Leaderboard

Often, scouts say "my dad made me" when they are bored or stressed. Kids don't know always how to express themselves and often don't communicate the real issues. Parents often tell their kids they have to do something. Sitting at home online playing games is easy and automatic. But it's also not acceptable to many parents. Sometimes that comes out as "My dad made me". I know one scout who is emotionally and socially stunted. He's getting better, but he'll always be a bit off. When stressed, he'll say his dad makes him be there. But we can also clearly see the benefit and gr

The rule is appropriate for a specific application. The problem is zero tolerance doesn't allow judgment of application. We had a local situation where the student was punished for a butter knife that fell out of his lunch sack. Mom had put it there to spread the condiments on his sandwich. I honestly do not understand why schools feel the need for "zero tolerance" anything. Barry

It happens. Best bet is to just keep on doing his best. If the boy is enthusiastic, at least he's making the best of the situation. Ideally, we want motivated kids who want to be there, but sometimes we get kids who don't want to be there.

I believe that's adding to the requirements, which simply say that you have to have the names of references. Strictly speaking, there is no requirement to have letters of recommendation returned at all, much less the extra hassle of getting two people that have recommended you to show up. Check with your SM or Advancement chair, not "someone in your troop."

Gatekeeping is the appropriate ,and noble, description in my mind of the EBOR responsibilities. For the award to have merit, presented accomplishments require accountability. To many adults show fear of responsibility in front of the scouts, which is ironic because the world expects accountability and the BSA markets itself as a program for building men of character. That being said, all scout leaders have responsibility of understanding the program they present and judging the scouts actions "fairly" within the published BSA program expectations. Gatekeeping carries a high burden of resp

It's how we teach our kids intolerance today.

Such rules allow escape from personal responsibility - "I was only following orders." Some of us put our children in the hands of such people. Others vote the entire Board out at the next election.

I always prep my Eagle candidates because neither of us know what shenanigans the various board members are going to pull on them once they go into the room. BE PREPARED. Whether they listened to what I suggested or not was up to them. Two very good friends had their EBOR's on the same night with the same board. 1 boy listened to what I suggested and the board was able to get 4 questions asked of him. Each question was answered in great detail and interest the board had to cut off his comments to go on to the next question. On the other hand his buddy did not listen to my suggestions

I think fun should be an official method. Let's face it, not fun is not motivating to a scout. But think a bit more about what is fun. Different strokes for different folks. This is a really important idea. Trying to treat every kid the same is a mistake. There are a lot of really outgoing and really quiet kids. Treating the quiet kids like they're outgoing could easily put them in an uncomfortable position. At the same time, treating the outgoing kids like they're quiet could put them to sleep. I've seen studies on how quiet kids are the way they are because everything stimulates them. T

Agreed. In our Troop, I use the SMC as an opportunity to conduct a mock-EBOR. That kind of preparation yields great results because it removes the anxiety of uncertainty. After the mock-EBOR, the candidate pretty much knows the kind of questions that will be asked of him (like taking a sample test in preparation for a final exam).

Everything I have seen from National is that the boys +14 years old in crews and teams have been moved back into troops. LDS still charters troops--it's just crews and teams being dropped.

As far as convincing the adults about the patrol method is concerned, I often find it more difficult to convince the boys. Without them backing the patrol method, one is dead in the water. However, if allied with the program, the scouts often hold sway over the adults/parents. Once the parents see the benefits allowed by the program leaders, the parents will come around. More than once, I have had parents tell me how great their kid turned out if given the chance to mature naturally in the patrol setting. The major problem with adults is not allowing the boys to function properly in the p

In the end, @ItsBrian, the joke will be on that kid. His mom won't stop her meddling behavior. She will be second guessing him on who he dates, how he raises his kids, how he decorates his house and on and on it goes. So while you will grow up a healthy male who has learned a great deal because your parent's didn't micro manage you (though I suspect they prodded you along the way, as most teens need at some point), this guy will end up with his mother breathing down his neck for the next 40 years. Time to thank your parents for doing what they've done. I know you will. And kudos to y

All sides, less bickering please. Thank you.

For my money the SPL and the PLC, along with the SM, are responsible for making the meetings interesting. One thing BSA does well is the availability of the Troop Program Resources and Troop Program Features. They have been available in PDF for as long as I can remember, and now they are available online. A good troop should include how to use these tools as part of their TLT; making sure PLs and SPL/ASPLs can leverage these guides easily and properly. Once that's done, planning good meetings should not be a chore. It will never be 100%, but it will be a whole lot better than it was.

