Eagle94-A1

Regarding why districts are failing, in some cases you got longtime volunteers who have been ignored and abused by pros, and they are fed up with it. They are told they will be treated differently by the new pros, but it is the same old, same old.

While the Cubs may be gone, You have a few, and I stress a FEW, who still treat the Webelos/AOL program like it was originally intended to be: a transition program from Cubs to Scouts. Usually those Cub Scout Leaders are long time Cub Scout leader who were Cub Scout basic Leader trained, or newer leaders who have either trained under, or been mentored by, older Leaders who have been around a while. IMHO, the training for WDLs is the problem as I got rid of that information.

Sadly I know several councils where numbers were fudged. Heck one SE and DFS had a reputation for doing this, and using the DEs as scapegoats to get out of trouble. It was so well known that I was warned to watch my back with them by a SE I knew. As @Ojomanstated, if you want to kill your career in Scouting, be a whistleblower. I have met pros, really good ones IMHO, that found some shady stuff, reported, and were penalized.

If you look at how the pre-2015 structure was created, as well as the older pre- CS Position Specific Training syllabus circa 2007 and older, Webelos was created and expanded to an 18-24 month program with the purpose of preparing them for Scouts. Parents no longer signed off on advancement, guest experts in different Activity Badges were recommended to come in a teach a few meetings to simulate MBCs, utilizing the Patrol Method with a Denner with duties, wearing the Patrol medallion instead of den number etc. When they went from CS Basic Leader training, a day long class covering all p

That is IF, and I stress IF, they kept the records and/or the records have not been lost or damaged. For my troop's 100th anniversary, we wanted names of all SMs. We had most of them, but not all of them. My council did not have the records.

Me neither. Our area is as rural one, with a high poverty rate. Median income is barely over poverty levels. If I had to pay for all three hoodlums, and myself, I could not afford the program, and I drank the council Flavor-aid when they were Cubs. Over $500 on national and council fees alone, then add $180 for pack fees. And I am not including uniforms. The new fees will definitely shrink the program. I am not big into Sea Scouts as I used to be, but up until a few years back, national only supplied patches, not uniform shirts and pants. Why someone said Sea Scouts wore "P

We have not had a feeder pack in about 12 years. Our Scouts recruited by word of mouth, and until recently most Scouts transferred from other troops in the area. We went from48+ back then, to 7 currently on the charter, and one of those ages out this year. We will not be folding this year, but it may happen next year. Because we have not been able to recruit in the schools, we are down to 2 packs in my county. 26 years ago when I first moved here, 10 active packs in the county. We had 11 active troops in the county, with 24-48 scouts each. we are down to 7 troops, with 6-24 scouts each.

Going back to the 1980s and earlier. On a different note, from everything I am hearing, packs are already doing this essentially. Watch retention at the Scout level continue to drop.

In the pre-2015 program, as soon as a Webelos den completed the Webelos Rank, they began work on the AOL. The entire reason why BSA went from a 9-12 month Webelos program in the 1980s and earlier to the 18-24 month program was because studies showed it took the Webelos, and their parents, that look understand the differences between Cubs Scouts and Boy Scouts. I am friends with one of the 411 committee members that came up with the current program design. I asked can we still start working on AOL as soon as they completed Webelos, and was told yes, they shorted the number of required acti

If you read the older literature, I would say pre-2008 but I do not remember exactly when it went from Cub Scout Basic Leader Training to Cub Scout Specific Training, parents are not "do most of the work anyway." Rather they are suppose to start backing off, starting in 4th grade, and let the Cubs do more and more. It was recommended that Parents do not even sign off on advancement. Sadly I am seeing this more and more. Only packs with WDLs with the older training are doing it they way I was trained. Forgot to add, they have better retention in Scouts. I had a similar exp

Unless things have changed in 4 years since I was involved with Cubs, BSA offered all kinds of resources for Den Leaders. In addition to training, there was a "Program Helps" which contained den lesson plans for each meeting. They were great for new leaders as they provided information for everything you needed. As you got more comfortable as a leader, you could use it for a basis for the meeting, then expand up on the literature. Those books were so popular that I had folks from other youth organizations buying them to get ideas for their meetings. As for people, that is what Roundtable

Regarding Pack Fees and Webelos 2s/AOLS, The pack I was did it two ways. The older two were not charged anything except national fee, which transfered over to the troop, Since they were leaving in December and January respectively. Youngest was charged a pack fee, but that was the cost of their AOL plaques in February. They got really, really nice ones.

