Leaderboard

I received an invitation to be mB counselor for a neighboring district's mB college. They specifically stated that the scouts were to be able to complete the badges in a 3-hour seminar. I politely declined and gave my reason as "Three hours is not nearly enough time to provide to the scouts to complete the requirements as written. Secondly, this format and time limit denies the scouts the opportunity to truly benefit from the adult association method and to really engage in the mB itself."

Interesting side note: My family was the inspiration for the article about the Simon and Kotter families of East Brunswick. When my youngest son, Matthew, earned eagle in 2017, I sent a photo and press release of My 86 year old father, who was a 2nd class Scout , myself (Eagle 1979) and two Eagle brothers, and my Life Scout eldest son and Eagle Scout middle son to the newspapers, and it was published. My high school classmate, Michael Simon, of the family in the East Brunswick article, read my writeup, and played "we can top that", which, of course, they did. We all had great memories of tw

Kids are going to generally gravitate towards spending time with those people who they feel at ease and comfortable with. 17 year olds live in a very different world than 11 year olds. High schoolers live in a different world than middle schoolers. Sure, they can and do spend time together - but it's different than "hanging out" with friends. I think this is the easy to say/hard to do part of Scouting. Once a 15 year old has been camping 30 times, then what? Once a 15 year old has been through the core camping skills 3 times, then what? It seems that in my troop, older Scout acti

If one does "walk out" for those reasons, I would encourage that those reasons be communicated to the persons in charge.

Why do you say that? I believe the traditional scouting program is dying, but I didn't see National separating the middle school age with high school age scouts. So I'm curious why you think they will. Role modeling from the older scouts is the foundation of the highest performing patrol method programs. To take that away pretty much kills the boy run aspect of the program because the adults become the role models by default. And that is not the same. Barry

Whoa.... I was off-topic and made some generalities. Merit badges press my hot button. I was wrong to generalize all young instructors as bad. I failed to rationalize in a controlled manner. I have seen some outstanding young MB instructors in camps. What sets me off is instructing by reading thru the pamphlets an hour or two a day and calling it instruction. My problems lie mostly with the Citizenship badges. Sit, listen, fill in the blanks. For the most part I enjoy sitting in on the skills badges - aquatics, camping, pioneering, etc. It's the classroom badges that press my buttons.

I’ve actually never seen a school in my area where junior high and high school are in the same building. I guess it varies by region. I personally am not a fan of Jr High kids hanging around high school students.

It is not a “should” question. Can a SM recommend or encourage? Absolutely. Forbid or deny, No.

I like how the UK broke up the age groups. Beavers (6 - 8) .. our Lions,Tigers and Wolves Cubs (8 - 10.5) ... our Bears, Webelos and AOL scouts (10.5 - 14) ... our Boy Scouts Explorers (14 - 18) ... our Boy Scouts/Venturing Adult Network (18 - 25) ...our Venturing I could see this helping on a number of levels. I’m sure there are reasons not to go down this route.... but it is enticing.

Indian lore. I decided not to take it at summer camp, I already knew more than the councilor in training who was "teaching" it. I found a old guy ( he had to be 40 at least) who taught native American anthropology at a local college. We didn't just look at pictures of tepees, we set up a 17 footer in his back yard! He kept asking me questions that were not in the merit badge book and seemed delighted that I knew the answers to most of them. Where I didn't or only had partial knowledge he patiently explained. I was actually sorry when he signed my card and sent me home. I

I have 8 boys in my den. Only 2 are presently legal American citizens; the others are immigrant citizens of Mexico, China, and Taiwan. But I tell them that since they will grow up in this country, and live under this nation's laws, they should consider themselves Americans, and that they have a responsibility to this country that is giving them and their families so many of the opportunities they enjoy. If they live here in America, I tell them, then they should feel a part of the great tapestry of this country, and that comes with inherent duties which they should feel the need to fulfil. Not

Sadly, it all goes to background checks and defense funds. On the plus side, fewer helicopters ... well, at least ones who wont pay for the "refueling" costs.

I remember having fun doing Pioneering. Lifesaving was the most meaningful for me though

Update from national https://www.scoutingnewsroom.org/blog/bsa-clears-misconceptions-path-eagle-scout-rank-utah-scout-down-syndrome/

I'd agree with much of what you write here. But, what if we're asking the wrong question. What if it's not how to make it work - but whether we should be making it work. Yes - 11 year olds & 16 year olds will play laser tag together. But, is that really what your average 16 year old wants? You can challenge a 15 year old to develop the program to get an 11 year old to first class - but again, is that what your typical 15 year old wants? Is it that the American program is failing because it is trying to make the Scouting into a leadership lab? What if the BSA did draw a l

@'Lope, welcome to the forum. Do look up the guide on the O/A's website. My understanding: Even if other requirements are met the SM may decide if a scout should or should not be a candidate for election. (Clearly, the SM did decide that this boy was worthy to be on the ballot.) But, the SM may not override the vote of the scouts. So, yes, this is a learning tool. I've found that this usually means figuring out what younger scouts don't like about your behavior. Deciding if you want to change that behavior. And changing accordingly.

