Eagle94-A1

My responses will be in red Partially. Summer Camp and COHs are joint troop activities. Mostly due to logistics and the fact that siblings and parents are in both troops. Otherwise the two troop are separate doing their own meetings and monthly activities. In fact the girls troop is more active than the boys. IMHO "coed troops" do more of a disserve to the boys than the girls. as noted above. In fact, the girls troop I know specifically does not do meetings and monthly trips with the boys troop because they are more of a hinderance than a help. The Boy's troop is not as organized, and the girls get frustrated. Eventually yes I do, especially as National keeps harping on "family scouting." Do not get me started on "family scouting." Girls' Troop need experienced Scouters with a youth background in the outdoor program who know how the program is supposed to be run and can implement it. Training can only go so far with new folks. Experienced Scouters willing to teach and mentor new Scouts is vital to a successful program. The troop I referenced above has that experienced SM ( he was my sons' old troop's SM until his daughter was able to join). The problem he is encountering is that NONE (emphasis) of his female ASMs has an outdoor background beyond family camping at the Cub Scout level. So not only is he working with his Scouts, but the adults as well.

I'm there with you. My only advice is: FOCUS ON YOUR SCOUTS! (emphasis, not shouting at ya.) I am once again involved at the district, for the moment, because my sons wanted me to run the district camporee so it would be fun. But once camporee is done, so am I at the district level. The council can merge with neighboring councils next year, sell/return to trusts the camps after my camporee for all I care (although I will miss the local one tremendously), but my focus is on my Scouts. As to why I am active here and a few other places, one reason is that I get more info here than from my council. Sad when you find out on Scouter.com what is going on and tell your DE, and he is absolutely clueless. Good luck.

WOW. I understood why my pack did not change to the December 2016 requirements as soon as it went into effect and waited until June 2016 when the Program Year ended. A) The Scouts were midway through their books, and changing requirements midyear was one one of the silliest things National did; B. the Webelos 2s/ AOLs had completed everything except one requirement for an elective AB that they needed to Cross Over and to make them change requirements midstream is not fair to them; and C) the new requirements would have required the pack to replan the rest of the year that was planned and advertised since August. Using the old requirements 3 years after they changed and new books have been published?

Sadly there is high recidivism in juveniles. Worked with adjudicated youths in the woods, and the results were mediocre. Under 60 percent did not get arrested again.

According to my old books, Wolf was 3rd grade, Bear was 4th Grade, Lion was 5th with Webelos being earned at the end of the year and you crossed over.

I can't believe anyone is saying they are getting off easy. In my neck of the woods, there are talks on losing 2 camps, not hiring needed staff, and possible multiple council mergers.

"FAMILY SCOUTING" IS NOT SCOUTING! I have seen "Family Scouting" first hand it nearly destroyed a troop. I have been a long time member of this organization. I will not be a member of any "family scouting" group. And how many families can afford those HA trips? I grew up in a poor family with an abusive father. The best thing he ever did was walk out on me. Scouting gave me opportunities I would never have had if he stayed around. More importantly Scouting gave me positive role models that influence me to this day. And I know I am not alone, I have worked with and mentored Scouts in similar or worse situations over the years. You cannot get the same experience with parents and siblings constantly interfering. Sorry for the rant, Those who read my post 3-4 years ago know all about the issues I had with "family scouting."

Fall 1982 Was when Tiger Cubs was introduced nationally, but it was an optional, separate program for second graders. They only wore an orange tshirt or sweatshirt, and they got iron on tiger paws. Cub Scouts was only 3 years: 3rd grade Wolves, 4th Grade Bears, and 5th Grade Webelos. Some time in the late 1980s, I think 1989, Tiger Cubs became part of Cub Scouts officially. In the 1990s, they turned Cub Scouts from a 4 year program (Grades 2-5), to a 5 year program ( Grade 1-5) because they realized 9-12 months was not enough time to transition. Then circa 2018 Lions came about. As for uniforms, August 1, 1984 was when the Tan and Green uniform with Cub Scout insignia was authorized. Although Dink and Duff in BOYS" LIFE introduced it in April or May of 1994. the published reason for the option was to allow those folks who outgrew their blue uniform the chance to save some money.

I would hope someone at every council who has access to the POC has gone through to see if anyone accused is still active and/or alive. T I admit I assumed victims would be questioned by law enforcement and notified about the arrests prior to them happening.

