simply one example. Both National BSA & council were sued in state court. National BSA was asked to be pulled from the lawsuit given the bankruptcy filing … but the lawsuit will continue against the council. https://www.seacoastonline.com/news/20200220/boy-scouts-file-for-bankruptcy-after-sex-abuse-lawsuits-how-will-this-impact-local-troops “Litigation will continue against the state councils in the (superior) courts,” Garabedian said. “Filing for bankruptcy stops civil litigation (against BSA), but it does not stop litigation against the (state) councils as separate corporations. With 1,000 to 5,000 plaintiffs, expect many state lawsuits … especially ones in states that have removed the statue of limitations … and many states are in the process of changing their laws. See below for a good summary for a reddit poster: The reorganizaiton plan includes plans for "Local Council Trust Contributions" and "Chartered Organization Trust Contributions" (Exhibits H and I). From DEBTORS’ INFORMATIONAL BRIEF Page 4 Page 6 Some local councils will be turning over financial data as part of the bankruptcy. See page 7 Look at the Illinois example .. lets say there are two councils (A and B). A has 20M of assets, B has 5M. Lets say B has 10 victims and A has 0. Why would A merge with B until B declares bankruptcy to clear out any possible judgements that would have hit the AB council after merger?
  7. I think the question is … will it be better to see each Council go bankrupt as they are structured now, or wait for them to merge, sell of property and go bankrupt? Illinois is a perfect example. Nearly every day, when listening to Chicago radio, I hear ads to file lawsuits given Illinois change to the statue of limitations they passed in 2019. They specifically mention scouts, hospitals, schools, etc. If the northern councils in Illinois are strong financially, they will be a target. So, will it be better for these 3 to merge, combine all the lawsuits against them, and go bankrupt together? Or, perhaps 1 or 2 could survive without bankruptcy. Not sure, but that should be the only driving force behind mergers at this time. Most settlements I have seen with the Catholic church show payouts averaging $1M per victim. BSA is estimating 1,000 to 5,000 victims, so $1B to $5B in a settlement. $1B means loss of all high adventure camps and national cash. $5B probably means all council camps are lost as well. Councils, just like National, needs to be focused on navigating bankruptcy. The lawyers suing the BSA want to liquidate everything. National, councils, units, charter orgs … everything. Churches are hard to sell ... but camp property is fairly easy, so I don't expect them to rest until they have their pound(s) of flesh. I really believe the next 3-4 years (I expect it will take that long), national, councils and charter orgs focus will be some sort of financial survival. The day to day program survival (recruiting, events, etc.) will be up to districts (who have no assets) and units (who are probably too small to sue). So, I think topics such as what units & districts should be doing during bankruptcy makes sense, but councils and National will be focused elsewhere.
  8. 1000% agree. Unless I'm missing something, it would be incredibly stupid for councils to start merging now. Why would any financially strong council merge with a weaker one in the face of litigation? Depending on how the national bankruptcy shakes out, I could see lawyers going after councils and a series of bankruptcies there (or perhaps councils brought into the National bankruptcy). Now, post bankruptcies, I think it really depends on what is left of the BSA. If, as rumored, a lot of work will transfer from National to councils, then it probably makes sense for many council mergers. However, it seems too early to even consider given the litigation we are facing.
  9. Thanks for the feedback. The scout will be visiting to check out our Troop. I don't plan to contact the other SM at this time; however, I may soon. His feeder pack AOL den is also reaching out to possibly join our Troop. Single scouts moving between Troops happens from time to time. Entire dens, while that occurs, could flag that he needs to reach out and determine what the concern is. For now, I'll let the single scout decision play out.
  10. Here is Arrow WV, INCs latest 990. http://990.erieri.com/EINS/270441319/270441319_2017_0fcc3073.PDF They are claiming it is worth $385M (after depreciation).
  11. This is where the bankruptcy can get very large & complex. I also think it could damage the whole idea of charter organizations. When they start seeing various clubs, churches, etc. pulled into the bankruptcy, expect many COs to question keeping Troops & Packs. BSA should be ready for another model, similar to GSUSA, where councils directly charter units. I also think it is a bit early for nearly every council to essentially guarentee they are not going to be impacted by this lawsuit. If a council has plaintiffs, is located in a state that has no limit on statue of limitations & has big resources ... they will be a target. I understand why they are coming out strong on these statements, and support them, but they probably know there is signficant risk. The good news is that it seems like courts see Catholic Dioceses and Parishes as independent entities … making lawyers sue them individually and working on independent settlements. It seems to be dragging them out, but it also seems to allow most services to go uninterrupted ... perhaps a bit of light for us.
  12. Correctamundo. Do you think we can get out of this whole thing by transferring that "receivable" to the victim's fund? Good luck collecting on that. I also noted that they specifically noted that they did not include Oil & Gas Royalties or the Artwork - Original Rockwell paintings on their asset list. I wonder why they could do that.
  13. They are not, New York State council assets alone are over $100M https://www.usatoday.com/in-depth/news/investigations/2020/02/18/boy-scouts-bsa-chapter-11-bankruptcy-sexual-abuse-cases/1301187001/ National Assets: High Adventure Bases (including loan due from Summit) = $408M Cash (some restricted) = $186M General Investments & Order of Arrow = $200M Texas Building & National Supply = $7M Furniture & Equipment = $30M Receivables = $23.6M Pledge Receiveables = $66M Inventory = $68M (that is a lot of Scout shirts) Prepaid Charges = $22M Other Assets = $14M Interfund Receiv = -$10M = $1.014B of assets … out of the above, what can they use for the victim's fund? What is the size of the victim's fund? $408M of HA bases is going to be the juicy target.
  14. From what I have seen, executive compensation actually increases during bankruptcies. The reasoning is that to keep top talent during bankruptcy, you have to over pay.
  15. They listed HA values here: https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/799102_20.pdf Northern Tier - $6.6M Sea Base $16.7M Philmont $40.1M The Summit high adventure facility is in a separate legal entity, Arrow WV. BSA has a note receivable due from Arrow. The note due from Summit is $345M So, total for HA bases = $408.4M out of total Assets of $1.01B
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