Jump to content

Sentinel947

Members
  • Content Count

    2012
  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won

    21

Everything posted by Sentinel947

  1. Sentinel947

    I HATE the new YPT rules

    Thanks! I really enjoyed Wood Badge, but I try to be open minded about where it can be better. I had "type 1" and "type 2" adults in my unit when I was a scout growing up. I jumped into Wood Badge at 22 mostly as a way to encourage our Scoutmaster to go. He needed it. It made him a better Scoutmaster, but it wasn't some enlightening experience for either of us. Good training, fun, I still keep in touch with many staff and participants from my course, but not anything the way some folks rave about Wood Badge. Still, I have a pretty positive impression of it. I don't even know if I was a Scout when that happened. I do know with the updates they are making to WB21, they won't require folks to retake WB to be "current." My expanded thoughts are more based around NYLT than Wood Badge, because I haven't staffed Wood Badge, but I think they apply to both. Selling the course I think folks sell Wood Badge pretty poorly. "It's a mountain top experience." "It's my Eagle", that sorta stuff. It sets folks up to be underwhelmed by Wood Badge. Hopefully it's good training. It should be fun. It should challenge us to improve our units and give us some ideas on how to accomplish that. It's not the pinnacle Scouting experience. Wood Badge is a means to an end, not an end unto on it's own. It's equipping us to help our youth have those great Scouting experiences. My "greatest accomplishments" as a Scouter were working with and coaching my Scouts. Seeing them grow, develop, learn and overcome challenges. That's both true for Scouts in my unit, and some of the youth I staffed with last summer at NYLT. Working with those youth has changed my life, more than participating in Wood Badge ever could have. There's some threads on this website about "Scouting Wins", "Scoutmaster paychecks." Those are the real "Mountaintop experiences" for a Scouter. We've all had those, Wood Badger or not. NYLT is a bit more of a pinnacle experience for Scouts because it's something really fresh to them. Most troops do not run the patrol method, as we all know. Scouts haven't likely experienced something like NYLT. I know when I was a Scout it really changed my perception of leadership from that of a boss or a taskmaster to that of somebody who is a servant leader who puts others first and helps them achieve their (and our) goals. If their troop is really adult ran, then it's also a fresh opportunity for them to see what Scouting is really supposed to be like. NYLT changed my perception of what Scouting was about, and kept me fully engaged when I was 16-17 and finishing up my Eagle. It motivated me to keep active and provide service to my troop vs just hunker down and work on my Eagle. I've caught my own Scouts doing the NYLT click thing. My troop has a Court of Honor in August. We sent 5 Scouts to NYLT this summer. We have our Scouts come up, be recognized for what summer camps, high adventure, NYLT things they did over the summer. My NYLT scouts talked about how much fun the course was, but they also decided to sing a particularly annoying song they learned at NYLT, that nobody else in my Troop knows. It wasn't quite the Critter song level of pain (because it was brief) but it definitely is a similar situation. Thankfully, my Scouts "walk the walk" from what they learned at NYLT, and it's made a strong difference in my unit. My unit has 4 scouts who have applied to be on staff, and two scouters from my unit going back to staff for 2019. I sell Wood Badge to Scouters through NYLT. I encourage them to send their Scouts to NYLT. I think the best place for this is at training events. Our NYLT youth staff are awesome, and help scouters teach many of our courses like UOS classes, IOLS, SM Specific, and even some skills training at Wood Badge. They staff many of our council and district events like camporees. Hopefully seeing these Scouts in action encourages leaders to offer NYLT to their Scouts, who often don't know much about NYLT unless a leader, parent or older Scout tells them. Then the sales pitch for Wood Badge is less about joining the WB cult and more of "If you're not sure how you can support and reinforce what your Scout has learned at NYLT, come to Wood Badge." I do think there is a place for silly inside jokes like the Critter song and other Wood Badge jokes, but they need to be used in their proper places and times, and should not be used to sell the program. Scouting about the youth, and