Is that not the case now? I know in my state, that is the case. Besides, didn't Kasnoff state BSA did not do enough in the past? Now tBSA is doing something, and he complains? Besides the complete dissolution of the BSA, what else does he want?

Stupid question, so no offense is meant. If you had a list of accused abusers (remember, innocent until proven guilty) wouldn't you want to go through the list to see if any are still active in Scouting, remove them from Scouting, contact authorities, and begin the legal process to put them behind bars? I would think this is a good thing, especially for victims.

Who trusts National now? We have lost a lot of experienced and knowledgeable volunteers because of the way they have been treated, i.e. ignored and lied to. And with the way they are treating COs, i.e. not honoring the commitments, promises, and obligations they said they would do, only a crazy sense of loyalty to the youth is why I am still involved.

Why would a former CO believe a BSA Facility Use Agreement would protect them when the Charter Agreements they have signed and the promises that were made to them are not being upheld now?

For those who have questions on non abuse IVF cases, I can verify that the one individual i know in them with no accusation of abuse was not in any of the released files I looked at online. I specifically looked for them.

Sounds more like a renaming of the PARAPROFESSIONAL (emphasis) position.

We had one new Cub who broke down and cried because he was not turned upside down like his two older brothers were when he received Bobcat. He had been looking forward that that. Dad took him outside after the meeting, flipped him upside down, and ha oldest brother pin on the Bobcat rank. New Bobcat was happy then.

WOW! That must have been a first.

@David CO, Bet they didn't know you were Catholic. They don't like Catholics either.

From the one case I am familiar with, the individual was temporarily reinstated while the trial was going on. When he lost his case, membership was revoked. Individual had an appeal filed, but when SCOTUS ruled on the Dale case, saying BSA had a right to approve and reject members, he ended his appeal.

As @yknot said, it is recommended, not required at this time. When I first took the Aquatics Supervision training courses several years ago, we were told that there is a push by some at the national level to require the Aquatics Supervision Swimming and/or Aquatics Supervision Paddle Sports in order for troops to do aquatic activities. But that has not been implemented. Personally those two courses are better for troops than BSA Lifeguard. BSA Lifeguard is more of a pool certification now than waterfront.

@ThenNow, would you mind changing the quote to @johnsch322 since he is the one you are quoting and not me? His quote is below. Thanks in advance.

Sorry, I cannot remember where I read this at. It was in a book on the topic, maybe Scouts' Honor, a book referenced in a previous post. Did a report on this topic in undergrad way back in the day. And like an idiot I got rid of almost all my stuff from that time.

Prior to Mandatory Reporting Laws for youth organizations, starting in the 1980s if memory serves and varied state to state, policy was for removal of abuser, and report to the Scout Executive (SE). SE would encourage family to press charges as BSA could not legally do so at the time.. Whether charges were pressed or not, SE filled out paperwork and any supporting documentation to national office. Once in the IVF, every name registration form was checked against the IVF. This could take months as it was prior to computers, and names had to be checked manually. It was also time before SSNs and drivers' licenses were required on forms, so I did read about a 2 to 3 folks using aliases to get back into BSA after moving. But that was rare. Initially when YPT came about in the late 198os, want to say 1988 or 89, any abuse reports would go to the SE because mandatory reporting laws varied greatly. Nowadays it report to local authorities then the SE.

Agreed. That is why if cases prior to mandatory reporting did not have the victim's or his parents' approval to press charges, nothing was done legally to them. All BSA could do is place them in the IVF. Also I want to apologize to @johnsch322 for the snarkiness of my post at the end. YP is an extremely big deal for me, and I get ticked off, to put it mildly, when people say things get swept under the rug today. As I have posted previously, I have had to report a friend and long time Scouter who was for a YP violation. As I sincerely stated, I hope I never have to do that again.

I've commented previously on why the IVF were not widely known, and why information in those files were kept confidential. Not everyone in the files were arrested and convicted. OldScout448 mentions how one abuser did not have charges pressed by the parents, but was placed in those files. One person I know who was placed in the IVF did have a criminal investigation done, and was essentially exonerated by the investigators. They found enough evidence to support her claim that the teenager was being a peeping Tom while she was showering after the Scout's lights out in the assigned times for the adults. Even though she was cleared, her reputation was ruined, and she was never allowed back in the BSA. As for the latest incident, I like chocolate filled donuts thank you.. BSA volunteers have been mandatory reporters for quite some time now. I can tell you first hand that reporting abusers does indeed happen. I hope I never have to do it again.