Backpack what you describe (The scouts themselves taking ownership and saying what they want to do I mean....) is what I'd guess is missing in a large majority of troops. I know it is at least in our case...and a big reason my son has dropped. Instead, what I have seen is more of a cub scouts on steroids approach Meetings are boring They don't really want to come.... and I'd venture a guess that a high number of our scouts, if pressed, would likely give a similar answer about being "made to come". Some are just better about making the most of it than others ar

I've found success in this area in the past by taking problems the unit was having and pitching why the Patrol method is the solution to those problems. Framed in that light, you may face less resistance. 3 years later, the adult in my troop that was most hesitant about the patrol method is helping the older boys launch an older Scout program that goes beyond the High Adventure bases.

When I was SPL I had just taken over from a poor leader. Troop meetings were boring and we literally did nothing. My goal was to never have a meeting inside or to sit around doing nothing. We did orienteering in the park for hidden pizzas. We did a zombie night hike in a local park with ASMs as zombies. We did zip lining, eprep classes, ranger training, archery competitions and a whole bunch of other things. I basically planned about 20 meetings one Saturday and brought them to my PLC. That covered most of my term. My point is that if the guys plan good meetings no one should have to be dragge

@Hawkwin, dissenters didn't go away. They merely voted (I would say in a blind rage, in spite of their protestations to the contrary) and will continue to do so in ways that confound the narrative of an evolving America. The establishment removed the privilege position of licensed heterosexual monogamous unions. Those who felt that to be a significant watering down of their status withdrew support. It is one thing to be asked not to throw stones. It's another to be asked to kiss the ring. They may not slap the hand. But they will withdrawal and occupy themselves elsewhere. BSA's prom

As I recall our pack had 150 boys so the annual campouts could get pretty huge. The reality was many folks showed up and never camped. Probably 60-80 tents in a very small council camp. Sometimes we had other units there that weekend and is was basically 'tent ghettos'. We divided our area into cub ranks and then dens and might tape them off based on who signed up. A few folks came early to claim a good spot, first come first served. Tigers, Wolves always ended up close to the rest rooms and the Webelos furtherest away. The Cubmaster working with the Webelos 2 showed arriving families whe

<sigh> I try to be open minded but it makes my head hurt when people new to Scouting make judgements but they are ignorant of tradition, take things out of context and do not understand the legacy. Anyway, to the topic at hand, I do not recall the “upside down Bobcat pinning” as a youth, so perhaps it was regional? As an adult, our pack had stopped the ceremony just before I became Cubmaster so I never saw it personally and my boys never saw it. However, I am told parents—not leaders—did the holding and pinning. The Webelos remembered it fondly, and younger brothers were up

Very punny. But if we are going to accept the premise of the pun, I am actually a Life bored of review.

So, flash cards .... but with batteries?

I don't know. A good meal involves a lot of leadership, responsibility, and values. I rember 13-year-old me staring down my last can of franks and beans, saying "Never again." My patrol began to live large (like I saw my SPL and his leadership corps doing) after that. I don't think it came up on my boards of review. But, getting my buddies to cook well for ourselves (and still having time to fly the army surplus box kite the SM loaned out) was as good a marker of leadership development as any.

I much prefer the new olive green to the red though; its a more streamlined look, much classier. As for confusing the two shades of green, well, I suppose getting the wrong hue of one color is far more forgivable than blatantly ignoring the intention of the colored loops just to indicate achievements for which there are already insignia. Really, what could you show with different colored loops that can't already be shown by other means? Rank is shown by patches or knots; patrols are identified by their medallions, troops by number and neckerchief color, achievements with their own patche

Are you an eagle bored of review?

When It was done to me, parents were part of it. My Mom and one of the other dads held me. There was no value, it was FUN ( EMPHASIS , ok shouting a little with joy at the memory. wish my sons could have done it). And I can second the kids were the most upset. I was doing ceremonies with the OA when the ban came about. Lots of Cubs were ticked off that they could not longer do it. Reading Mr. Ruth's letter, his explanation is as idiotic as the ban on Cub Scouts using carts on a service project ( but that can do pushmobiles) and the ban on waterguns.

One isn't going to rewrite history by citing current "norms". It was a tradition that many new Cubs looked forward to. I thought it was kinda fun.