I know someone that is life and lost his BSHB last year. This would’ve helped him a lot.

When I say walk out... it's usually during a break or done politely. they've only done it a few times now. As for selection, they don't always get to choose. Sometimes it's a direct choice. Other times they are at summer camp or a merit badge fair. In those events, it's a throw of the dice if you are working with a good MBC. I've found too often people organize events to offer multiple merit badges, but then market some badges only to find they lack quality MBCs.

We had a Venture crew at the CO. They did not really engage with the troop. Then they got low on numbers so they came to talk to the troop. Challenge was our guys asked "what are the activities you have planned?"...the answer was "What would you like to do..." They did not have a critical mass to sustain. The only selling point was "we may have girls". Venturing is way more relationship driven. Tough to add to the established group.

Exactly!

Genealogy. While the majority of the requirements can be done by the scout "before" the session, I feel the scout gets zero benefit of the research techniques, software, interview questions, etc... I as the counselor have to offer.

Fingerprinting. Can do it in 45 minutes.

SOP. I consider this part of "adult association" method, that is in part, learn who best to associate with in order to meet your needs and goals in a timely way. Good practice for the future where they may similarly decide to drop a college course/team due to a poor instructor/coach, change doctors, fire a contractor, ...

Oh.... Indian lore was done by a local indian tribe on their reservation at their tribe's museum. Archaeology done by two MBCs - one a park ranger showing his dig site and the other a local college professor (who was very entertaining for the scouts) IMHO ... It's not the badge. It's the setting, the connection with the scout, the overall experience. Some lend to better experiences and some are really hard to create as good experiences.

That's on our list for a future trip! Good to know it was worth it.

I was hoping that just came out wrong! Thanks. I do get what you are saying about MB university and even summer camp. I just think if you try to draw a line in the sand on the issue, someone will challenge you on it and you will lose that challenge at council. If your council is completing Eagle required badges in a few hours though, I would take that up with council... there is no way that they can complete all the requirements in a single session.

With all due respect, if you have a problem with 18 year old college students who are qualified to teach Eagle required MBs, then you may have a problem with operations in your unit. I was one of those "Over 18 and in college" MBCs who taught several Eagle required MBs, specifically Camping, First Aid, Swimming, and Lifesaving, in addition to several other MBs. As an 18 year old certified YMCA lifeguard instructor who had completed two 50 milers afloat , I felt more than qualified teaching the aquatic MBs. I admit not every camp has good staff, but that is more on the CD and PD tha

This is quite a bit of thread drift, but a couple of your statements concern me. First, why should you have the right to deny merit badges taken at these events? I get it, you don't think the Scout has mastered the requirement, but again if the council is hosting the event or approves the event, and it is being led by council approved MB counselors, then no, you do not have the right to not accept them. Second, just to be clear, that 18 yr old who has aged out of Scouts (and may well be an Eagle Scout), but is now giving back by teaching a merit badge class during Summer camp does

Maybe this is the point where packs differentiate more sharply between Cubs and Webelos.

When I was in Scouts back in 1999, we spent a day at the San Onofre Nuclear Power Plant (before it was shut down) over by Camp Pendleton. We went through the whole facility, including demonstrations of how powerful the outer shells were, the amount of energy it could generate, and more. We wore hard hats, got special badges, and completed the Atomic Energy merit badge, as it was called back then. It was the last badge I earned, and it was definitely one of my more memorable experiences in Scouting.

I concur; it's only sensible that adults who are present at activities for that much time be registered as leaders.

Well...there's always the old school way to keep up with things signed off Or even older school way Or oldest school way

Good concept, might take a bit more structure to work across a wide user base. I've thought about this type of solution as well. Maybe form based with all the requirements by rank provided to be checked off/filled out/initialed. Then attach a photo of the relevant BSHB page. Conflict or questions about completions? Photo takes priority. Using something like Google Forms also creates a database of the info so it can be used for purposes such as tracking, status updates, verification of group activities, etc. What would be interesting to see is how quickly someone could put someth

Hawken, I've been trying to get my troop there for a while! Good to hear it is a good program! One of my scouts attended Fingerprinting/Crime prevention at the Indiana State Police museum on the East Side of Indianapolis. They were pretty happy with it! Prof

On the GSUSA side - all adults have to be registered. The BSA is actually pretty lax on this one.

