SSScout

I was a carpenter's helper for a couple summers. One of my bossses was an old time carp, the kind that could've framed a roof with a square and a hand saw by eye. He once sent me down into the area around the foundation of the basement before it was backfilled to throw out all the garbage that we had thrown in at lunchtimes. When I asked why, he said that the junk might make voids in the fill-in and that might lead to leaks in the basement. When I pointed out that when the dirt covered it up, no one would know it was there, he said "yeah, but you and I would know it was there. Pick it out".

Almpost 280 people were killed by the use of a gun since Sandy Hook... As heard about on NPR today: http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/crime/2012/12/gun_death_tally_every_american_gun_death_since_newtown_sandy_hook_shooting.html And they are absolutely right: Guns don't kill people. People USING guns kill people. And here in Murlin, there is a favorite Youth Hostel by the name of Sandy Hook. I'll never be able to visit there again without a new reference.

Goes to show there are no such thing as a new joke. Only updated ones. When I first heard the "heckling" joke, it was Abraham Lincoln. (Reps and Dems reversed) And no, I was not in that audience. I have no doubt that Kufu and Imhotep were mentioned previously, only the heckler would've been dealt with without humor. As for the Truman camel-ass-shovel reference, the first time I heard that one, it was FDR being given the Biblical comparasion. And no, again, I was not in the original audience. Heard about the priest, rabbi, G.W.Bush and Boy Scout in the crashing airplane?

And so Jesus was placed in a foster home, because his real father couldn't raise him as a human baby?

Happy Jesus' earhly birthday observed, because we don't really know when it happened. Y'all be good, now, hea' ?

Well, the advertising connections are working well, Lots of "support the 2nd amendment" and "body armor" and "shooting instruction" ads, but nary a llama ad in the bunch.

The District is a creation of the Council. The Council is a franchise of the National BSA. If you are of a mind to, you can look up the incorporation papers of your Council, should be public record in your jurisdiction. The CORs are, by usual definition, the voting board of that corporation. That is where you have leverage, that is where the legal foundation of the Council lies. There is very little you can do excpt raise stink where you can and make sure as many others know of this as you can. The hypocracy of the Council leaders (if any) when compared to the SLaw and SP/O should be noted. Is there a News item here? Could a local news reporter be interested in it? Work for the boys. Forget FoS. Godspeed.

The major news hasn't picked up on this , I think, because it isn't very exciting... Dateline 18 Dec. 2012 ""NICKEL MINES, Pa. Members of the Amish community where a gunman killed five girls in a one-room schoolhouse in 2006 are writing letters to reach out in sympathy to parents in Newtown, Conn."" http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2012/12/amish_near_nickel_mines_school.html " The only way to stop a bad man with a gun is a good man with a gun." Didn't seem to work in Columbine. So where is our faith? How do we show it? With bigger weapons? Or with active forgiveness? Something in between? GPS chips in the weapon? People watching people who watch other people? Maybe we should make it a law that requires every child to have a stable, sane, loving and caring parent (or two, where possible), and if that child cannot produce proof that their parent meets those requirements , then that child is arrested and put in jail... wait, maybe not... ummmm. Let me rethink that...