Wood Badge and NYLT should also be about how we serve youth. They are for no other purpose in my opinion. Selling Wood Badge feels similar to me as religious evangelism. If I "walk the walk", if I'm friendly, helpful, courteous and kind, then selling the course to others around me should be pretty easy. No hard sales pitch needed. Without that personal connection, I might as well be selling cutco knives, or cable tv to people. How do you fix it? I honestly think it comes down to the pros shaping the Wood Badge/NYLT culture in their councils. They need to have folks who care about the participants more than themselves, who teach the material as it is in the syllabus (AKA give people what they paid for), but also get experienced and knowledgeable folks who can tie the material and simulations of Wood Badge to the actual thing in a unit. Then there's having the logistics aspects (FOOD) on point, and a trained staff that doesn't kill braincells via powerpoint. There is room in each course syllabus to add little local flavors to things, if those are things that further the goals of the course. I wish there was more skills training at Wood Badge, but that's beyond my scope of control, so I won't hold that against the current course. This is all predicated on a WB or NYLT staff having the right intentions. I helped my staff do interviews for our upcoming NYLT course. We had one Scout who interviewed, and much of the time he talked about how being on staff would benefit him, not how he'd help others by being on staff. Very similar to some adults who want to staff WB/NYLT staff so they can get their 3rd bead. The SPL for our course will pick his staff with his ASPLS, but I'll strongly encourage him to avoid folks like that. Yes being on staff will help the staffers, but that's a secondary effect, not a primary reason. The participants are the primary reason. If our course staffs have the right intentions, much of the rudeness, the lack of "walking the walk", and the special club nature of things should lessen. As I said in my earlier post. Humility, friendliness, helpfulness, knowledge are what we need out of WB or NYLT staff. By and large most of the staff I've worked with are those kind of people, but I also know a few staffers who were not. They were caught up in Wood Badge as an end, not WB as a means to an end. All of us as Scouters are ambassadors for Scouting, whether we realize it or not. When other people know we are Scouters, that colors their perception of Scouting. The same is true of Wood Badge. We are ambassadors for the course, and other people's perceptions of that are based of how we act and treat others. My council: My council NYLT and WB leadership has the right idea. They know that the courses exist to serve the units. Particularly NYLT has gone through a culture shift over the last 5 years as the folks who'd made it a good ole boys club have been put out to pasture. We've done quite a bit to break up stale cultures. Scouters can only be a Scoutmaster/Course director twice. Youth can only be SPL once. SPL's can only choose one staffer to be ASPL that they staffed with the previous year. We don't have as formal a rule on the adult side, but due to a shortage of adults volunteering for NYLT, we don't exactly need one. This has gone a long way to break up clics in our NYLT program. I'm not sure whats in place for our WB program, but I think it's similar. My council also doesn't allow a Scouter to staff Wood Badge and NYLT in the same year, in order to keep a handful of folks from controlling both programs. We're definitely not perfect, but I know things have improved quite a bit from where they were a few years ago culture wise. Another thing that helps in my council is we have an annual Wood Badge dinner. We pair it with a dinner at a NYLT development weekend. It serves a few purposes. It helps us advertise NYLT to troop leadership. It helps us recruit adults to NYLT staff (since most folks at the dinner are Wood Badgers.) It's also an opportunity to do a mass beading ceremony in front of people who won't be bored and it won't hijack another event. I got my beads there, because I knew my Scouts from my Troop wouldn't really care, and my Wood Badge Scoutmaster had a habit for being long-winded. We also do some silent auctioning of Scouting and WB items, the money goes to scholarships for NYLT and Wood Badge. Again, just my opinions and experiences, Feel free to agree or disagree. I like the feedback. As an ASM of program for an NYLT course this year, it gives me things to be on the lookout for in how we sell WB/NYLT and how we train the staff.
  2. Sentinel947

