InquisitiveScouter

The life of all Scout units is bound up more in the adult volunteers and parents than in the youth... I'm not sure BSA really gets this... That is, it seems the marketing is to try to appeal to youth primarily. They see all the adventure advertising and say, "Hey, I'd like to do that!" Parents sign them up and are then told, "Hey, you have to help plan, organize, train, and support that!" Classic bait and switch? With our prospective parents/youth who visit our unit, we tell them we recruit parents first. We expect parents to participate on some level in the program.

So, if I read all the other Form 990's right, from 2016 to 2019, those events lost a combined $92,779...

Yes, they all look like this

It's going around... Our council lost eleven units at recharter. Don't know the mix of Packs/Troops/Crews, but it isn't good, in any case.

Ok, so, for kicks I ran through the last five IRS Form 990's available for our council (from the IRS website) (latest posted is 2019), Schedule G, Part II, Fundraising Events. Net Income? 2019: -$10,617 (5 total events...golf outings, skeet shoots, etc.) 2018: -$7,550 (7 total events) 2017: -$6,261 (7 total events) 2016: -$68,351 (8 total events) 2015: $41,735 (7 total events, and hey! In the black) So, for those five years, the net income for 34 events was -$51,044 Does this mean the other revenues in our council have gone to subsidize these? O

And second youth staffer from my unit just confirmed....during the storm, adult staff did leave the dining hall to check on the NYLT patrols. (I'm fine with that...adults can assume their own risk...) But, the adult staff also had the youth staff go out in the storm to visit and check on NYLT patrols, with active lightning/thunder. I had the Scout on speaker phone with his Dad... I told him to please never do that again. Adults should not be directing them to take that risk. And, if they do, politely refuse. If they press, excuse yourself, get your phone and call your parent for

Dunno...

Yes, the usual practice is to wait until someone gets hurt/killed, settle the law suit, then do something about it... With thoughts and prayers for the family, of course... Jade for sale, anyone?

So, I just spoke with the Camp Director/Training Advisor... During Summer Camp, there is simply not enough space to provide safe haven for all campers inside recommended structures. Summer Camp "procedures" are to watch storm cells on radar, and only pull people into the robust structures if the cells get within 10 miles or if there is "significant effect" to camp, in the eyes of Camp Director and Program Director. (His explanation, not mine...) My observation of this practice is that it is based on an underlying assumption is that lightning is predictable. I do appreciate the di

All good ideas... I'll try a "feedback is a gift" approach first and see if it gains any traction. And no idea on construction dates...50's and 60's original structures is my best guess, with multiple patchy repairs over the years

How about this "Design Your Own":

But this sign might not really help... What is a "Substantial Building"? I know the answer, but a 12-13 year old will most likely not... If this sign was posted on a lean-to, a Scout could easily interpret that to mean "Shelter Here"

Place your bets... When I file this report, I'm going to offer to purchase 50 of these signs (or better if @RememberSchiff can show me one) and put them up around our camp. https://www.safetysign.com/products/10353/when-thunder-roars-go-indoors-sign Think they'll take me up on it?

Got an example?? I found this one:

Lol, thanks... But, I know my opinions are not valued by our SE. And, I really do not expect them to change a thing... Of course, I do not recommend our parents have Scouts go to any council functions here. OA functions are laughable, and summer camp is much the same. Our neighboring council runs a much better NYLT program. I usually vector them there...this incident just confirms that course... Yes, 1x4's. and many of the lean-to's shake and shift (do you like those cement blocks?) They have been improving them over the years... Know of a tactful way to say I'm kee

I have been drafting the Incident Report / Near Miss this morning. Trying to avoid emotion, conjecture, opinion and conclusions....just trying to stick to facts known from interviewing my three Scouts who were on the course. Here's one of the lean-to's at our our camp Better than a tent, or no cover at all, but not when there is a dining hall within a short walk. Staff also knew strong storms were coming well in advance, and should have wickered program to move indoors. BSA safety notes are clear and unambiguous that these structures are not safe during thunderstor

The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked. Who can know it?

OMG, you will not believe this... So, during said storm, the adult staff told the 35 youth participants to stay in their lean-to shelters, which they did. Guess where the adult and youth staff were???...in the dining hall!!!! And there was plenty of room for all!! Guide to Safe Scouting: Camping: Lightning Risk Reduction? Well, I guess it is just a "guide"... Hazardous Weather Training?? meh... BSA Safety Incident Review: Lightning? That's for others, not me 😈😈 😈😈😈

nvm...googled "bripe"...gotcha

Dining flys, canopies, and three-sided lean-to's in the campsite immediately adjacent to dining hall. During the afternoon/evening and into the night... Talking with one more Scout this evening to corroborate before I submit a report to council. Thanks @qwazse for vector on the Near Miss. Spot on. They were literally 200-250 feet from a dining hall that accommodates 500 people... More to follow...

Second parent confirms same story from their Scout this morning...and that there were several Scouts who knew they shouldn't be out, but the adults told them to stay. grrrrrrr

And your stats are misleading. Those 350 million aren't really the sample population; they aren't outdoors in a thunderstorm. https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/680-056_lightning.pdf

Concur. You and I can take our own risks. But, when dealing with OPK (other peoples' kids) (or your own kids, too, for that matter), the standards for duty of care, negligence, and child endangerment apply.

At our Scout meeting, I talked with parents of our newest NYLT grad. During the NYLT session last weekend, there was a strong thunderstorm. (We live about 12 miles, as the crow flies, from the camp, and it was pretty intense here.) The parents told me their Scout was terrified...Scout reports that NYLT adult leaders told them to stay outdoors during the storm with visible lightning/audible thunder. Dining hall was about 250 feet away. The parents asked me about lightning safety precautions and why they weren't followed. I told them I'd look into it and report. I will seek some a

I love this lesson for our Scouts: "The truth has a date and time stamp on it...especially for maps."