Actually when BSA decided to remove the red loops, and replace them with a second shade of green loops, it did get confusing. It didn't help when distributors and council shops were giving out wrong information on loops, as well as other insignia that came out with the Centennial Uniform. And don't get me started with the wrong info I got from a NATIONAL SCOUT SHOP ( emphasis) I still see folks wearing the bright green Venturing loops instead of the dull green Boy Scout ones.

That's strange, in my family we call them out-laws.

To add to @gblotter comments, there is an ever increasing number of home-schooled youth in our society because of the attitudes, new norrms, and questionable teaching practices of "today's society". If one looks at the Lone Cub Scout and Lone Boy Scout programs, it remains today because: 5.0.3.0 Lone Scouting Boys who do not have access to traditional Scouting units can become Lone Cub Scouts and Lone Boy Scouts. In the following or similar circumstances, they may find this an appropriate option: Home-schooled where parents do not want them in a youth group U.S. citizens

@Col. Flagg out of all the knives I have that are considered pocket knives, only one was a bit over 3". When confronted by it, I stuck it in a crack in the counter and snapped off the point to make it legal. Now I have a pocket knife that doubles as a screwdriver. The only reason it was over 3" is because the person measuring the length measured from the handle to the tip rather than the actual cutting edge. It was a 3" knife.

This is how I used to do my surplus Army down bags as well. Would wash on gentle cycle, can't remember the soap we used, but NO SOFTENER. Then let it spin. Hung on a rack until dry, maybe a couple of days. Only then would I put in the dryer on no-heat tumble with tennis balls. Fluffed right up.

Yes - that is certainly what liberals would like us all to think, i.e. that their values are now America's values and anyone who thinks differently is an outlier. I assure you that large swaths of this country do not subscribe to that line of thought. We have had a number of family discussions to help our children understand that governmental laws do not define the morals of our family. Most recently this lesson was repeated when talking about legalized marijuana. One of the things that makes us special and different is that our values hold steady in the face of crumbling societ

@WisconsinMomma, while there are plenty of opportunities for conflict resolution, why waste this one? I mean, learning how to do a practical joke when you're 13 and among people that understand how to do practical jokes is a lot better than waiting until you're in a frat and people are forcing you to drink shots. This may sound extreme but a lot of kids do not have any opportunity to screw up before they're sent off to college where they suddenly have much more freedom and no experience on how to deal with it. This is the whole point. The adults telling the scouts not to do something beca

NO they are not. Let's stick to the topic please.

You might want to take the chip off your shoulder. Not everyone who posts is trying to persecute you. I made a statement and then explained it further. That's not back peddling. That's answering someone who is overly sensitive and tries to find fault or argument with just about anything. What I wrote was nothing that hasn't been written in here before.

That is what an Eagle Scout Court of Honor is for - to recognize and celebrate the accomplishment. Gatekeeepers are encountered in many aspects of life. Isn't a merit badge counselor also a gatekeeper to ensure all requirements are met? Or something as common as the DMV road test. How about a master's thesis examination committee or a doctoral dissertation jury. There are many more examples. Important benefits result from passing gatekeeper reviews. Rather than grouse about imagined abuse by zealots, why not embrace the Eagle Scout BOR as an opportunity to develop a valuable lif

BSA 2017: Be Prepared. For Life. BSA 2018: It is what it is.

It's British. http://hmvf.co.uk/topic/18314-58-pattern-sleeping-bag/ suggest using a NikWax wash. REI has this advice for down. https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice/caring-sleeping-bag.html

A priest, a minister and a rabbi walk into an Eagle Board of Review...

It's silliness. My sons both got emergency took kits to keep in their cars. We had to remove the utility knives from the kits, at least while they were in high school. It's just the way of the world.

@qwazse Not really, looks like this.

If that's a deal-breaker, then maybe Scouting, and many other things as well, can be summed up by the phrase: "It isn't for everyone". What is regrettable is that changes made to mollify a few incessant hand wringers results in a detriment to many others seeking fun with their boys. Now I'm not saying that the upside-down Bobcat tradition was necessary and its demise was the death-knell of the program, but by eliminating it, a little bit of fun and joy in a specific situation is no longer an option for a far greater number. Traditions don't have to be codified to be important. S'mo

Nice backpedaling. I still don't agree with you, but I find this statement far less offensive than the first.

Which one? You keep raising so many different issues. Would you like us to focus on just one of them?