Eagle94-A1

While I know understand the YPT concerns, IMHO there was not a lot of thought into making it. My troop has a closed facebook page. Reason for that is one non-custodial parent with a restraining order showed up at an event with the intentions of picking up his sons and taking them with them. Mom heard and the boys never showed up to prevent an incident. We have PLC members communicating via private chat to insure things are going to get done. Scouters use PM to go over stuff and get things done. Stuff that doesn't need to be posted publicly. Best example of things that do not need to be posted publicly happened this week with the pack. Webelos are invited to camporee with the troop. WDLs, CM, and SM are handling things. the Tiger DL, whose grandson is a Webelos 2, decides to post the camporee flyer on the pack's facebook page, essentially inviting all the Cub Scouts to camporee. A "discussion" then ensues. That "discussion" could have been done privately, and prevented some embarrassment and frustration.

1) WELCOME TO DA FORUMS! 2) Scout needing Totin Chip needs to ask his Patrol Leader (PL) as ever troop does things differently. Some will allow PLs to work with their members and sign off. Some troops only allow older Scouts to sign off. And some only want adults to sign off on stuff.

UPDATE: Good news, bad news. The Cubmaster found a female registered DL to camp with the female Webelos. We will be meeting the new YP double standards. That's the good news. Bad news it's one of the helicopter moms with the troop. This was the mom who showed up last year to camporee to camp with her Lion Cub Scout. This was because the DE decided to have a fishing derby at the same time as camporee. Sadly the Lion Cub was not closely supervised and did cause some problems. This DL is also asssuming all camp outs with the troop to be family camp outs, and doesn't see why it's a problem that her 12 year old son is sneaking out of his tent to sleep with dad and/or entire family. So the female Webelos is good to go. On another note, I now realize that more adults affiliated with the troop want the Family Scouting model like Cub Scouts than want a true Scouting program based upon the Patrol Method. SM being OK with a Tiger Cub camping with the troop during camporee as well as adults planning a troop family camp out without input of the PLC made me realize this last nite. I am tired of trying to get the troop back on course, and I do not see any hope of change at this point. I am resigned to go with the flow until either A) my sons get tired of the situation and transfer or B) they earn Eagle and leave.

I'll let you in on a little secret about National Supply: BUNCH OF FOLKS HAVE LITTLE TO NO EXPERIENCE IN THE PROGRAM, THEY ARE JUST WARM BODIES WHO ANSWERED AN AD FOR A POSITION. (emphasis, not shouting) I worked in national supply for a while and can tell you that out of all the folks in my store, only 2 had program experience: myself and the PT guy I recruited to work with me in the pilot program. Neither my manager, assistant manager, 2 FT coworkers, and 3 PT coworkers I worked with during my tenure had any actual experience in the program. I cannot tell you how many times I had to politely correct my bosses and coworkers. I cannot tell you how many times I got lectured by my bosses when I was providing information to new folks and not trying to make the sale. Thankfully that stopped when one customer I talked to that left without a sale came back a few hours later with his son and then spent about 45 minutes completely outfitting his son with pack, sleeping bag, and other items.

Doesn't have to be a female DL, other wise she would not be allowed to join since I am now the WDL. And the way we meet, the entire pack at one time, we got it covered. Since she is the only Webelos, and it is not recommended that she be placed with Lions and Tigers, the only other girls in the pack, we are doing what everyone else is doing: having a coed den in reality instead of makign her Lone Scout.

Guys won't come out and say it publicly, at least I am not hearing anything, but they are afraid of this. When polled, the #MeTo movement was mentioned in the anonymous online poll we took. One Scout described a situation occurring similar to the OP's link. And I can understand. My brother was accused of molesting my nieces by his ex-wife to get custody. Thankfully he was able to prove innocence, but it nearly destroyed him. Even though he had joint custody, whenever he had the kids, he stayed at my mom's house with them.

Yes I did read the FAQs. And I am pointing out how it is a double standard that is insulting to male volunteers. And as Shortridge pointed out, the issue of her camping with her father was never addressed. I though the entire purpose of allowing girls was to be "Family Friendly." If a girl cannot camp with ther dad, doesn't seem to be Family Friendly to me.

Richard, I am pointing out the double standard in the rules, i.e. how the new rules say it is ok for two females to take a bunch of male Webelos camping, but not two male leaders with a bunch of female Webelos. Also pointing out how parents no longer count towards 2 deep. Also pointing out how even if her father goes with her and is her buddy, she still cannot go because of no female Scouters. SHE WILL BE CAMPING WITH HER DAD! (emphasis) He's was pumped up about camporee when I talked to them about it. All, Yes I will shortly scrambling like crazy to find a female Scouter, and am enlisting the CM's help in the matter. In fact may be calling a friend of mine from another district to see if she could help. In addition to having ticked off Scouts and Scouters, we would lose 1/2 the Scouts in the troop and several Scouters. The Scouts themselves brought up this exact situation, canceling a trip due to lack of female Scouters, when discussing becoming "linked troops." They would transfer or quit altogether. Several of those Scouts have parents involved as Scouters. I know I go where my sons go, and believe many others would follow their sons. So cancelling is not an option.