    I HATE the new YPT rules

    Absolutely. My comment here has some bolding for emphasis and clarity. As a lot of Wood Badgers in my area like to say "Feedback is a gift." I've actually really enjoyed this thread, because it gives me things to look for in my own Councils' NYLT and Wood Badge programs. Obviously not all these critiques apply to every Wood Badger or every Wood Badge program, but it's still great feedback. I obviously can't speak for every Council, but I think mine has a decent handle on some of these things with our Wood Badge and NYLT programs. I definitely do see some of these critiques in my council. To summarize: Lack of humility Being dismissive of non Woodbadgers/NYLT Treating other Wood Badgers poorly. Co-opting other events to do Wood Badge stuff. Frankly the youth don't care. I know I didn't when I was a Scout. Not "Walking the Walk" Hazing of participants. Stealing items, singing for lost items, talking smack about people. Inside jokes in public. -The Critter song, Beading ceremonies are examples of this. Not using the stuff taught in Wood Badge in their units. Any Wood Badge graduate who is not attempting to use the patrol method in their troop should "retire". Being one of those who just sits around at council/district events and act like an authority figure. Sales tactics Overselling/over pushing Wood Badge/NYLT. -Guilt tripping. Being secretive about the course vs transparent. It's a training course, not a secret fraternity. There are two different types of Scouters that dislike Wood Badge I think. Their reasons are similar, but not the same. Type one are the ones on this forum, are the kind that have been treated poorly by Wood Badge folks, and they have a the right ideas on how to run their troops anyways. Wood Badge is already preaching to the choir for them. So it's less about the material and more about the time the program takes, the fact they won't learn much from it, and that the Wood Badge folks in their area aren't good ambassadors for the program. The second type are folks who are out running their own programs, not a Scout troop. They look as Wood Badge as threatening because it'll contradict their own little fiefdoms. These folks are going to be really rare on a forum like this, because they already think they know everything. It's critical not to lump type 1 and type 2 together. Like most things in life, the way to fix the divide between type one people and Wood Badge is for us as Wood Badge folks to listen seriously to their concerns, and do our best to adapt our behavior. Ultimately, Type 1 and Wood Badge folks are on the same side. We have the same goals for the program, so to let a training course get in the way of that is really shortsighted. One of the best Assistant Scoutmaster I had as a youth never went to Wood Badge. He was to put off by the behavior of some of the staff. The best form of advertising of most things is for it to perform. For Wood Badge, that means that we're helpful to other scouters, we run our troops according to the principles we promote, and that we're humble, friendly and encouraging, vs acting like elitists. There's so much more I could probably say on this topic, but I don't want to make this comment even longer and harder to read.
  3. Sentinel947

    I HATE the new YPT rules

    I've completed NYLT (2009), and Wood Badge (2015) and also served as adult staff on NYLT(2018). They are incredibly similar courses. Their content is similar. Where they differ (or should if they're done right) is the mindset the participant should be in. NYLT a Scout is supposed to live the life of a scout in a model troop and participate in the activities that challenge them and their patrol. Wood Badge is similar, but it's more about witnessing and participating in how a model troop is run, and the presentations are tied back to how adults can coach youth in leading the troop. Wood Badge in 2015 was a great chance for me to review the things I'd learned at NYLT and how they applied to me as an adult working with youth, instead of the soon to be SPL I was back in 2009. I'm excited to be sharing that experience with another great group of staff and participants in 2019. To be frank, we're fighting an uphill battle here. The reality is new adult leaders do not go straight off to the training. They enter a cub scout pack or boy scout troop, and that is there default experience against which they view any subsequent training. If that adult was a Scout in their youth, than they are also viewing the training through the prism of their own scout experience (for better or for worse.) When I took Scoutmaster Specific Training and IOLs in 2012, I was basically able to teach IOLS (and did help the instructor.) Scoutmaster Fundamentals was a revelation for me, because I realized how much room my troop had for improvement from the adult side of the program. It was a pretty good troop when I was growing up, but it's patrol method was lacking ( and in many ways still is, despite many efforts over the last 6 years.) If a leader is not the Scoutmaster, they are pretty powerless to effect change in a unit, they can only influence through persuasion. Then there is a ton of friction and challenge to getting an organizations adults and scouts to accept a change AND get it to stick. Many leaders are going into Boy Scout Troops where the patrol method is only given lip service, and where the Scouts are executing the plans of adults (best case scenario). Worst case it's a camping club with scout advancement run by adults. Even the best training is going to have an uphill battle against that kind of ingrained expectations. In places where training isn't well done, or the trainers aren't strong, knowledgeable, or helpful, I'm not really sure what impact changing the training would have.
  4. Sentinel947

