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Everything posted by Eagle94-A1

  1. My comments. 1. If memory serves, BSA tried that in the 1950s or 60s, and it didn't work out. 2. BSA tried it again from 1989 to sometime in the 2000s/2010s, again with no success. 3. Very few current Scouters are familiar enough with Venturing to make it work properly. Heck it is hard enough to get Troops working properly as many adults do not get how Scouting sis suppose to work, even with training. You can see that on all the various comments and questions on social media. 4. The demographic that other countries use to support this range, 21-30 year olds, have usually b
  2. For reasons beyond my control, I have an ASM who is a helicopter grandparent. Good news is that at meetings I have a CC who will ride herd on them when I supervise the Scouts. And they are limiting the number of camp outs they go on since the adults sleep in tents, or hammocks, just like the youth, and he likes his comforts. But at home it is a different situation. The Scout may be packing his own gear, but grandparent is telling him what to bring and not bring. It is obvious extremely obvious when the Scout was doing a shakedown and kept asking the grandparent what a piece of gear is that he
  3. Great question. Quick and easy answer is : IT. IS. NOT. SCOUTING! (bold and cap for major emphasis and not shouting) Detailed Answer. I do not know when exactly the shift occurred, But when I took Cub Scout Basic Leader Training way back in the day, and when I taught Webelos Den Leader Specific Training, there was an emphasis on transitioning from Cub Scouts to then Boy Scouts. The syllabi discussed how you needed to give them more and more responsibility, start letting them do things for themselves, and getting away from parents signing off on advancement. That is when the "whi
  4. @fred8033, I hear ya. During that period I first joined a Sea Scout ship, after hearing the adventures one SM had when he was one. Sadly it was a non-traditional ship, and not very good. I lasted long enough to get Ordinary. Then I got reinvolved with the OA and BOOM I went. The Scouter Reserve was suppose to fill the wish you have, but it was not widely used until folks became obsessed with training requirements and JTE. But as I said, the 18-20 year olds I have spoken to feel both disrespected by National's pollicy that they no longer count towards YP requirements, and that Natio
  5. For Venturing Advisers, I would say go after the 21+ years olds who aged out of the program. Some do remain in the area, and others who are addicted to Scouting in general, and Venturing in particular do volunteer wherever they move. Hard part now will be finding them. Sadly every single EBOR I have sat in on since 2018, the Eagles say they will stay active until aging out. Reminder that 2018 was when National said 18-20 year olds not only do not count for YP purposes, but also must essentially give up friends and/or classmates who are involved in Scouting who are under 18 because of YP r
  6. Respectfully disagree. The best leaders for Venturing are the 18-20 year olds who are craving HA, but also are giving back to the troop as well. Sadly because BSA no longer gives the 18-20 year olds the respect they deserve, i.e. they no longer count towards 2 deep leadership, needs 2 registered adults over 21 when teaching a MB or 1 over 21 registered adult and 1 parent with them when teaching a MB, making them choose between Scout friends and schoolmates since they have to apply YPT policies to non-Scout life, but again they do not count towards 2 deep leadership, We are losing a lot of ex
  7. Most definitely. I would add that the TG gets overwhelmed working with all of the new Scouts simultaneously. In a Traditional Patrol, older Scouts buddy up with the younger ones and work with them. Again concur. When I was a TG, if I was not actively working with someone, they were clueless as to what to do, even if I gave them specific instructions. And I was overwhelmed. In my case, adults did not get involved because we were an old fashioned Scout-led troop, unless it was disciplinary. After a year of trying, and also losing some scouts, we went back to Traditional Patrols. HOW
  8. I wonder if SEs will be able to raid those unit accounts. Sadly i saw a SE raid the OA lodge's account that was to be used for camp improvements for conclave. When all the bills started arriving, there was no money to pay them.
  9. I know in the early to late 1980s, 1982 - 1989 to be exact, Webelos were coming over as full dens. I do not know when the NSP was officially piloted, but in 1986, my troop was asked to pilot it. IT WAS A COMPLETE FAILURE and we went back to Traditional Patrols a year later. Imagine everyone's surprise when NSPs became a recommended model in August 1989
  10. My thoughts. 1. Sea Scouts has been the exception to the Older Scout problem because they have customs and traditions dating back to 1912. Even when Sea Scouts turned into Sea Exploring, and you had traditional and non traditional ships, those traditional ships survived and thrived. 2. regarding advancement, that was NEVER meant to be a focus for Venturing, hence the original 5 Bronze in specialties, Gold, and Silver Awards. They were optional items. 3. Regarding the term Venture Scout, that term was already in use to those Scouts in Venture crews within troops. When Venturing
  11. I think "expensive" may be relative. The troop paying $120 for 3 vehicles to park 2 nights plus over $300 for gas for a weekend backpacking trip on the AT is expensive. But I know compared to Philmont, it is dirt cheap.
  12. First I hard of this. Didn't National try this in the 1950s, and it flopped? I've heard stories that folks were automatically enrolled as Explorers, but still remained with the troop. That is a great question. I know it is more expensive to do HA activities, but it is possible. But we are an "old school" troop not focused on advancement, but instead on fun and adventure. If it takes 4.5 year to get First Class, so be it.