CO is working on the female troop, but is still looking for female Scouters. Two of the current Scouters are the ones who are pushing it since the troop will not be "linked," but they are male. As for her mom registering, I do not know the family situation.She just joined Monday night, and dad was the one who brought her. As for other packs, as far as I know she is the only female Webelos in the district. My son's pack has no female Webelos, and the other pack accepting girls does not have female Webelos. The rest of the packs are not accepting girls at this time.

Cancelling is not an option. A) it is camporee, and B) cancelling a camp out for lack of female Scouters is one the concerns of the Scouts and why the CO is forming a separate female troop. If the troop was to cancel 50+% will leave. That has already been stated when we did a poll of the Scouts. Troop traditionally invites all the Webelos, and since she is the only female Webelos in the pack, and I believe the entire district, So they invited her as a courtesy as well as an incentive to get the female troop going.

I hate the new YPT rules. In addition to destroying the Patrol Method, no longer considering 18-20 year olds as responsible adults, having a double standard in which 2 females can take a bunch of boys camping but you MUST have a registered female present if 1 girl is present, the biggest P.I.T.A. is parents do not count towards YPT. I now have to tell a female Webelos she may not be able to attend a camp out, even if a parent shows up and camps with her, because there may be no female Scouters present. I.AM. TICKED. OFF! (screaming in rage) Troop she would be camping with has only one registered female Scouter, and she does not camp any more due to health reasons. The only possible registered female Scouter, is the former Bear DL who stepped down because she does not want to camp. She knew Webelos entailed camping, and stepped down as a result. Looks like I will be doing some begging in the very near future. Maybe a Dutch oven "Death by Chocolate Cake" will do the trick?

What about the Chicago lawsuit which resulted in Career Interest Exploring becoming part of Learning for Life and traditional Exploring becoming Venturing?

I personally think National just opened up a giant can of worms with this decision. I can see the lawsuits being filed if someone doesn't get the extension or if the extension is long enough to their satisfaction.

Looks like Sydney Ireland will be able to get Eagle after all.

Now it is on National's website https://www.scouting.org/resources/guide-to-advancement/eagle-scout-rank/

Nation's Capital posted it as well. https://www.ncacbsa.org/blog/2018/10/03/eagle-scout-extension-in-2019/

LOVE IT!

Sadly I am reading where too many packs are ONLY using the fakes. As for Cubs being kids, I remember that too. I remember being a Wolf and whittling my PWD car because my father refused to help. And while pencil sharpeners were around when I was a kid, I know my way older brothers did bring pocket knives to school to sharpen pencils. And who said I am skipping basics using the real deal? I'm just not using fakes. As for parents, communication is key. First time as a DL, talking to the parents I found out one of the grand dads was a professional woodcarver. Got in touch with him and had him teach the class. WOW it was awesome. I even learned some tricks. Second time, parents had no problem. This last time, I talked to the parents, including last year's DL who did not think a pocket knife is safe, and got them over their worries. Even telling them the Den Chief will be teaching and me assisting, they are fine. Yeah. we used safety circle back in the day. Never heard the term "blood circle" until I moved to NC and was staffing an IOLS course. it IS way cooler, and something they remember. Now on a slight tangent, I would love ideas on teaching whittling chip, heck everything scouting related, to a one handed Cub. One of my Cubs only has one hand, and I have been thinking about how to teach teaching whittling chip to her. So I would love to hear any ideas on teaching a handicap Cub how to use and sharpen a knife.

Thankfully the rule only applies to Whittling Chip, and not Totin Chip. For the moment.

Guess I am an "old school Scouter." I believe using fake knives and plastic knives is wrong and does an injustice to our Cubs. To paraphrase William "Green Bar Bill" Hillcourt for Cub Scout appropriateness, Train 'em. Trust 'em. LET THEM EXPERIMENT! Teach them using pocketknives. And I admit, I screwed up getting wood carving, fixed blade knives for day camp since the requirement specifically state "pocket knife."

Yes, national policy is that cutting corners on the Whittling Chip is now prohibited, but no mention of cutting corners on a Totin Chip being prohibited. Currently troops can decide how to deal with Totin Chip. Don't know why that is, but I assume it's because the PLC, which is comprised of Scouts, should be makign that policy as ooposed to adults on the Cub Scout level. Never heard of it being considerd hazing until the rule came out last year.

I already see packs making exceptions and changing requirements. Biggest one is the Whittling Chip requirements. It specifically states "Pocketknife," not "plastic cutlery knife" not "imitation wooden knife", and not "popsicle sticks." Irks me to no end that I need to redo Whitting Chip with my Webelos since they didn't really earn it and the previous DL thought they were "too dangerous" On a side note, I am also culpable in changing the requirement. I had folks at day camp teaching Whittling Chip with wood carving knives from Paul's Supplies https://pauls-supplies.myshopify.com/collections/knives/products/carving-knife which is technically a fixed blade, not a pocket knife. But at least it was a real knife.

I'm concerned about the future of training. National seems to be pushing for online training as much as possible. A few problems with that is the lack of meeting people, networking, and in some areas technological issues that cause you to say the heck with it and forgo training altogether. I'm reading questions on facebook groups that usually have been covered in classroom training or roundtables. Really scary part is reading some of the answers!😧

Could you provider close up images?

Pre-1980s. That's when they went to a leather hat band