InquisitiveScouter

@MikeS72, thanks for the excerpt! "Any remaining assets obtained with funds raised in the name of Scouting must be redeployed for Scouting use in the local area. " I would hope the unit committee and CO would do the redeploying, as their decisions would, of course, be more in line with their wishes. Our council camp is becoming a graveyard of trailers and gear, particularly canoes... The council does not have the time, expertise, or money to fix these assets up to make them salable.

I would not call it theft, because council does ask the CO for the assets. In my limited experience with this, though, the CO's usually do not understand the stuff is theirs to keep, just earmarked for future Scouting. Does "predatory opportunism" better describe the practice?

LOL, I have two Eagle Scouts at Pitt who could bring some gear home on Thanksgiving break. Our Troop is looking for some flint and steel sets, draw knives for shaving spars, and an axe or two, if they are 3/4 axes. If you have any of that, we'd be happy to make sure it continues a life in Scouting. (Also, canoe paddles... Scouts are merciless on that gear 😜 ) One day, I'll get out that way and have a coffee with you...

The survey asks questions primarily about demographic information (including religious and political leanings), values, Scouting background, and a smattering on your perception of the impact of Scouting on your values and lifestyle. Nothing about Scouting operations at any level. So, I submitted my answers.

I know you know these options... but for the benefit of others who may not know... 1. Spend the money on Scout things: Summer Camp tuition for those continuing, adult training courses, patches and books you will give to a deserving unit nearby, etc. 2. With COR approval, donate the money to a good Scouting cause... here's one... The Memorial Scout Camp, in Maine, run outside of council/national influence... https://www.memorialscoutcamp.org/ They give gear and camperships to Scouts all over the country. Some of our Scouts have benefitted from their program. Here's another... Friends of Treasure Island (FTI)... https://www.friendsoftreasureisland.org/ think of these folks as a Scouting History Preservation Society. The private owner of Treasure Island (Scout Camp) allows Scout units to camp there for FREE from Labor Day to Memorial Day. The FTI is a non-profit group that staffs and runs program for those free weekends, including an awesome Scouting Heritage museum. I'm sure you could find others, if desired. 3. Tell the COR they may keep those funds, per Charter Agreement, in a reserve fund, should they be able to start a Scouting unit in the future. --- see CO responsibilities at https://www.scouting.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/06/524-95625-Annual-Charter-Agreement.pdf "Administer the assets of the Unit, including all funds, real property, and personal property (e.g., trailers) that are acquired by the Unit either for the benefit of Scouting or in the name of Scouting and administer the assets for the benefit of the Unit." Nothing there says they return those funds or equipment to council. See also https://www.scouting.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/05/Fiscal_Policies_and_Procedures_for_-BSA_Units_20210513.pdf The only time a unit must turn over gear and money to the council is when the unit is chartered with council as its CO.

LOL... didn't take it. I'll look at it in a bit, but doubt it will let me advance through without answering questions and recording answers. Please stand by.

Thanks for staying with it until the end, and making sure those who wish to continue in Scouting may have a good transition to wherever they may go. Agree all this should be done in person. Best to tell the two remote college members on the phone... a text would be impersonal, depending on how attached they are to the unit. I have been following your situation as you have related it here in the forum, and from my foxhole, it looks like you have made a great effort of it. I commiserate with you, as I am beginning to see a downward slide in our unit as well. Our best hope is to latch on to a few dedicated adults such as yourself, to keep it all going. Well-trained and motivated adults are the real heart of Scouting. Best wishes in the next Scouting task you take on 😜

Your answer is contained in the Guide to Safe Scouting; Lodging/Cabin Accommodations Whenever possible, separate cabins or lodging should be provided for male and female adults as well as for male and female youth. Where separate accommodations cannot be provided due to group size or limited availability, modifications may be made. Where completely separate accommodations are not available, additional supervision is required. If adults and youth of the same gender occupy single-room accommodations, there must be a minimum of two adults and four youth, with all adults being Youth Protection trained. Physical separation by other means, including temporary barriers or space, should be used only when no other arrangements are possible. So, in your example, yes, one large cabin with 4 rooms would meet the requirement. But you could work something out with far less by way of accommodations.