Friend LeRoi is right, in that we are fortunate to have lived in a country where (by law) no one can be co-erced to worship (or not) God(s) in any particular way. He and I are both, I dare say, grateful for that. Many other nations around the world have taken the US of A's lead in that and adopted similar requirements or guides or what ever thay may be called. Their populations benefit and prosper thereby. And there are many countries where the jealousy of some over the freedom of others denies the ability to worship (or not) as one pleases. The result is not a peaceful if heated debate, but the torture and death of many. If the only thing we have to worry about is whether or not our chidren are forced to see their teacher adorned in a fuzzy red and white hat, I say God bless'm. The King James Bible is studied as the great english writing that it is, and the human ethicist movement will be allowed to remind us that it is good to be logical, and to question, even if the answers are not terribly easy to discern. Some will trust to their senses, some to their intellect, some to whatever seems to inspire them. Ultimately, as the carny barker said, "Ya pays yer money and ya takes yer cherce". That all anyone can do. Muslim, Hindu, Jew, Christian, Athiest, Zoroastrian, we all have our choices to make. Some were offered by our family, some by folks we met along the way, some we figured out ourselves. The laws we inherit or agree to or help enact are there so we don't all try to drive on the same side of the road at the same time. If they are felt to be unfair or not appropriate to the situation, then here, at least, we have the right and ability to point them out and see if they can be changed or re-interpreted. In the mean time, I say where thy fuzzy red and white hat as long as thy canst. It is part of human nature, afterall.

Well, the NRA just announced their solution: Post an armed guard in every school. Would this be a "protection"? or an invitation for another "challenge"? I have heard of "suicide by police". How many of these sick individuals expected to come out alive? I do not remember any that did. How many shot themselves before someone else did it for them?

I guess Kieth and the Stones were previously booked.

Welcome to the F&C forum... As a Quaker, I can sympathize with Merlin. Really. Our faith was founded on the ability of the worshipper to connect directly with the Divine (thru Christ Jesus) without benefit or need of another human intercessor. No "need" for ordained clergy. As such, yep, early Quakers were often persecuted for daring to be "different". I often meet folks in the Quaker world that have come to the conclusion that ANY interrruption , or "stumbling block", in that journey to the Divine, be it Christ, the Bible, someone else's revelation, is to be ignored and even actively avoided. Only the silent worship, the opening of one's heart and soul and mind to that spark/spirit is necessary. The actual history of our faith is irrelevant. The experience of others is irrelevant. I knew one fine old woman, whom I had grown to greatly respect as a great example of Friendly Devotion,a pillar of our Meeting, who told me that we had "finally gotten past all that Christian stuff". I frankly didn't know what to respond, so I said nothing. She would have denied that our faith had been founded on Biblical statements, that the language of George Fox was just because he had no other way to express his faith. But George Fox took his Bible very seriously and reminded the priests of his time of their hypochrisy quite often. How had my friend forgotten this? So when I say I empathize with friend Merlin, I mean that his stand on being governmentally neutral when it comes to faith is fine, but not allowing people the ability to give voice to their faith , even as indirectly as wearing a red and white fuzzy hat, is sadly wrong. If I am a sub teacher (hello skeptic) and mention (when asked) that I do not recite the Pledge of Allegiance because I view it as idolatry (promising to be loyal to a piece of cloth) and a loyalty oath (counter to Quaker truth testimony), I COULD be asked to stop with my religious language (yes, not speaking is language). Or not. My expression of faith is NOT a teacher PROMOTING a state/government requirement. The reciting of the PoA is NOT required in our schools. It is a "tradition" and one that needs to be reviewed by the kid's parent, not by me. I actually had a class of 6th graders remind me, when the PA was not operable one day, shouldn't we be saying the PoA ? I said sure, who wants to lead it? I stepped back and let one of the boys lead it. So Merlin's frustration and dissapointment is understandable. It appears that the fuzzy hat may be a religious expression and if on a teacher's head, could be viewed as a (because the teacher is a government agent) government promotion of religion, and should be disallowed. But then too, it may be a personal expression and should be allowed. Is the playing of the Messiah a promotion of Christianity or is it merely a great , soaringly wonderful piece of music? See and you decide. Mery Christmas and be healthy.

Thee speaks my mind, friend. If you have no objection, I will pass your thoughts on to some others . Now, when do we get the Faith and Chaplaincy forum established?

