Eagle94-A1

At least in my neck of the woods, because of COVID folks are getting OUSTIDE! Demand for camping has skyrocketed. One annual event done at a nearby state park had to be moved to to the local Scout Camp because they were all booked up. After talking to parents, we limited activities to a 1 hour drive one way. For camping purposes only 3 camps are in that circle. 2 of them are state parks and booked solid. The other is the local Scout Camp. That scout camp has been well used by us, including 2020 summer camp. Since June, we have gone back to normal trips, but finding camps is tough. August did not happen as the Scouts did not want to go to the local camp for the 6th time and all camps were booked up. We had to drive 4 hours to the September camp out because none closer had openings. And apparently we are not the only ones having camping issues. The district camporee this month has 5 units from outside the district coming, which is unheard of. We had one unit contact us about tagging along because they could not find anyplace to camp. We opened it up to any troop. Now we have concerns on where we are going to put everyone. I wonder where they are going to get the stats for that? I know the local camp, which is normally the most used, took a major hit in 2019 due to the road being washed out and the camp being closed for 9 months while it was repaired. And 2020 hurt as well due to COVID. Heck asking a parent do drive a kid 45 minutes round trip to a day camp can not be feasible for some parents. We had to encourage packs to carpool to drop off Cubs.

Stupid question but here it goes. Who would be responsible legally for future abuse if BSA does adopt the outside group's YP policies?

Correct, Meant DO NOT....

First and foremost, CONTACT YOUR DE ASAP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They have all the tools and resources needed to start a new units. Second, DO LET THE DE TAKE ANY SHORTCUTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There is a 12 step process to starting a new unit. It is extremely time consuming, and DEs are under pressure to get it going ASAP. I took me 6 months one time to get a unit started, and I was under constant pressure by my bosses to hurry it up. Supposedly it takes a minimum of 2 months, but iof you want the unit to last, TAKE YOUR TIME. Third, You can guide and mentor, BUT DO NOT TAKE ANY ADDITIONAL RESPONSIBILITIES!!!!!!! Being in charge in one unit is hard. Being in 2 different units with 2 different COs is a major PITA and can lead to a FUBAR experience. Been there, done that, got the patches and loops, and had one unit's t-shirt.. Good luck

I think it depends upon the camp. I know one council has fudged attendance numbers and costs to make the most used camp in the council seem to be the least used and most costly. When questioned where they got the stats from, we discovered that A) They included an emergency capital expense in their maintenance expenses which they later admitted they should not have included. B) they included only those folks who paid to use the camp (our council has a program where if you do a variety of things, you can use council camps for free for unit events, which many units take advantage), so the actual usage was significantly lower according to the camp ranger and still not known to the rank and file, and C) used the abridged attendance numbers above for the year that the camp was closed for over 9 months for the emergency capital expense repair. When volunteers protesting the number on the teleconference did their own calculations using the prior year's abridged numbers and maintenance costs (the year without the emergency repairs and the camp open the full year, but still without the actual full attendance numbers) the costs to operate the camp was approx. $11/person. There is speculation that if the actual attendance numbers were used, the camp is actually supporting the other camps in the council. Yet no major work has been done at the camp in years. Local OA chapters have done all the repairs and maintenance, including some major work like shelter building. The council has made all kinds of excuses to do needed construction work at this camp. Speculation is that they have been trying to sell the camp for years, but one major donor to the council made the camp a condition of his donations. Not that he passed away, no telling what will happen.

My concern is the 7 month transition. It needs to be the standard year, if not longer. ESPECIALLY if the rumors that council's have to formally approve the MBC are true. It will take time in some rural, geographically large councils yo get the approved MBCs in place.

TECHNICALLY you need to do trail meals requiring no refrigeration for Cooking MB. "6d While on a trail hike or backpacking trip, prepare and serve two meals and a snack from the menu planned for this requirement. At least one of those meals must be cooked over a fire, or an approved trail stove (with proper supervision).**" How folks are earning it at summer camp, I wonder.

So she did change the name from Guides to Scouts? Just confirms that she was piggybacking on Boy Scouts with the name change.

Probably because most troops car camp. I hate to say it, but BSA has changed requirements to make it easier. If you don't believe me, take a look at the Cub Scout Program. In June 2015, they completely revamped the Cub Scout program. From January to May, the RTs were focusing on the changes. Those packs that were prepared had no major problems with the changes. The packs that didn't send folks to RTs freaked out, and in December 2016, less than 2 years into the new program, they changed requirements to make things easier due to complaints. Ditto with Scouting. From circa June 2016 until some time in 2017, in order to get First Class, you had to go on 6 camp outs, not 4. There were complaints about that, and they changed it back to 4. This really irked middle son because he had to wait for 6 campouts to be done before getting First Class. They changed the rul about 1 month or two after he earned it.