Welcome! The site mentioned above by @qwazse is an outstanding resource. There is another page in that site at https://troopleader.scouting.org/activities/scout-skill-challenges/ which will help you pick some activities to populate your "BattleBoard." And another for Patrol Activities: https://troopleader.scouting.org/activities/patrol-activities/ I really like your idea, and there are literally hundreds of different things you could do. Here's a few spitballs: - Have the patrol perform a skit (a good patrol knows three or four skits) - Have the patrol lead a song (a good patrol knows three or four songs) - Have the patrols do their yells (a patrol must have a yell) - Using the checklist in the Scout Handbook First Aid section, Inventory the Troop First Aid kit and create a list of items missing. Present the list to the Troop Quartermaster or other person responsible for upkeep.. (When done with a MB Counselor, this fulfills a requirement for First Aid Merit Badge.) (This one ought to be done after every outing.) - Whip a rope using the method in the Scout Handbook. - Use a smartphone or computer and identify what is at the following locations: (this one has lots of potential) -- 40.6892° N, 74.0445° W -- 38.6251° N, 90.1868° W -- 36.0998° N, 112.1125° W -- 43.8803° N, 103.4538° W Have fun!

What!! If true, then very, very low... lower than a snake belly in a wagon wheel rut. And thanks for your continued service at the unit level. That is the heart of Scouting, and where things really matter most

Dear InquisitiveScouter, [name change 😜 ] Scouting America, in collaboration with the Harris Poll, is conducting a landmark study to better understand the values that define our nation — where they come from, how they evolve, and how they influence our lives today. As a valued Scouting America alumnus, you've been randomly chosen to participate in this exclusive survey. Your insights will help illuminate the role Scouting has played in shaping the character and values of generations of Americans. Your responses are completely confidential and will only be reported in aggregate. The survey takes less than 20 minutes to complete. This study is only conducted once every 10 years — and only a select group of alumni are invited. <SURVEY LINK> [REDACTED] Please note: This survey link is unique to you and can only be used once. Kindly do not forward it to others. Your perspective matters. By participating, you'll be contributing to a deeper understanding of the values that unite us — and how Scouting continues to make a lasting impact. Thank you for being part of this important effort! Patricia Wellen Research Director, Scouting America Pat.Wellen@Scouting.org ------------------------------------------------------------- Hi Patricia! Question... if my survey is to be completely confidential, then why issue a survey link that is unique to me? To my regret, I believed BSA once before on this. After giving my opinion on what could be fixed in the organization, particularly with regards bloated and unresponsive staffing, poor IT support, and an unnecessary number of councils with overpaid council employees at the higher levels, our local council executive blacklisted me and removed me from all district and council positions. No, thank you! Regards, Inquisitive Scouter

All to better serve you and your unit!

Because if it weren't for non-sense, we'd have no sense at all? 😜

Do you pop-up blocker? If so, disable...

For requirement 9a (20 nights), the verbiage says "Each night must be spent either under the sky, in a tent you have pitched yourself (if a tent is provided and already set up, you do not need to pitch your own), in a hammock that is safely strung outdoors, in a lean-to, or other three-sided shelter with an open front. Nights spent in indoor lock-in events, cabin camping, hotel stays, or other covered accommodations do not count toward the 20 nights." So, staying in the cabin of the sailboat does not count. Sleeping on deck (because they are making a comfortable "ground bed" and sleeping under the stars ... sure! Requirement 9.b. (4) says, "Take a nonmotorized trip on the water of at least four hours or 5 miles.", So, if the sailboat travels either four hours, or five miles, under sail (not motoring), then, yes, it counts. Not sure where it says these nights count for Sea Scouts for Camping MB? Reference, please? Other than for the National Outdoor Awards Program? "Complete 25 days and nights of camping—including six consecutive days (five nights) of camping (Sea Scouts may be on a boat), approved and under the auspices and standards of Scouting America—including nights camped as part of requirements 1 through 3 above. Scouts must complete six consecutive days (five nights) of the 25 nights at a Scouting America accredited resident camp." https://www.scouting.org/programs/scouts-bsa/advancement-and-awards/noa/ [NOTE: this verbiage contradicts itself... "Sea Scouts may be on a boat" is listed before the "...under the auspices and standards of Scouting America" stipulation. To communicate clearly, exceptions should be specifically spelled out AFTER stating the rule.] Nothing specific about this in the Guide to Advancement: https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/33088.pdf Or in articles on Aaron on Scouting: https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2015/06/24/ask-expert-isnt-camping-night-camping-mb/ https://scoutingmagazine.org/2017/12/no-glamping-allowed/ Or the Sea Scout Manual: https://seascout.org/wp-content/uploads/2025/02/3323925-Sea-Scout-Manual-PDF-Posted-02182025.pdf Let's take this argument to its absurd extreme. Your unit books a cruise on a cruise ship. The cruise ship is under power, so the trip does not count for 9b, but it would count for 9a, because you are on a boat? No. Because there is an overwhelming number of variations on "camping" and the legalese of what constitutes camping, I look at the spirit of the thing. And yet, it is difficult to articulate the spirit of it, as long as the "if a tent is provided and already set up, you do not need to pitch your own" clause is there... Instead of arguing the legalities of it, this is one I ultimately leave to individual Scout, and the leader signing it off. If you and the Scout agree those nights count, then count them. My Scouts and I do not count them. We did our sailing adventure... I asked our Scouts, and they agreed. We only recorded nights spent on deck under the stars. And we had buddy boats... one equipped with air conditioning that could be run while moored, and one without (only run while in a powered slip.) Even the Scouts on the boat not air conditioned agreed their nights below deck should not count toward the requirement. Final thought... if you need to rely on nights below deck to get your 20 for Camping Merit Badge... (insert a phrase appropriate for Scouting that communicates your level of individual effort just doesn't cut it...) Happy Trails