Merging Councils? Selling camps? Defining our purpose? Building endowments? Hiring certain Scout Pros? Leaving a 'legacy'? Making one's mark as a Scout Exec? I keep remembering "Owasippee"..... http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=87008#id_204768 and it is not always about Scouts and efficiency. Follow the money... Try to get the newspapers interested in a non-profit, for the kids organization becoming MORE interested in the money. Is the Council treasury and financial statement transparent? Corporate reports to the state up to date (public record!) If you have the time, might make interesting reading. Good Scouting to you!

What Neal said.... Best if you have the Scout Leaders lined up already, members of the church. The Scout connection needs to be there for it to "take". All the brochures and mini Boys' Lifes and showing camp videos won't help if the candidate CO doesn't see the value of sponsoring a Scout unit. If the IH of the institution is in favor of the idea, he/she may know of some adults that can be motivated to help in the unit founding. Check with your DE or DC, they should/might be aware of the Scout propaganda available locally. Show the latest camp DVD about the CSDC and Council camp. Bring along acouple of present Scouts as "visual aides" , have them speak of the fun and excitement of Scouting. Bring an assortment of Scout manuals to peruse. And, if this is a House of Faith, bring along info about the Religious Awards appropriate to that faith. Explain that these are written and overseen by leaders of that faith and not the BSA, that the BSA only approves the awards for BSA members to wear. After they say "gee, that sounds great. Let's do 'er!", then start talking about expenses and forms to fill out, and training to take, and criminal background checks, and stuff...

I am sorry , but I only received this a few minutes ago: The Wilton(CT) Quaker Meeting House is the focus of a national prayer event on Wednesday evening for the shooting of the children and adults at Sandy Hook Elementary School, Newtown, CT. Feel free to join F(f)riends wherever you are so that even more people can be joined in prayer simultaneously at 8 PM Eastern time. Everyone who can join us physically is welcomed to our Meeting House. The meeting house is located at: 317 New Canaan Road (Route 106) Wilton , CT 06897 ""I expect to pass through this world but once. Any good, therefore, that I can do or any kindness I can show to any fellow creature, let me do it now. Let me not defer or neglect it for I shall not pass this way again."" = Stephan Grellet=

For your book club discussion: ""The Weapon Shops of Isher"" by A. E. Von Vogt (1951) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Weapon_Shops_of_Isher http://www.pdfdocspace.com/docs/43088/a-e-van-vogt---the-weapon-shops-of-isher.html

" I promise to do my duty, to God, my Country and community and to obey the Law of the Pack." OOps, I 'm sorry, wrong ceremony... ""I promise to do my duty to God, my country, my community and my Crew. I promise to be the very best Crew Advisor I can be. I will help the Crew go places and do things, and learn, and have fun doing it. Hoo - Hah.""

RS: You give me pause. True enough, we need to reach out to all the grieving families, but very often, our family comes first. I was reminded of a very important bit of advice from that icon of adulthood, Mister Rogers (how long was it , growing up, before you realized that your Kindergarten teacher's first name wasn't "Misses"?): "When I was a boy and I would see scary things in the news, my mother would say to me, 'Look for the helpers. You will always find people who are helping.' To this day, especially in times of 'disaster,' I remember my mother's words, and I am always comforted by realizing that there are still so many helpers - so many caring people in this world". It is , indeed , a Scout's first goal , to help. Like the doctor's credo to "first, do no wrong", it is a Scout's desire to help. Even when there is no real way to help, he/she should desire it. Sometimes the mere desire is sufficient, the knowledge that someone, somewhere wants to help , can get a person thru the worst of existance. Amnesty International and Child Fund come to mind, all invite letter writing and not merely sending money , altho that is also a good thing. The Scout brotherhood is a touchstone for these folks in Connecticut and we can make sure our Scout brothers and sisters know they are not forgotten but, as RS reminds us, we are obligated by our SL and SP/O to "help other people at all times". Perhaps this time , as ever, we need to think about how we can help even before the need is realized. We need to play the "what if " game more often, and seriously. Maybe the Bushmaster company can be retooled to make school desks and computer cases and micro surgery "Waldos" and solar powered water pumps and....