    I HATE the new YPT rules

    So they utterly missed the fact that the staff is roleplaying the role of scouts and not adults? 🙃
  5. It's important to have these reminders. We tend to get so invested in chasing the ideal of what we want for our troops and scouts, we miss the really important stuff that is going well. The last couple months of scouting for me have been somewhat stressful as I help the new Scoutmaster transition into his role. Its important to come to terms with what we can control and what we just need to stop worrying about.
  6. Came across this article while I was scrolling through my LinkedIn today. https://www.inc.com/marcel-schwantes/this-rarely-seen-leadership-practice-is-now-linked-to-happier-workplaces-motivated-employees-says-research.html I think it nicely supports a good deal of what we try to teach our Scouts about being kind to others and servant leadership.
  7. Sentinel947

    Adult Supervision for Online Communications

    I won't go that far. I've met a few really passionate and wonderful pros. What the YPT rules on communication lack is nuance. Should adults monitor a troop facebook page? Yes. I doubt any of us argue that. If there is a facebook or groupme or group text for the plc should troop adults be in on that? Yea. If the Scouts make some impromptu group to just shoot the breeze, should adults be in on that? The rules are well intentioned and say yes, but now I'm sitting monitoring the random thoughts of my scouts 24/7. Or they'll ignore the group and chat elsewhere since adults are in the chat. If the SPL texts his ASPLs about the meeting this week, should I be in it? According to the rules, yes, but I never insist on that. My troop wouldn't be able to operate without email. We teach our scouts to always copy two leaders or their parents when they write to leaders, and we do the same for when we write to them. Any adult who emails them privately is being questionable. Where does the troop end and teenagers being friends begin?
  8. Sentinel947

    Adult Supervision for Online Communications

    I vote to leave it alone. It isn't something that requires adult supervision.
  9. Sentinel947