@ZebraLongwing, the answer to this is clearly in the Guide to Safe Scouting: Tenting In Cub Scouting Parents and guardians may share a tent with their family. In Older Youth Programs (I.e., Scouts BSA, Sea Scouts, and Venturing) Separate tenting arrangements must be provided for male and female adults, and for male and female youth. Youth and adults must tent separately. Youth sharing a tent must be no more than two years apart in age. Spouses may share a tent. As an exception, a parent or guardian may share a tent with their own child if they are of the same sex. https://www.scouting.org/health-and-safety/gss/gss01/#a Your local council can make exceptions to this policy for reasons of health and safety. For example, once upon a time, we had a Scout who had night terrors and sleep walking behavior. The parents were deeply concerned for the Scout's safety on camping trips. So, we, wrote a detailed email of the situation and our recommendations to the council exec: a parent would register with the Troop, sleep in same tent with Scout to deal with the issue if it arose, and parent would not count toward our requirement for two-deep. This was acceptable to council (and national), and the exception was granted.

There is a downward trend in literacy in the US. Most kids aren't reading any more. I have noticed this in troop settings. Scouts (and adults) just aren't reading things, like the Scout Handbook. When asked for instruction on a skill, I first ask the Scout to read that section of the Scout Handbook. Most are opening their books to that section for the very first time (even though the page numbers are listed on their requirements.) In my perception, Scouts demonstrate lower and lower reading ability over the last decade. I often have to help 12, 13, 14, & 15 year olds with words in the book. I believe electronic devices and internet content are the greatest contributor to the decline; poor parenting and reliance on substandard school systems are the second greatest contributor. (My wife and I believed that it was our responsibility to teach our children to read, among other things, and so they did exceptionally well in school. Also, we limited their access to electronics and gave them books to read to occupy their time.) COVID may have accelerated this trend. Here are some 2025 stats listed from the national Literacy Institute https://www.thenationalliteracyinstitute.com/2024-2025-literacy-statistics On average, 79% of U.S. adults nationwide are literate in 2024. 21% of adults in the US are illiterate in 2024. 54% of adults have a literacy below a 6th-grade level (20% are below 5th-grade level). [this is astounding to me; that's about 130 million adults reading below 6th grade level] Low levels of literacy costs the US up to 2.2 trillion per year. 34% of adults lacking literacy proficiency were born outside the US. Massachusetts was the state with the highest rate of child literacy. New Mexico was the state with the lowest child literacy rate. New Hampshire was the state with the highest percentage of adults considered literate. The state with the lowest adult literacy rate was California. Where does the US rank in literacy? [worldwide] The US ranks 36th in literacy.

Agree, if they participate... we have some Scouts with sparse attendance at meetings and rare attendance on outings. They do things for advancement purposes only, because they (and their parents) focus on advancement as the end, and not the means. If I was the benevolent dictator, I'd not renew many of our Scouts' registrations each year, due to lack of participation... that, in order to focus more of our resources on the ones that do come and participate.

It is easy to lie, cheat, and steal your way to Eagle Scout... I have seen many a "Paper Eagle Scout" over the years. It has literally become akin to "pay your fee, get your degree." If you keep your membership up, attend a few summer camps where you sit around a picnic table and listen to a 15 year old talk about a merit badge, and have your parents do your project, you, too, can be given an Eagle Scout rank patch. When these come to me for assistance, I hold to the requirements. Nothing more, and nothing less. I do not sign requirements if I believe the Scout has not done them as written, and have had some parents be quite upset with me when I refuse to participate in helping them maintain the facade. They have always found someone else with, let's say, a different standard of integrity, who will sign off stuff... My stance is always that "I am only responsible for my own actions."

