InquisitiveScouter

No, that isn't the issue. I know many Arrowmen who are in good standing in their units (the people who honored them with the recognition in the first place), who do not wish to be associated with a lodge. I am one of them The purpose of the OA is not to put another rock in a Scout's rucksack. LOL, no! https://oa-bsa.org/about/organization-structure Lodges At the local level, lodges exist to serve BSA councils and individual units. The key leaders in the lodge are the youth lodge chief, volunteer adult lodge adviser, and professional staff adviser. The lod

What does a Scout do [with a previous award] if they convert to another faith? - The Scout may continue wearing the "previous" award at her discretion. Do they need to do the program over again or can they simply switch the pin to the one corresponding faith they now follow? - The "program" is different for each faith. That is, the requirements for a religious award for each faith are different and often have different levels based on age/grade. If the Scout wishes to earn the award for her new faith, she must complete its requirements (from scratch, so to speak). - A Sco

Your thinking is right on this... And I am VERY glad you have a culture in your unit where this is the case. (The youth wanting to continue to be part of the program.) But, there are clear boundaries, as you point out. What they want is not Venturing. What they want is Rovering!! http://www.thedump.scoutscan.com/rovers.html

With a larger Troop, this does require a bit more scrutiny well before the OA selection. Our selection night is next week, and the SM Corps has been in discussions about who is eligible. Ultimately the SM's decision, but he has wisely asked for input from the ASM assigned to each Patrol, and our ASM/OA Troop Advisor

So, to be clear, are you saying that Joey Scout, who is elected by his unit and goes through the Ordeal (having paid the fee and his membership dues in the local Lodge for the year), and becomes an Arrowman, that he ceases to be an Arrowman when his dues lapse next year for the local Lodge?

And yet they have not been removed, nor changed, nor further clarified, in spite of any "blowback." And I have no contention with anyone's statements about what the attendance policies or standards are for Lodge, Section, Area (or Service Territory), or National OA events. Never made any assertions otherwise.

The absolute funny thing is, that I used to be of that mindset, during some of my tenure as Lodge Chief x 2/Vigil Honor (1984)/Ceremonies Team Chief x 6/Unit Elections x 2 /National Leadership Seminar/NOAC, etc etc. .etc But I had a great mentor who had been a Vigil Honor since the 1930's, was instrumental in founding many lodges in the Southeast, knew and worked with E. Urner Goodman, Carroll Edson, and J. Rucker Newbery, and a Lodge Advisor for another 25 years before I came along... He pointed out the same principles I am pointing out to you.

Although I would withdraw my parent example based on this... Any registered member of BSA who is an Arrowman may wear his insignia. He is a member of the Order, regardless of lodge affiliation.

Your statement is in direct contradiction to that published on the National OA site. https://oa-bsa.org/article/ask-chairman-can-members-who-are-not-dues-paid-wear-lodge-flap I'll go by what they say, thanks!

LOL Yes, you should continue after reading the following: Let's start with the Purpose and Mission of the OA: https://oa-bsa.org/about/mission-purpose Mission & Purpose For over 100 years, the Order of the Arrow (OA) has recognized Scouts and Scouters who best exemplify the Scout Oath and Law in their daily lives. This recognition provides encouragement for others to live these ideals as well. Arrowmen are known for maintaining camping traditions and spirit, promoting year-round and long term resident camping, and providing cheerful service to

No one said otherwise. Read the post... That means events and business... What other points are incorrect??

This is the cancer that has eaten BSA away...

Since it is not really an election, but rather a selection, now, I do not ask. What I do tell them is that Order of the Arrow is part of our UNIT program, not the Lodge program! WE use it as selection for an honor within OUR Troop. I have talked with many Scouts who fear one of three things: 1. I'm rejected. OK, so what? So now you KNOW, rather than walking around guessing. And that is an indication to you that there MAY be some area for improvement... if you should decide to improve. Would you rather know, or would you rather guess? 2. I do not want to be in the

Ordering patches now

So did we! Wait... are we in the same unit??

Well... 30 days... right? 6b. Develop and describe a plan for improvement in each of the activities listed in Tenderfoot requirement 6a. Keep track of your activity for at least 30 days. 6c. Show improvement (of any degree) in each activity listed in Tenderfoot requirement 6a after practicing for 30 days. 30 days later Push-ups ________ (Record the number done correctly in 60 seconds) Sit-ups or curl-ups________ (Record the number done correctly in 60 seconds)

Agreed. But there are some who cannot "get it", even though you explain it ten times. Also, I do let Scouts use the laser to point out the North Star to me, as a check of whether they have "got it." I was surprised at how many, for instance, know the method... pointers stars from the Big Dipper , then five times the distance to hit Polaris... but in practice it seems only about 70-80% can do this. That is, I ask them to tell how to find the North Star, then they explain it, and point in the general direction, but when I give them the laser to show me, they are off by a lot. This even even

If you see that as the point, then please, follow your beliefs and never go into the woods again. Also, please stop using electricity, because the windmills are killing far more birds... As for me, until something more conclusive than your concoction emerges from scientific study and observation, I'll happily bring out my laser pointer to educate Scouts. Happy Scouting

From post yesterday...

And btw, I am a Leave No Trace Master Educator. Never in any syllabus item or class of instruction have we discussed laser pointers. Just did a quick search of ALL my Instructor materials issued by BSA and LNT.... how many hits for 'laser'?? Zero. And, you can use "Mr. Google", too! (and it is rather sexist of you to assume Google is a 'Mr.' 😜 but we will allow it ) Search the lnt.org site for the word laser, and you know how many hits you get? Zero. OK, so I'll go another mile in those shoes... https://www.sfvaudubon.org/a-guide-to-bird-locating/ Laser Pointers:

I'm not gonna do the heavy lifting on your argument. If you actually have a position to support, then support it. Thanks @qwazse! And the dispersal method is actually to aim the laser at the birds! https://biglasers.com/blog/2022/08/16/understanding-green-laser-pointers-for-canada-goose-control/ Of course I would never do this... And, if you've ever used one responsibly, you know it only takes a second or two of pointing at your star to have everyone know exactly which one you are talking about. It's nothing like the duration of say, those Christmas laser light displays peopl

Citation required.

Your house lights, and the lights in your neighborhood and city disorient migratory birds more than any laser you will use in the wild... Physician, heal thyself... https://www.birdconservancy.org/lights-out-for-birds/#:~:text=Light from big buildings%2C street,visibility of the night sky.

LOL, that's for those inconsiderate people who point them at animals. Certainly check the rules for wherever you are going. And I recommend adults only handle the pointer.

Actually, looking at Scoutbook to refresh my recall... There are THREE dates recorded for a rank: Date Earned Date Approved/Recorded Date Awarded The clock for advancement to next rank starts from Date Earned.