Eagle94-A1

Reminding of the time that Scouts sat on BORs. I remember chairing a bunch until we found out national disallowed it. Agree best way to make a young, nervous Scout comfortable.

For whatever reason, my post from last night didn't make it. I know it's late in the game, but I've been busy getting ready for an unwanted visitor named Florence. This is a rough one for me since I will not be home with the wife and kids, but working. 1) I am glad to hear @HelpfulTracks explanation of what he meant. Anyone whose read some of my posts for the past 12-18 months knows some of the challenges I am encountering regarding adults interfering with troop operations. Between Gunship and the helicopter parents we have Scouts beginning to lose interest in the program. To make it more interesting, at the sametime the "Adult Led, Scout Run" consistency comment was made, some one of a FB group I'm on commented how the troop committee should make the plans. Person stated that Scouts are incapable of making plans, and SMs incapable of advising them, since "moms know their families schedules" or words to that effect. 2) As others commented, training has changed over the years. From a Cub Scout Trainer Wood Badge Course and Boy Scouter Wood Badge Course from when I was a new Scouter ( and there was a 3rd Explorer WB course before my time) to a one size fits all WB course of today. From reading syllabi and talking to WBers, especially those who have staffed all of either two of the three courses, and in one case all three courses, the current one leaves out so much program specific material that in the long term it is hurting the program. As for the basic training, one of the sad things about online training is that it does not give the opportunity to ask questions, network, and get some real life examples. Even my Exploring Basic Leader Training Self Study Course had me meeting with a counselor and going over things with him one time. As for the outdoor training, haven't seen the 2018 syllabi yet, but the last few updates have cut time spent on topics, or eliminated topic altogether. 3) BSA needs to get on the ball as we are now going to get a bunch of new volunteers with either no Scouting expereince, or experience from GSUSA, which ias completely different from BSA.

Local issue, but it may have been made by a BSA approved vendor since it has the FDL on it, and BSA will go after anyone using their logos. And the BSA backing came out circa 2009, so it is probably made 2002 - 2009. Symbolism on the patch represents the two targets: New York and Washington DC.

Please tell me you are joking? If you are not, please get SM Specific training ASAP! And if BSA training is encouraging this, and from reading the WB syllabus it is, then the BSA is truly dying. The Patrol Method will soon be in name only as patrols will no longer be allowed to do day activities on their own. And as Old School Scouters leave or die off. We will have a generation of Scouters who have no idea what Scouts are capable of, and should be doing. Scouts, BSA will truly be a Webelos 3, or AOL2, program with adults making all the decision, and the Scouts doing nothing. This is something I have been fighting with my troop for a few years nows: adults making all the decisions. The Scouts I've talked to are tired of it. The next camp out was arranged at the last minute, and it was done by the adults. It is something almost all of them have done, they are tired of the campsite, and won't be going as a result. Good link. I hope someone at National is reading his stuff. It appears as if the Patrol Method will truly die on October 1st, 2018 in the US.

If the premier training of the BSA, the mountain top experience for adults, uses the term "ADULT LED, YOUTH RUN" in it A) whoever came up with the WB21C course was never a Scout as a youth and has no idea about the program DESPITE their credentials and B) It explains a lot of the problems I am seeing with units, even ones with WBers. Why can't people today understand the simple concept of "Train 'em. Trust 'em. LET THEM LEAD!" ? Why does our society want to treat teenagers and young adults under 26 like children?

While the SCOUTNET server may be in Dallas, or even in muliple locations across the nation or cloud based, the information a council has access to is local. So a council in MA cannot access a Scout or Scouter's information in a council in WA. Hence SCOUTNET is local.

You do realize that SCOUTNET records are local. That is why when a member or volunteer moves from council to council, they must provide a copy of their records so that the council's database can be updated. I wish it was not the case. Heck I was told by the then national SCOUTNET directors that records would be transferable in the database. Would have helped the 5 councils I've been in since SCOUTNET came into existence.

I agree 110% on this. But many folks on various Facebook Groups will argue that it is not preparing us for coed Scouting. It is to get BSA more in line with other youth organizations. But isn't it coincidence that the policy was announced 10 months and that the effective date is 10-1-18, 4 months before Scouts BSA and girls forming "linked troops."