Citizenship in the Nation Merit Badge Workshop an initiative of the Benjamin Harrison Presidential Site What does it mean to be a Citizen? Find out at the home of Indiana's only US President. Did you know... President Benjamin Harrison is the reason you recite the Pledge of Allegiance Benjamin Harrison is the reason your school flies the U.S. flag Find out more and work towards your merit badge! https://scoutingevent.com/?2016HarrisonHouseMBWorkshop

Easily EPrep. The last day or so at summer camp we did a fake “mass causality” scenario in the woods and we actually had to do first aid and carry them out on a backboard. I have to say, the other scouts in my class were fantastic actors.

Because certainly that is why every 11 year old eagerly joins Boy Scouts; just hoping and hoping to be able to: Attend a city council meeting Have a family meeting Make a 12 week budget Keep a list of chores Write your representative

Railroading. There was a clinic. We did some prep work, then some class review. Then went to downtown, got on a train, did more MB stuff as the train rolled along. They has some RR enthusiast along

It's a little hazy after more than 40 years, but I think my favorite may have been Public Speaking. (Don't make fun of me.) I think that is because it was something I was already very interested in, was involved in my high school debate/public speaking team all four years, had already won awards in it, etc. So it was really applying knowledge and skills that I already had to a set of requirements, so maybe it wasn't the MB that I got the most out of, but it was one of my favorites. And the counselor was pretty good. (I laugh a little when I think back on it because I remember that it was j

Wilderness Survival; the experience of trying out the different techniques to learn was great. But the best part was how the counselor tested us, we actually went on a 2 day trip and used the skills and knowledge. As we demonstrated a skill he would sign it on the blue card. If we needed to discuss, he would ask us questions as we were doing it. He was skilled enough to go through all of the requirements with each of us without us realizing he was doing it. It was only looking at the experience after the fact that I came to the realization. He gave us back our signed blue card and paper with a

Beekeeping!

For my son it was easily Aviation. He got to go up for a flight and they handed him the controls. Between the hands on of doing the preflight check and flying, nothing even comes close. After that it is the usual: shot gun, rifle, archery, blacksmithing, and lifesaving (The instructor was a very cute co-ed in a bathing suit, the 4 boys just drooled the entire time) Funny, the most hated merit badges are the Eagle ones..... Cit in ... Family Life

The more I think about it ... it's not the badge. It's the successful connection with the scout and making it meaningful. But I do very much like the badges that the scout can't get elsewhere. Too many of our "required" badges have major overlap with school. IMHO, I'd like to see SMs have the option to switch badges for the scout if he and the scout agree the badge doesn't have much meaning for the scout. IMHO, I'd much rather have the scout earn meaningful badges. Example - Most 17 year old high school seniors find all the citizenship badges extremely simple and automatic badg

mine was sailing. I didn't earn a lot of MB's in my short time as a scout, but this one I remember.... I took it at Summer camp, camp Boddie on the Pamlico river (I really don't remember if that was the name of it back then or not...)....anyway, at some point, myself along with 3 other scouts, took the boat out for a sail on the Pamlico. So we sailed down river...which also happened to be down wind. we had all of course been through lots of training and practice...and knew the theory behind how to tack.... but we couldn't get back. and to make matters worse, one of the s

I have very fond memories of very very interactive merit badges. I don't really have a favorite badge as much as deep gratitude to MBCs who made badges interesting. Photography - Scouts running around taking pictures and putting together a presentation. Chess - Big chess camp wide chess tournament. Metal work - Scouts bent, spot welded and powder coat painted their own tool boxes. Archery - Scouts made and shot their own arrows. Horsemanship - Scouts spent a week at camp taking care of the horses. Crime Prevention - Scouts toured the local FBI headquarter

Perhaps. But I will "do my best" to talk them out of it. I've seen Eagle-required merit badges taught by kids at summer camp. Just because they are over 18 and in college doesn't mean much to me. Merit badge mills pound information for a few hours and cal it complete. It's el toro poo-poo. I should have the right to deny certain merit badges from being taken at these events.

This is exactly right. I am so passionate about this problem that I stood up in front of the district committee and asked them re-evaluate their MB College policies. They asked me to sit down. As the SM, you can't decline an approved MB card, but you can (and we did) tell the scouts that the troop wouldn't accept a counselor approved card that wasn't first signed by the SM. That forced the scouts to seek out the counselor and speak with them to get their personal information and class times before the classes and find the SM for a signature. That wasn't a perfect situation, but it help k

Kinda like patches at Jambo, huh?

sewing isn't that hard and a good skill for a scout to have. My scout will sew his own when the time comes.....which is soon.