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Everything posted by ParkMan

  1. Having been both a unit leader for a long time and a district/council scouter at times too, I've learned to appreciate that units often feel a whole lot more animosity and distrust of the council than is needed. I've found that units that make a good faith effort to work with the council generally have no problem with stuff getting approved. The council really isn't out there to make life difficult for the units.
  2. They are using camp to denote an event, not a place. This applies to basically all overnight events longer than 1 day and less than 4. If your district has a camporee it applies. If you district has two troops camping together for a weekend in a field, it counts. Basically every camping event that it bigger than a single unit camping alone and is shorter in duration than necessary to qualify for resident camp qualifications. Worse than the standards is now that we have to find people to go through this training. Ugh. I want people to focus on membership, program, and unit service. Not more paperwork.
  3. That's my understanding from the webinar. Too many Scouters breaking rules and then having issues. I'm sure there were lawyers who challenged that the BSA hadn't done enough to make sure that the Scouters knew the rules. This in turn led to more liability payments for the BSA. The downside is that this is major new initiative requiring substantial volunteer overhead precisely at a time where volunteer bandwidth needs to be focused on membership and unit support. Not the best time for some new overhead initiative like this.
  4. Maybe it's just me, but it sounds like you've got a strong, active pack. I imagine that you also participate in popcorn sales. I'd just have a chat with your DE about getting these things approved. Yes, you can make it work "as is" and off the books, but I'm going to guess that other than a few tweaks, the council will generally go along with this. In the process, you'll save yourself the discussions in the committee meeting about doing it "off the books"
  5. I've heard this comment before from others. I'd be curious for people to expand on this. What are examples were you've seen professionals fired who were doing a good job? No names of course.
  6. Thank you @mrjohns2. It sounds like Mr. Lambert had a distinguished career. I thank him for devoting his career to Scouting and certainly wish them well. Of all the national job descriptions, his sounds like one of the most understandable. I really do wish that the BSA would make their national organization more transparent to us all at the council level.
  7. I don't think it says anything negative if you wear the NESA knot. You still earned your Eagle - so you still has to earn the award. All the NESA knot really says is that you are an Eagle who has decided to become a lifetime member of the NESA. There is no harm in that at all.
  8. FWIW - when we did it, it was tied to rank. We also didn't paint the entire face, more put marks on their cheeks. Basically, we matched the color of the program: Tiger - orange Wolf - yellow Bear - blue Webelos - green & red AOL - green, red, & yellow
  9. We did it in our pack - but I'll admit, we didn't have too detailed a script. It was normally done at rank advancement. The Cubmaster would get up with the Scouts, ask them to talk a little about some of the funs things they did. After that, he'd paint a strip on each cheek - one red, the other green. He'd explain that Webelos stood for We'll Be Loyal Scouts and that these colors signified their journey on the way to becoming Scouts. I find the goal on these kind of ceremony is to tie it to the journey they are on - celebrate something about what they earned. Or, celebrate some kind of future goal - such as becoming a Scout. I was never one for tying this stuff into NA imagery. I know some people like the NA imagery, but I also found trying to make a connection like that very awkward and forced as a Cubmaster. So, I just never did it. In our pack, it took maybe 3-5 minutes to do the whole thing - that's about as long as we could sit for a ceremony. Sorry I don't have something more concrete for you.
  10. Welcome @Armymutt That's a tremendous Scouting background you have. A little secret I learned along the way is that it's even more fun when you are Scouting alongside with your kids in the program. Enjoy!!
  11. Interesting situation you find yourself in. If a video goes out about your son and his work in Scouting that in turn is used to help lobby to pass a tax levy, I am fairly certain that the council Scout Executive would have liked to have known first. I'd send your DIstrict Executive and District Chair a note so that they can consult with the Scout Executive and see if they'd like to give you any guidance. However, I would not stop a discussion first. There is nothing wrong with a leader in local politics talking with a Scout about their experiences. You just need to watch out that your Scout's image and that of the BSA isn't used to lobby for the levy without being in consultation with the Scout Executive.
  12. I've made similar comments before, but here's my take on these salaries: I think these seem reasonable for a national organization like the BSA: $794K - Chief Scout Executive and President $445K - Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer $394K - General Counsel and Secretary $349K - ACSE, Development $280K - Group Director - Supply $264K - Group Director - Human Resources $232K - Group Director - Summit You go down that list and they all have to solve very complex issues, run large organizations, or serve thousands of employees and even more volunteers across the country. I don't mind investing for quality in these roles. These seem underpaid to me: $265K - Group Director - Marketing $257K - Group Director - Chief Information Officer One of the primary purposes of the national organization is marketing the BSA. Good marketing people are expensive. We should be investing here. Similarly with the CIO. For a national organization with so many scouts and volunteers, the BSA should be investing in it's technology infrastructure. Good CIOs are expensive too. Again, I don't mind investing in quality people here. I don't understand what these do enough to speak intelligently on their salary $387K - ACSE, Nall Dir Field Service $372K - Regional Director $313K - ACSE, National Dir Support Services $299K - Regional Director $292K - Regional Director These all seem like they have roles where the heavy lifting is done by councils. I'm sure I'm missing something as it seems like a lot of high powered people to interact with councils which are almost entirely self sufficient. I'm not following here. I can only assume that these roles are going to highly tenured professionals who in turn command high salaries based on their tenure and the commensurate counsel salaries for those people. i.e., if the average Scout Executive is making 200K, then maybe they feel they need to pay an regional director 300K. I just don't know. These seem like they overlap $472K - Group Director - Outdoor Adventures $349K - ACSE, Dir Outdoor Adventures Managing the high adventure bases is important. But why so many highly compensated people in that function. Is it that challenging a task to manage four high adventure bases?