Who would have thought :)- I agree, there should be a skip to the test option. What I really wish was that the YPT2 training would have come out AFTER the May 2018 Youth Protection updates, the ones that killed the Patrol Method. Reminded everyone at Roundtable last night that effective October 1st, patrols can no longer have their own day activities without 2 registered Scouters over 21. Lots of ticked off Scouters. lots of complaints that it was not mentioned in the new YPT2 training that just came out.

With all due respect, I again call HORSEHOCKEY. Every single time I have seen councils' electronic records messed up, or even missing information, I have had to use the Handbook to correct the councils' records. And multiple council registrars have told me the handbook is the official record since it has all of the signatures.Council records are just that,records.

While I agree 110% with this as my troop has too many helicopter and lawnmower and gunship parents, I am going ot play Devil's Advocate as I am still affiliated with this one, parent heavy program. What about all the Cub Scout parents? Rule being applied to the entire year is asinine. All Cub parents would need to be registered is indeed the 72 hours is for a program year.

I believe this one sentence is causing the problem: "The 72 hours need not be consecutive." My interpretation is that one event 72+ hours, say summer camp, and if an adult is there Sunday 12PM to Tuesday 6PM (54 hours) then comes back Thursday at 8 PM and they stay past 6PM on Friday, they need to be registered. Apparently someone is interpreting "The activity" as Scouting's year round program. If this is the case. then ALL Cub Parents need to be registered.

I believe @MattR is talking about one of his certificates from 25+ years ago. Originally YPT was a one time thing. I don't remember when it went to biannually,1995 perhaps? I'll be honest, I have lost track of the number of times I've taken and taught YPT, Exporing/Venturing YPT, and camp staff YPT. It is all a blur. Sadly YPT is needed. I have dealt with too many YP issues over the years.

We had this come up since all folks going to summer camp had to be "registered leaders" with the BSA. Camp the troop went to told us to register the parent as an MBC.

HORSEHOCKEY! The official record for all Scouts is their handbook. I've seen too many problems with electronic records over the years. And every time they fixed them they used the handbook. But yes, Scoutbook is replacing IA.

In my 25+ years as a Scouter, this has happened to me multiple times in multiple councils.I have encountered the attitude that because I don't have beads, I know nothing. It doesn't matter that I am a product of the program, or the training I've taken, or the training I've staffed. Heck it doesn't matter that folks are now receiving their 3rd or 4th beads for staffing the course I took and staffed back in the day.It doesn't matter what district and council programs I've worked on, staffed, or organized. Because I don't wear two beads, I don't know squat. I gotta laugh at some things so I don't get ticked off. Best laughs was one district committee I was ona 20+ years ago as OA Chapter Advisor. We were trying to plan something or another (old age getting to me), and I suggested solutions to some problems that were being brought up that I encountered running JLTC at the site we were going to use. I was completely ignored by the other planners except my friend, who was a 3 beader. When he made the exact same suggestions, everyone listened and agreed with them. Another time with the same committee, were were organizing another activity. This time they listened, but said what I was proposing was not feasible, it would never work, etc. My 3 beader friend was there and waited about 10 minutes before smiling at me, and gives them my proposal almost verbatim. Rest of the committee though it was sheer brilliance.

Remember when YPT was suppose to be one time only? I do.

Yes, I was referring to the "full time position" on the district committee. ASMs, Mates, ACMs, MCs, Pack Trainers, ADLs, and yes the "Red Jackets" should be the ones in those district level positions.

This is my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt. I do not think SMs, Skippers, CMs, and CAs should be working on the district level except as MBCs. They need to focus on their units. I also do not recommend DLs and WDLs serving on the district, except as MBCs and day camp staff, because they are the primary direct contact leader for their dens. Serving on the district and council level can be overwhelming, time consuming, and does take away from their Cubs. I've done it, and I wish I would not have.

I am not happy about the Den Method being implemented on Scouts. "Train 'em. Trust 'em. LET THEM LEAD!"

WOW!!!!!!!! That's not how a course is supposed to be run. And like Chris1 said, I've known GSUSA volunteers to go through BSA training, and use BSA materials, because fo the challenges with their GSUSA council. I do not know if others do this, but one thing I do is IF I know someone has a lot of experience in a subject area AND they are going through the course as a student, is that I have them teach the specific area. For example, backpacking and land nav expert ( Eagle, Philmont 2x, summer camp staffer) was a student. First Aid expert was a combat medic who also is an Eagle and went to Philmont. IF I would have known about you, sometimes I get the info in advance, most of the time not, I wouyld have used you on staff.