    Scouting Rediscovered

    Looks like his website is now down. Enoch posted on Facebook about it, looking to get it back up at some point.
  10. I'm an ASM: My Troop's meetings are 1.5 hours a week. So lets say a typical month has 4 meetings. 6 hours a month. I also attend the PLC meetings. 1 hour once a month. Running tally: 7 hours a month. Our monthly outings run Friday at 5:30 pm till about noon on Sundays. 49.5 hours a month. I probably spent about a half-hour to a hour a week responding to emails, various questions, or coaching the new Scoutmaster, whether before, after, or outside of a meeting. Final total: 51.5 hours a week. Things I also do but can't really get a good handle on due to variability: Eagle Project Coach, Eagle Scout Projects, Eagle Scout COH's. Our troop has ranged from 4 Eagles to 12 Eagles in a year. I also support one of our other ASMs who handles high adventure by being an extra adult on backpacking trips. That's typically 3 times a year. Another 42-45 hours a month when those happen. I'm sure I'm missing things. The key, whether an ASM or SM is to build up some extra help if that's possible. No ASM or SM should need to go to every event the troop puts on. It will burn them out. If the leader has a family, they feel pressure to be at everything, and that may compromise their relationship with their spouse or kids... which is horrible.
  11. Hey all, I attended a Course Directors Conference recently. I'm a backup course director for a NYLT course in 2019. One of the Pros from Irving was there so I was able to ask some of our favorite topics of conversation. I've figured we mostly had answers to these questions, but it's good to hear it straight out of the horses mouth so to speak. I've summarized his answers below. I was impressed by him. I was surprised National sent a pro from Irving out to Midwest on a Saturday, and he was at the event all day, and being available for 1 on 1 face-time. He had some real enthusiasm and energy. He was unapologetic about the changes to include girls, which was mostly preaching to the choir at a NYLT/Wood Badge CDC at this point. He said there have been about 40,000 girls into Cub Scouts this year. I'm not sure how that lines up with other numbers being reported. He also mentioned the program as "Scouts BSA" a few times, so I'm not sure when that nomenclature is going to take over. Q1. Asked about how the BSA decided on the two year separation rule in the recently updated YPT. 1 a.: Said the rule was created based on data provided by law enforcement, schools, incident reports from councils and information collected during calls to the Scouts First Hotline. I figured that was the case, so I'm glad there's some statistical backing to it. Q2. Changes to Wood Badge Syllabus, will those of us who took WB21 be expected to retake the new course? 2a. No. The changes are an update to the WB21 course, not a total rewrite. The material in the current WB is still useful and valid training, they're just tweaking it a bit. Other interesting tidbit is that there is an updated version of the "Time to Tell" videos in the works. I remember watching those back in 2005. He stressed to us that the next big focus of YPT is preventing Peer to Peer abuse between Scouts. National is pretty concerned about it. Most of our training and discussion about YPT focused on that peer to peer abuse aspect (maybe because we've had over a decade to figure out the whole adult to youth protection aspects of YPT.) Overall, the CDC was well done, and since it was my first one, I found it informative and helpful. I'm not sure I'll feel the same if I have to keep going to more of them in the future.
  12. Sentinel947

    Targeting Boy with False Allegations

    If you write a blog post online accusing me by name of a crime I didn't commit, couldn't I sue you? Not sure if it's "defamation" or if it's a different word.
  13. Sentinel947

    Eagle Scout Extension for new 2019 Scouts

    Maybe its just local conditions. I'm 25. When former Scouts visit our childhood troop, they say hi to me, and after observing they almost always joke: "Wow, things really haven't changed much." They're both right and wrong. I think the BSA as an organization has changed quite a bit. I feel like that pace of change has accelerated. But I still recognize the BSA from when I joined back in 2005. My Troop hasn't changed much from all these policy changes. Requirements change, uniforms change, membership policies change, but the core activities and methods of Scouting haven't changed in my little pocket of Scouting, and I'm going to my best to keep it that way. We all have breaking points and decision points for our membership. I won't curse folks on their way out. I won't hassle newer folks who are coming in fresh. God only knows when I hit mine. Whether it's policies we don't like, life circumstances, or just aging, we all eventually leave the program.
  14. Sentinel947

    Eagle Scout Extension for new 2019 Scouts

    They'll need to be counted as adults for YPT if they are "participants" after 18 in my understanding of YPT. But this is only going to be a situation that will last until 2021. At that point there won't be any Scouts who qualify and are working their requirements under this extension.
  15. Sentinel947

    Eagle Scout Extension for new 2019 Scouts

    It seems to me that the extension will only be long enough to give them the amount of time necessary to earn Eagle depending on the date that they join. I'd guess it'd be enough to give them the minimum amount of time needed to earn Eagle from Scout-Eagle. "The actual extension will be based upon the individual’s registration date and age at the time of the request and will provide not more than twenty-four months from the date of initial registration to complete all requirements." My amateur guess is if they join at 17 years old and 11 months, they'll get the full 23/24 months, and it'll scale back from there to 16 years and no months. My troop isn't supporting a Troop for girls at this time, so this scenario is going to be exceedingly rare for us.
  16. Sentinel947

    What is the future of Training?

    For a medical inhaler? That's terrible. At least in my council, I never saw that behavior at Wood Badge, and it's prohibited at NYLT, at least the courses I've staffed. Again proof that training results vary from place to place, and having taken Wood Badge doesn't automatically confer some special expert status on a Scouter.
  17. If you do not attend a church, you could use a parent. My Scouts commonly use the troop chaplain. I used the facilitator that led the classes for my youth religious medal program in Scouts.
  18. Sentinel947

    Oct 1, 2018 - GSS ends Patrol Method?