No offense taken. Just wanted folks to know that volunteers were involved who actually talked to folks in the field. I was NOT (emphasis) part of the committee, but a friend was, and he got a lot, and I do mean A LOT (emphasis) of input. He was an involved Cub Scout leader for a while, but moved up to Scouts before being on the Cub Scout Committee. So he had knowledge, skills, and experience. He also knew enough that just because one council did it a certain way, doesn't mean that is the only way to do things. Glad to hear it about CASTAWAY. That was the highlight of my middle

From the Guide for Officers and Advisers. Adult membership qualifications. All members of, or candidates for membership in, the Orderof the Arrow who are 21 years of age or older and who are registered members of the Boy Scouts of America shall be considered adult members or candidates for adult membership. Individuals shall be selected as candidates based on the following: 1. Adult leaders in units: Each year, upon holding a unit election for youth candidates that results in at least one youth candidate being elected, the unit committee may nominate registered unit adult

Thank You @RememberSchiff. It is sad when I get information faster her and other social media than through my council.

The original version of the current program had a committee of volunteers working on it for over 2 year ( I thinkit was closer to 4)and getting input from other volunteers in the field. If you pack likes boating activities, or your Webelos/AOLs like the CASTAWAY ADVENTURE, you're welcome. I was the one that reminded a committee member that Cubs could only do boating activities at council event s at the time. And I talked up how my troop growing up used wilderness survival as a recruiting tool. As for the hoopla, prior to June 2015, you had to earn the Bobcat and Webelos Ranks in order t

This part really concerns me. I see very few packs in my council actually making 4th Grade the beginning of the transition. I blame current training on it because there is no longer an emphasis on beginning the transition in Webelos. The pack that begins transitioning in 4th grade has a better retention rate on Scouts than the one that waits until 5th grade in my area. The third pack does not begin transition until 5th grade, and does not Cross Over until August of their 6th grade year. While I honestly think that is too late, their troop's retention rate is higher than the one that w

Here is the link to the info. https://www.scouting.org/program-updates/cub-scout-program-updates-announced/ The four areas of improvement are the Bobcat badge, Cub Scout Adventures, Webelos, and Cub Scout Awards. Bobcat will no longer be a badge that is earned once when a Cub Scout joins. It will become a required Adventure for each rank and earned each year. The requirements for the Bobcat Adventure are different for each grade to make them age-appropriate. Cub Scout Adventures have been improved to make it easier to deliver the program to mult

My experience, and research done in the past points this out, Cubs who cross over no later than March tend to go to summer camp, which retains them longer. I grew up in the old 3 year Cub Scout Program, and when I crossed over to a troop, 1. My family could not afford the lump sum payment required to go to summer camp and 2. My mom did not know any of the Troop Scouters, and didn't feel comfortable letting me go even if they could afford it. And my parents weren't the only ones with these issues as the BSA's research in the late 1980s, early 1990s shows. This is why when BSA revamped the

As @MikeS72 points out "Be active in your Webelos den for at least six months since completing the fourth grade or for at least six months since becoming 10 years old." So the earliest based on Grade is December (BSA's computer system uses June 1 as the start of a school year, regardless of when they actually finish 4th grade). If you go by year, it is theoretically possible to move them up by March of their 4th grade year, And since Webelos is no longer required for Arrow of Light, you can immediately start work on AOL as soon as they turn 10. We did the following based upon the ol

One of the biggest concerns many parents have in my experience is camping. And now they cannot camp with Scouts, Sea Scouts, or Venturers as all adults MUST (emphasis)be registered. And even without the council add on fees, that can be prohibitive to some families. At least National listened to Cub Scout folks who stated that if the new rule applied to Cub Scout camping, it would destroy the program. I am glad family camping is still allowed without restrictions at the Cub level.

Thanks. I would bet a Dutch oven pizza that the cancellation of AOL and Crossover Ceremonies I a reason for the lack of interest in AIA.

I have been known to give people a second chance. But if my Scouts are saying something, I would listen. I have found that Scouts know more about what is going on with each other than adults do. If they are concerned. You should be too.

@mrjohns2Can you show me where that stat came from? Also Can you provide me the info from a NOAC for the 2018 NOAC? Also total attendance from 2018 and 2022 would be nice as well if possible I ask because 2018 was when National stated no more ceremonial regalia for AOL and Crossover Ceremonies, and mandated skits ceremonies that seemed more like commercials. This 2018 rule caused so much of a ruckus in my lodge that folks refused to do those ceremonies. I have stated that many folks get their interest in the OA from those ceremonies, and it would kill ceremonies over time.

One of the attorneys is on the record, specifically an NPR interview, stating he wants the BSA dissolved. One of the bankruptcy threads has a link to the 30 minute interview.