Thank you for the referral! Cambridge, could you give us some small details. I have referred this to other Scout friends, and they wish to know: What are the ages represented? Are these Cub Scout age? Scout age ? Any Rovers visible? Is the Girl Guides (Girl Scouts here) still popular, or is the (?how do you say it now that you are co-ed?) Boy Scouts taking over?

SMConference..... SMConversation...... 1) Determine if the boy is truly a member of your Troop. Who signed the application? Who accepted it? Was it a dollar transfer? Was it "new"? 2) Get the CC and COR in on this , if necessary , maybe one of them signed the app. Make sure they are on your side in this. 3) Find his advancement records. From whence cometh them? Is he a new Scout with no rank as yet? Is he a transfer and can you speak with his past SM? Or CM? 4)With the knowledge at hand, meet with the boy and parent and have a CONVERSATION. Make sure they know either A) he is not a bonafide member, and here's what he/you needs to do, OR B) here's what is understood about his records, welcome to the Troop, and here's what HE needs to do to EARN the right to a SMConference (attendance, requirement passing, etc.) OR C) there is something really wrong with this situation, we know you want to do the right thing and let's help the boy get the right start in our Troop. Howzat?

SMConference..... SMConversation...... 1) Determine if the boy is truly a member of your Troop. Who signed the application? Who accepted it? Was it a dollar transfer? Was it "new"? 2) Get the CC and COR in on this , if necessary , maybe one of them signed the app. Make sure they are on your side in this. 3) Find his advancement records. From whence cometh them? Is he a new Scout with no rank as yet? Is he a transfer and can you speak with his past SM? Or CM? 4)With the knowledge at hand, meet with the boy and parent and have a CONVERSATION. Make sure they know either A) he is not a bonafide member, and here's what he/you needs to do, OR B) here's what is understood about his records, welcome to the Troop, and here's what HE needs to do to EARN the right to a SMConference (attendance, requirement passing, etc.) OR C) there is something really wrong with this situation, we know you want to do the right thing and let's help the boy get the right start in our Troop. Howzat?

Jblake47: Didst get my PM?

Now, what was it the Scoutmaster was supposed to say to the Scout? Oh yes: "Have you asked your Patrol Leader?" As I thought about it, it occurred to me that here we have a real good example of the Scoutmaster asking a question that might have gone to his Commissioner... if he had one... So here we have a bunch of Acting-Commissioners, able to make use of their collective experience and knowledge. "Have you asked your Commissioner?" might be a reasonable response, but as I think about it, that might lead to other questions: @ What's a Commissioner? @ Who is he/she to me and my Unit? @ Why should I ask them instead of Scouter.com, if I can find them? @ What's the use... He'll only tell me to ask the DE...

Scouting is a volunteer movement, yes? As such, the volunteers are what make or break the idea. The Pro's job (theoretically) is to help the vol's get it done. However... Lots of pros see their job as THEIR job, and often despite their initial idealism (if they had some), they get mired in the bureacratic necessities, hence the creation of Districts. Districts allow the pros to better keep track of numbers. If the vols are up to it, Districts are a good framework to hang multi - unit activities on. Just don't depend on the pros to do it. I have not moved in the past 20 years, but in the last 10 years my Scouting has been in 5 Districts (if I count the "service areas" and "sub-district" they tried, make it 6). We (the vols) have had to regroup and redefine ourselves that many times. But even so, we insisted on keeping the same CSDCs and Camporees, and even added some new things. We now have 3 Districts where two years ago we had one BIG one. Same problems, same solutions, same folks I worked with before. Different patches and neckers for the Commishers. I do training in two Districts, write newsletter bits for all 3. Help at two of the three CSDCs. Commish for the same four units, which have been in three different Districts and the church hasn't moved. Scouts still go camping, Cubs still race PWD cars. They don't care, so long as the adults pay the bills and drive to the sites.