    There's only so much retraining you can do with older Scouts. I try to avoid telling stories about my troop, because every situation is unique, so there's a chance this can't be replicated. I joined my Troop in 2005 as a new Scout. The Scoutmaster at that time was finishing up his Scoutmastership and was done by 2007. He had us running a great patrol method troop. He was a stern but fair man, and what he excelled at was giving youth leadership room to make their plans and fail or succeed. He was always available to coach the youth, and if the SPL wanted to, he'd have weekly phone calls with the SPL to walk through the meeting and guide the SPL in making a meeting plan. In 2007 one of the committee members took over as Scoutmaster. He was a good man, but he didn't know the behind the scenes aspects of being a Scoutmaster, and when the troop program started to disintegrate without the coaching from Scoutmaster 1, he ended up consolidating things onto the SPL and the adults. The Troop lost most of the it's patrol method aspects (like patrol boxes) aka "The Boys can't be trusted to keep their dishes clean, so we need the Quartermasters to be able to review all the dishes." We went along with this "Troop Method." system the rest of my time as a Scout. I went to NYLT and became SPL in 2009. NYLT was shocking to me and it struck a fire in me. I wanted my troop to be like my NYLT troop. I wanted the autonomy, I wanted the patrol culture and camaraderie that I felt at NYLT. Scoutmaster 2 didn't really understand what went on at NYLT, and 16 year old me wasn't good at selling my ideas to skeptical adults. My initiatives weren't supported, and being 16, I wasn't able to carry them across the finish line myself. I floated into a JASM role after my term, and I spent the next two years helping following SPL's tinker around the edges of our program. In 2012 Scoutmaster 2 stepped down, and the Committee Chair at the time became Scoutmaster 3. He was even more green to the Boy Scout program than Scoutmaster 2. Most of the ASM group had left when Scoutmaster 2 did, since their sons were all around the same age. The Scoutmaster group dwindled to our Scoutmaster 3, and 3 ASMS, two of which had sons in junior year of high school and weren't around as much. At that point, I was 18-19 years old, and was still hanging around the troop to help my younger friends earn their Eagle. Long story short, I became an ASM because I was around. I spent much of my time coaching the SPL as I had done as a senior scout. I did my best to start selling patrol method ideas with Scoutmaster 3, but he still didn't "get it" until about 2014 when his son went to NYLT. It was really a metaphorical lightbulb moment for him. All the gibberish that I'd been trying to do clicked. We had a group of 5 Scouts that were in the same grade and became SPL's back to back for 2.5 years including Scoutmaster 3s son. Scoutmaster 3 and I started working with those 5 youth, all NYLT trained, to start putting the pieces back together on the patrol method. Some of the older Scouts and adults resisted. They didn't see the point or they thought it would take away from advancement, or being unsafe, or other stuff like that. I actually went to a Committee meeting and basically did a Patrol Method presentation to get buy in from them. Our youth sold their peers for the most part. From 2014-2016 the troop really ran itself thanks to those older Scouts. Scoutmaster 3 and I went to Wood Badge together 2015. We started building an ASM culture that would support the patrol method. This year, 2018, Scoutmaster 3 stepped down. His son had aged out in 2017, and it was time to pass the torch. Scoutmaster 4 has been in the job for a few months, but our culture we've created has made him far ahead of where Scoutmaster 2 and 3 were when they started. We still have a great ASM team in place for at least another year, and we're actively hunting the next generation to join us. Our youth leadership is engaged, but there are always challenges with youth, that don't go away. Even with a youth lead troop running the patrol method, it's not all rainbows and unicorns. (I just got home from a Troop meeting.) So @AltadenaCraig for your troop. Don't abandon those older Scouts. They really don't know what they are missing, or what it will mean for them. They're like adults often are, resistant to change. You'll need to sell them. The same goes for adults. Adults are key, because they can block your progress either overtly or on accident. Keep building that nucleus you have with your younger scouts. When they hit the leadership positions in your troop, the dam will break, and progress will catapult forward. I don't like this story because I feel like I'm tooting my own horn to much. It's not about me really, other than I had the vision and sold others on it.It's not than NYLT is some magic bullet, although it was certainly part of what fast-tracked us. The takeaway I want you to get from this is that there's a broader framework to this. Sell your adults. Find your older Scouts that will buy in, keep developing the patrol method with your younger Scouts. Start building that culture. Sell your vision to anybody that will stand to listen. It will take time. My Troop is finally hitting where I'd like it to be after we started putting the pieces together in 2014. If you're the Scoutmaster, you've already got a big part of it down. If your an ASM, you have an additional hurdle to clear to sell the Scoutmaster first. I'm happy to share some documents I've written with you, have a phone call to discuss. PM me if you'd like.
  19. It only has a negative connotation that you give to it. Religious practice is absolutely made up of behaviors. Religion or lack their of is a choice. It is a behavior. It is based of our feelings and ideas about life and our purpose for living. To suggest otherwise is to suggest we do not have free will in life. That our lives are the outcome of genetically determined sequences that we have no control over and that's all we'll ever be. One's sexual preferences are not a choice in my opinion. But what behaviors I engage in because of those preferences are a choice.
  20. Sentinel947