@cocomax, Was it BALOO or IOLS? While my Cub Scout Leader BALOO class was mostly lecture, handouts, and whiteboards, LNT wasn't a topic. yes, it was boring, especially with all the experience I had. Why when I taught BALOO, it was a lot more hands on and fun. IOLS is suppsoe to be hands on with camping. LNT is part of it, but not to that extreme.

One reason why folks need to use librarians for research. Anyone remember "Mitochondria: Structure, Function, and Clinical Relevance" by Drs. Lucas McGeorge and Annette Kin ? The garbage was published in the International Journal of Molecular Biology: Open Access, Austin Journal of Pharmacology and Therapeutics, and the American Research Journal of Biosciences. The American Journal of Medical and Biological Research accepted the paper, however, they asked for a $360 fee, which the author declined to pay.

When there was Cub Scout Trainer Wood Badge and Boy Scout Leader Wood Badge ( Sorry I cannot tell you about Explorer WB, before my time), you had to have a MINIMUM of two years in the program's WB course you were registering for in order to participate. And it was 2 separate programs that focused on specifics on either Cub Scouts or Boy Scouts. And when there was Explorere Leader WB, it focused on Exploring. Currently there is no minimum tenure requirement,. or if there is , it is not adhered to, and councils want bodies for the classes. Also since the current course is trying to cram 3 programs into one course, I feel a lot of program specific information is left out. I see it with some WB not having the basic knowledge, skills, and abilities Actually yes I do. National is not concerned about what the boots on the ground want. Best example of that would be the "InstaPalm" poll where 94% of those surveyed were either AGAINST (16%) or STRONGLY AGAINST (78%) doing away with tenure, but they did it anyway. And let's not forget, there is a lot of evidence, as posted in other threads on this topic, to show that the decision was made prior to the town halls. The speed and timing of the town halls, the biased poll questions, the release of gender neutral applications before the town halls were even announced, statements by Surbaugh that big changes were coming, ad nasueum Or they will do what many here and on Facebook are doing, becoming de facto coed dens. @DeanRx said coed troops will be the norm in 5 years. I say, 2 years, 3 tops. Heck as soon as they announced separate troops, they came back a few months later with Linked Troops. As for recruiting volunteers, a lot of them will have no experience with BSA's programs. That will make programming interesting. and if enough people complain, the program WILL change. Look at the current Cub Scout program. There was a team that s[pend several years coming up with the June 2015- December 2016 program. IMHO it was a good program. Did it take more planning to implement? Yes. Was it doable? YES. Was a lot of information provided to implement the changes? Yes, but I personally could have loved it coming out sooner. But folks who didn't attend the RTs going over this had problems. Packs not willing to adapt complained. and the progream changed. Enough girls complain, and the program will change. A lot of Scouts feel pressured to keep their mouths shut on this matter. There is a lot of societal pressure to accept it and be done. But what is interesting is that when my troop did an anonymous online poll, 50% of the troop will leave if we become a linked troop. Regarding the true impact of LDS withdrawal and membership loss due to girls is easy to calculate. Don't include the LDS membership figures when calculating loss or gain? After all, National didn't include LDS membership in the western region when they did their poll on whether or not to accept homosexual youth a few years back. Again subtract the LDS numbers from the current membership, and go from there. True Scouting is for the youth. But someone must stand up for the developmental needs of the boys. The program was created with them in mind. Boys are suffering in our society. Higher drop out rates, higher crime rates, higher drug usage,lower percentage going to college, etc. Someone needs to look out for them. Yes,.

I'd expand upon this. Even Scouters WITH experience as a youth, may have it wrong because of their youth experiences. I know of one Eagle Scout SM who does not like to camp. He came up in the 1970s ISP and rarely went camping. If the weather is not going to be picture perfect, he cancels. Doesn't understand the need for all the camping, when earning Eagle is the goal. I knew another Eagle whose troop was micromanaged by the SM. While active, the SM was the one deciding on trips, dictating cooking requirements, etc. Long story short, he ran his troop the same exact way. And don't even try get him to training, He's an Eagle and knows what to do. Regarding Wood Badge and other training. 1) Training has been dumbed down since I went through it many years ago. So much is left out. I think the current training gives some folks a false sense of knowledge and security. 2) The current Wood Badge, in an attempt to be "One size fits all" does not do enough justice to the programs. It does not cover the different programs adequately enough. And from what I've read and seen, the material for Scouts in the course use to be covered in the old Scoutmaster Fundamentals training.