  13. This is the part of the forum to welcome new members. Coming into this forum and telling a new, enthusiastic parent that: Is just picking on a new member. You want to have that conversation, go over to Issues and Politics and we can hash that out again. I think we've had that conversation there 10 or 20 times now. I'm not even going to get into the merits of your argument here because the "New to the Forum" section where someone else is introducing themselves isn't the place for that.
  14. That's good to know. I always assumed it was very different, but when I read the post I realized that I simply didn't know. Thanks!
  15. It is most likely a long shot (and not one I favor), but I don't think it's really that fanciful. I see two scenarios that make sense: 1. Councils in the US form a new national Scouting association after the current one runs out of money. It's a legally separate entity to protect it from continued lawsuits. That entity would want to acquire the IP of the BSA. I can see this has a 20% chance of happening. 2. The GSUSA has the infrastructure to run a national Scouting organization and is currently devoid of any lawsuits. The GSUSA would like the BSA to not have a program for girls. So, why not acquire the IP of the BSA when the current organization runs out of money and field a unified Scouting organization. I can see this has a 1% change of happening - but if I were on the board of the GSUSA you can bet I'd be looking into this.
  16. That's an interesting dimension. I wonder how that is structured. I imagine the ranks are somewhat common between countries (except maybe for Eagle) and perhaps some of the requirements too. I can envision that some other Scouting Group in the US cannot start using the same rank system. I wonder who controls that - it is the BSA copyright or is that something at the WOSM level.
  17. I hear you, but I think it would take more lawyering than a bankruptcy court judge is ready for. I'm not even sure a bankruptcy court judge has the place to try and determine if it is operating legitimately as per it's congressional charter. Other than extracting more assets from the BSA, why would they go down that path? If a bankruptcy court judge forced a sale of the IP, then I think that the decision would quickly get appealed. Years in the appellate courts before there is any real resolution.
  18. I hope that's the case which would make it something that the courts could not force them to sell to cover their obligations. So, even if the BSA runs out of funds, so what? They cannot be forced to part with this IP. I'm not sure that I follow that it then cannot be transferred if the BSA chooses. But, I am hoping you are correct. I would like this to be considered an asset with a $0 value. The code doesn't state that the only IP the corporation develops is for the use in a program for boys. It just says that the corporation has the exclusive rights to whatever it adopts. So, if they invent stuff for the program for girls, it's still protected.
  19. I have come to understand that it's improbable there is a legal path to an outright purchase of the BSA. Yet, I do wonder if there is still the ability for the BSA to sell it's IP to another entity. A well organized effort that transferred the BSA IP (program materials, badges, etc.) to another entity and then told councils to simply recharter with them would work in theory.
  20. I've seen no COs disassociate from the BSA in the past few years. This is simply not true. Everyone involved knows that the bankruptcy is related to actions many years ago and is not representative of actions of the BSA today.
  21. Scouting is done best at the unit level. What happens in a local den and pack is one of the most important parts of Scouting to a Lion. As a Cub Scout, I knew next to nothing of the world outside my pack. Lawsuits, bankruptcies, councils, you name it - they are all interesting and somewhat relevant to adults, but not to most youth, and even more so not at the Cub Scout level. I wouldn't sweat all the distractions and discussions that permeate much of the focus of these forums.
  22. I think this is the price of the BSA being a leader in youth protection. In today's culture being a leader in youth protection means being out ahead of the trends and changing expectations of what it means to protect youth from abuse. You'd like to think that it will never extend to asking you to refrain from certain activities or behaviors with your own family, but then again who really knows.
  23. It would depend on why the governor limited it. If it was an arbitrary "hey, I think patrol based Scouting is the way to go", then yes, I think most everyone would summarily ignore that. If it was based on COVID, then I think everyone would comply. Like anything, it's a factor of why.
  24. It's an interesting side question for certain. How does the evolving of abuse factor into what is reported? Perhaps 10 years ago it would have been considered absurd to report that. Today some on the more leading edge of this topic probably would suggest you do. 10, 20 years from now - who knows? There may be a time when it would be considered shocking that we didn't report it. Or maybe folks will decide that this is overreach. Your guess is as good as mine. I suspect that today the BSA guidance would be to follow the G2SS and report what it describes. If the BSA updates it's materials to include that, then report what they advise at that time.
  25. @Momleader - I have a sense that short of asking your council what the specifics of their policy is, we are unlikely to know here. I think you will find lots of good analysis of the probabilities and reasoning - but what specifically the policy in place through your council does in a situation like this is something that we are simply unlikely to know. My own hunch is that the policy your council provides will provide coverage in almost every scenario. I find it unlikely that the council would have a policy in place ahead of time that foresaw this scenario. But again, it's just a wild guess on my part. As for how do two council have such wildly different policies - it's simple - it's the makeup of each council's Executive Board that determines it. Sounds like you've got a council with some more cautious people on the board. The other council has some less cautious people. What I've come to appreciate is that councils are very independent from national - they each were really making their own decisions once we got past that initial month or two. Once the states started determining their own opening up policies, it appeared that councils really were all figuring this out. I can see how one would think this would be coordinated by national - but national just isn't that involved in this level of decision making.
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