    Simply falling behind or is it more complicated?

    Nursing and HR as well. I've always worked on Female majority HR departments since I graduated from College. Most of my supervisors have been female. Not necessarily good or bad, just is what it is.
  21. Sentinel947

    Oct 1, 2018 - GSS ends Patrol Method?

    That's in theory how the program is supposed to run. Boy Scouting age 11-14, Venturing 14-age out. As other's have said, if you're going to run your unit(s) that way, you need to go all in. Venturing is about leadership, and the youth really drive that program, even more so than boy scouts. A crew really is a separate unit from the Scout troop. What you're really looking for is engaging your older Scouts. @Eagledad talks about better in his posts than I ever can. I wrote out multiple paragraphs, and they were basically saying the same thing Eagledad was, just longer and less concise. This paragraph in particular jumped out to me: It's really easy in theory. It's hard in practice. Most Scouters know that it's a program designed to teach Scouts character and leadership, by allowing them to be with their friends, camp in the outdoors, work on service projects, challenge themselves and develop their troop/patrol. So why is this so hard? Well, because it's unnatural. Scouts don't always have the leadership skills or the camping skills and need to be trained and developed. Adults are also often missing those skills, and are supposed to mentor and coach youth to have those skills, some of which they don't have either. In short it comes down to training/coaching (this often is informal rather than formal) the older scouts, listening to them about what they want to achieve for the troop, and giving them the support for them to lead. Part of why older boys flock to Sports and band and ditch scouts is that many scout troops never leave stage 1 or 2. The program becomes about advancing 11-12 year olds, and the older boys aren't allowed to take the lead on the program and challenge their skills and leadership, so they go find something more challenging. So we're back to my original question @AltadenaCraig. We have these training curriculum for Scouters, but getting a youth lead, patrol method troop still seems to be alluding us. Where's the gap and how can we fill it? Maybe we're all overthinking things to some extent. It's hard to give advice for other people's troops, because I don't know your Scouts or their parents. Happy to give my two cents if you think of something.
  22. Sentinel947

    Scoutmaster Transition

    Our Troop has selected a new SM to start May 2018. As an ASM, one of the longest tenured members of the troop, how can I help this new SM transition? What advice do you have for troops transitioning SMs.
  23. The more things change, the more they remain the same. Welcome back.
  24. Sentinel947

    BSA: The POLARIS Method

    Granted. I guess I should say, in my unit, it's a total non factor, our Scouts have a harder time following it than our leaders. Parents are supportive.
  25. Sentinel947

    BSA: The POLARIS Method

    How about a little more patrol method out of national? 😂
×