  13. A few reasons for Venture crew/patrols demise. 1. Not really popular outside of LDS units, and then it was those units that did not focus on sports. When the old Leadership Corps was turned into Venture Crews in 1989 (although some units like mine continued using Leadership Corps until we ran out of patches circa 1995), it did not have a huge following. I was hired in 1996 to create a high adventure program based upon the activity pins that were associated with the program, we had 0 interest, and I ended up doing COPE instead of because NO ONE signed up for it. 2. Varsity Teams and
  14. Fixed that for you. Let's face it, National is the one setting the tone on this. National is producing training material that promotes advancement above all things, and positions of responsibility is part of that.
  15. Depending upon who is taking care of them, I can see that. We had an former US Army armorer taking care of our day camp BB guns. He turned a bunch of abused and poorly taken care of BB guns, and turned them into competition quality bb guns. Sadly council found out about him, and recruited him for summer camp staff where he was the shooting sports director. Unless policy has changed since I went to camp school, or a council has figured out a way to get around the rules, National has prohibited packs from running their own shooting sports events. Cub Scout shooting sports are restrict
  16. I know the camp I went to in the 1980s and worked at in the 1990s was mixed. With the exception of 2 classes ( Astronomy and Journalism) all MB classes were during the day. They did have "extras" at night time, i.e. First Aid and CPR certification, Hunter Safety, etc, one or two nites. Also some classes did have a 1 night program, i.e. Wilderness Survival, Camping, etc. While we wanted MBs, we wanted fun more. In fact we were told never to take more than 5 classes so that we could have at least last period with free swimming, boating, and shooting sports, so we can have fun. Night time had a m
  17. I wish we could get back to patrol method summer camps. Sadly I do not see this happening as the current structure is too ingrained in parents, Scouts, and many, many Scouters. I have had parents tell me that if they are paying for camp they will be picking the classes that he can get the MB at camp, otherwise it is not worth it. I have Scouts who enjoyed their COVID-19 summer camp, which used the patrol method, tell me they do not want to do to again because of the limited MB we worked on. And I had a scout retake a MB because it was fun, and another Scouter told me he was wasting his time.
  18. We have not had a dull time DE in my district prior to merger for at least 9 years, always having to share one with another district. Since the merger in 2021, we have had 2 DEs. One didn't even attend the district camporee. The other didn't attend the council camporee, although she was brand new and I will cut her some slack. We have hand delivered advancement paperwork only to be be told "It was never turned in" (despite having a photo taken of the paperwork in fact being turned in because of previous issues). We needed professional help trying to get into the schools for recruiting, to n
  19. Part of the reason BSA kept those files for so long is that folks in them could still be alive, and a danger to youth, decades after being put into them. The SM who abused my 2 friends is still alive. While a criminal background check would show his conviction for CSA (their mom did press charges), Others in the IVF were NOT convicted, and the IVF prevents them from re-enrolling. One victim posted their abusers case file on a previous thread. They were never charged with a crime, and only the IVF prevented them from rejoining. Grant you they attempted to rejoin within 2 years of being kicked
  20. Unless they go to that camp, and take all the equipment that has been donated to maintain it. Yes that happened. They even took some personal gear that volunteers left because they were doing multi-weekend projects. Agree. 33% of COUNCIL Fundraisers is the norm. Unit fundraisers are for the unit. What's a Unit Earning Application? :) Seriously, I have turned in some, and never got them back. Quit filling it out. Sometimes the volunteer IS following the directions of the professional. Some Pros are jerks.
  21. December 2016 is when National watered down the 2015 Cub Scout program, changing requirements mid year. My pack decided to ignore the December 2016 Update and continue with what they planned, and then synced everything with National in June 2017. BUT books still had the 2015 requirements, and some of those books were still floating in stores as late as 2018/19. And it wasn't just Webelos, it was the entire Cub Scout program that was revamped. The reason for the watering down of the Cub Scout Program in December 2016 is due to complaints. People were so use to everythign being completed by
  22. When Webelos went from a 9-12 month program to an 18-24 month program in the 1990s, the purpose was to move the Cross Overs from May/June time frame to February/March time frame in order to get the new Scouts, and adults, acclimated with Scouts BSA. I know that when I crossed over in May under the older program, I had less than 3 weeks to come up with the money to go to camp, and attend. My family could not afford it at the 'last minute," and I did not go with my troop the first summer I was in Scouts. I missed out on a lot by not going. That is what we essentially did with yo
  23. I had one of those, but in reverse. SM wanted a name removed after he approved the Scout for election, and he got in. He was pressuring the election team, and when I intervened tried pressuring me. When I refused to cave, he started yelling at me. That is when I decided to leave , and he followed me into the parking lot and cursed me out. AND NOW I REMEMBER, he was the one who the following year told his troop h ow to vote so everyone could get in ( this was when there were election limits). Glad yours went well. That happened in my troop in the 1980s, back when there were e
  24. One of the biggest issues I just recently found out is that since at least 2015, the Webelos Den Leader Book, or whatever it is called, has sections cut and pasted from the Cub Scout Leader Section, specifically how advancement is suppose to work. NONE of the information that was in older Webelos leader literature and training is in it. So instead of telling Wbeelos den leaders they and "activity badge counselor" sign off instead of parents, parents till sign off as it is done. And another issue I have is training. I admit I hate online training. BUT one of the complaints I am hearing abo
  25. When i ran CS day camp, irregardless of who owned the property, NCAP applied.
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