BP called them Girl Guides, and that is what they are still called in many places. Low, and others, used the term Scouts to piggyback on the PR of Boy Scouts.

Yes, BSA is LYING about Dodgeball. The Ban went into effect in 2018, and even after the Dodgeball ban, you could still find Dodgeball and several variants on scouting.org website as recommended games.

Another aspect of that was to gain legitimacy in the eyes of the community. BSA as a nascent organization had many competitors. The belief was that by partnering with local, established organizations to charter troops, they would have some credibility and legitimacy over the competitors. One reason why GSUSA did not use the CO model was that they were piggybacking on BSA's name. The only serious competitor to GSUSA was Campfire Girls. One of the reasons why West was adamant about GSUSA changing their name to Girl Guides was because he did not want confusion. My how times have changed At least in the units I was in that I did not know anyone prior to joining, I was being vetted. I had references checked, AND in one case a background check done, prior to my application being submitted to council for BSA's background check. Even with the one hands off unit I was with, the CC or CM was checking references.

Yep. BSA has always said as long as I can remember that they got your back. Now we are learning otherwise

Questions. 1. Is it a volunteer or a professional? 2. Are they a voting member of the Council and District?

If you mandate, you will lose volunteers and members. Do we need anymore bad publicity and membership loses. Also there is no panacea for COVID. Consulting with physcians AND doing your own, legitimate research ( medlineplus.gov for general info; https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/ for the primary sources) Research is ongoing on vaccines. And there are questions about the efficacy of them. Google Israel and COVID if you do not believe me. And before anyone says I am an antivaxer, not only has everyone in my immediate family been vaccinated, but also my wife is now staffing on the COVID floor at her hospital. Informed decisions on this is important.

Yep, consider the source. For Kosnoff, anything but the complete dissolution of the BSA and local council will be considered a "sell out."

I know my DE was just informed that 2 COs with 5 units told their unit leaders that they will no longer charter Scouting. 1 CO wants them gone completely, and will not even do a usage agreement.

Pretty much spot on. I know I made some comments at roundtable when the topic came up, and everyone, including the DE, was listening. At a district meeting with council folks in attendance who signed the NDA, I estimated how much my council will owe, based upon what I have gleamed here. Their eyes expressed shock that I knew as much as I did.

UNDERSTATEMENT! Don't get me started on this. You really see the difference when it comes to retention at the Scouts BSA level.

I cannot say anything about Lions, but from working with my 3 boys from Tigers, it is extremely exhausting for adults. The Den Leader is the toughest volunteer position, bar none. I was a denleader for 6 years and was burnt out on Cubs. I have been involved with troop 7 years now, and no burn out yet. Prior to Oldest becoming a Tiger, I volunteered with troops, OA, and the district for 9 years, and no burn out. As for the Scouts, they are ready and chomping at the bit to Cross Over. 4th grade is when the transition to Scouts begins, at least according to the old BSA Literature as I am told that is no longer the case with the current literature, They were ready, willing and able to cross over. But I trained my Webelos DL replacements the way I was trained.

My camp growing up had a very good relationship with the 4th Marine Division and the National Guard. I remember Shooting Sports had Marines running the ranges, and our health lodge was staffed by either Navy corpsman or NG medics. Bet it helps having the CG on your executive board.

It's 12 Steps And here is a link from SCOUTING WIRE. Some of the steps utilized Commissioner Corps, but if you don't have an active one, you gotta do it yourself. Now I remember why I thought it was 10, steps 11 and 12 I normally did not do. Usually my District Commissioner did those. That's because I did get reprimanded for going to the meetings and presenting the charter to my first pack, which was chartered by my church's Knights of Columbus Council. When I did show up to help out, it was a CO's member, and not as a Scouter. https://scoutingwire.org/marketing-and-membership-hub/new-unit-development/the-new-unit-organization-process/ This document looks like it has the 12 steps in it, and more. https://www.scouting.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/10/522-025-Unit-Roadmap-Final.pdf

Yes, the whole time. As @InquisitiveScouter said, they are on call the entire time. And may you never have to get up at 1:30 in a thunderstorm doing a lost camper drill because 2 nuckleheads decided to sneak back to the man camp.

You would be surprised. Some folks think that what they did 15, 20 years ago would affect them still.

At least in my case the unit committees checked the references. In one case, they even did a background check, bu the SM was a LEO and had access to that info. Only 3 units did not check my references: the troop I grew up in, the troop my older two sons were in, and my current troop. BUT then again, I personally knew everyone in the troop, and used them as the references. Actually the unit that did the background check on me was chartered by my Catholic Church. I showed up to a meeting the second week in town. Before they turned in the app to council, the SM checked me out.