The OP also ignores elements of complexity in the organization... When you first "sign up", you really have no idea what you are getting into. The organizational structures and policies are discovered or revealed to you over time. (Or they change...) It is also naive to expect anyone to agree 100% with every policy or decision that comes down the pipe. The organization is made of people... and people often make poor decisions. I agree with the ideals, aims, and methods of Scouting, and I pursue those. I find the organization is often at war within itself because of policies, actions, decisions taken which do not coherently align with the ideals, aims, and methods. Here is a case in point... The Scout Oath presents a tenet to us to be morally straight. For most of its history, BSA prohibited open homosexuals from being adult leaders in the organization. They even won a challenge to this policy in the Supreme Court. In my faith and belief, acts of homosexuality are a moral evil. Therefore, I did not, and do not support the BSA's reversal on this policy. I can tolerate the policy, but I do not accept it. There is a difference... I have learned to reconcile this, given the circumstances of BSA's other policies surrounding the issue... to wit, our CO has the latitude to prohibit adults who openly profess or practice homosexuality, and our Troop Committee / parents will not accept a leader into our fold who does so. These parents do not wish their children to be exposed to these ideas in our Scouting environment. Further, BSA policy specifically prohibits discussions of these matters in a Scouting setting. So, the issue should never be brought up. In effect, this is equivalent to a don't ask, don't tell policy. I do encounter volunteers in BSA who openly push the issue. I simply disengage and walk away. See item 6. in the Scouter Code of Conduct: "I will not discuss or engage in any form of sexual conduct while engaged in Scouting activities. I will refer Scouts with questions regarding these topics to talk to their parents or spiritual advisor."

So, you'd rather everyone drink the Kool-aid? And if they do not want to, nor fall in line with everything, then they should leave?

We have tried, but, like most of these positions, you usually wind up with a Scout doing little more than wearing a patch and doing some "low threshold" tasks during their tenure. (to use your words.) Big picture, for each SPL tenure of office (for this unit it is every six months), the SPL must appoint a slate of PORs. Many often continue in their role, and that is fine. Shortly after installation into his office, the SPL organizes and leads an Introduction to Leadership Skills for Troops (ILST). During ILST, the PORs learn about their jobs and SMART goals. They must use that information to develop three SMART goals for their tenure, and the goals must be approved by the SPL (and the SM) I am the adult in our unit who mentors the OE Guide. The three goals we see are along these lines: 1. By the end of my tenure, I will complete the Outdoor Ethics Orientation Course, S1110. ( An alternate to this is, by the end of tenure, I will assist in teaching an S110.) 2. By the end of my tenure, I will complete the Outdoor Ethics Awareness Award. (Or alternate, I will complete my OE Action Award.) 3. By the end of my tenure, I will give two 5-minute presentations on an Outdoor Ethics topic or principle at a Troop meeting, both of which must include teaching and practicing a hands-on skill. (How to hang a bear bag, how to deal with dishwater after a meal, how to measure 200 feet so you know where to dump dishwater, how to erase the evidence of a fire using Leave No Trace techniques, etc.) The Scout should come up with these goals, but often, the Scout does not "know what right looks like." I view these as all low threshold, but it seems over the last decade or so, even these have become significant challenges for Scouts. And, we have not had an OE Guide for the last year. We try to use the job descriptions from the Scout Handbook to create the SMART goals, as those list specific tasks of the position. Creating and approving the goals is a chore, and we often fall short on doing the work necessary to ensure accountability for the goals, unless the Scout needs the position as credit for advancement. Our Scouts generally avoid PORs nowadays, unless needed for rank advancement... a sad state of affairs if you ask me, and one of the signs that our unit is on a downward trajectory. (I see this dearth of effort to drive accountability [by SPL and adults] as a contributing factor to the downward trajectory.)

And how about a drawing of a pirate holding a sword in one hand, and a VIPER in the other?? Now that would be cool

And another... and this will (as it has in the past) generate controversy... Pet peeve: Requiring a Scout to say "Thank You" when handing a folded pocketknife. And admonishing them when they do not. Read your Scout Handbook. A "Thank You" is required only when handing an axe. Should a Scout say "Thank You"? Yes, of course, a Scout is Courteous. Must a Scout say it, as a matter of instruction and requirement? No. If you say "yes", then do you impose the same requirement for the exchange of all other items? Pens and pencils, books, papers, spatulas, first aid kits, food items, etc, etc, etc. that have as much risk as a folded pocketknife?

OK... a pet peeve... yelling "Signs Up!"