Eagle94-A1

With CSDC and folks working on their own, my former pack's advancement was asynchronous. The only thing that folks waited on was AOL and Cross Over. My youngest was finished with AOL 2 months before the last member of his den finished it. He started attending Troop meetings as a guest prior to Cross Over to not be bored.

The rise of Merit Badge Universities (MBUs) has increased the number of MBs folks are earning. With COVID, Virtual MBUs with 100+ kids taking an online class has from all over the world has. Some folks recently were averaging 7.5 MBs per week. From what I have seen, experienced, and heard about, I got real questions about the thoroughness of these virtual sessions.

The same could be said for councils and National. I know of councils not fulfilling their end of the paperwork, yet signing anyway. And as for insurance, no limits were ever discussed or mentioned in the paperwork people signed.

I have only read about one person being reinstated. He was removed for going into a bar in uniform. Reason he went into the bar in uniform was the Scout Bus broke down, and the bar was the closest place he walked to that had a phone to call a tow truck and contact parents. He followed the appeals process and got back months later. The people I know who have been removed have never been reinstated, including the one where the criminal investigation cleared the person of wrongdoing, and even found evidence to support her story of events.

Don't I know it. I was promised that the situation would be solved back in 1998 with SCOUTNET 2000.

Why should I be surprised. Risk Management folks STILL are lying about "Dodgeball has never been an approved BSA activity," even after I cited multiple references to Dodgeball in BSA literature dating to 1929 AND screen captured a SCOUTING.ORG webpage showing it is an approved game even after the ban (they quickly took it down). Why do I feel like I am in 1984?

And therefore won't be able to record it. Not that SCOUTBOOK / Internet advancement is accurste. Reviewing my records today, and of course 30+ years are missing. Heck it is still not showing i am an Eagle.

Will Scoutbook and/or Internet Advancement allow it?

Apparently yes, Webelos 1s can no longer earn it due to the new rule. Don't get me started on this nonsense. Webelos is suppose to be a transition period, getting Cub Scouts ready for Scouts BSA. In Scouts BSA, you can advance to Star and Life only using Eagle required MBs. Why can't Webelos? Also if you want to prepare them for Scouts BSA, the sooner the better. Waiting until they are in 5th grade for them to earn Scouting Adventure is too late.

Even some of the restricted camps will be reverting back to the trusts because councils can't afford the overhead post bankruptcy. We have a small camp that will revert to the trust because of overhead.

Officially there is no place to wear them. The Aquatics Supervision course patches are not considered temporary insignia, nor is it stated they could be worn on swim trunks, just "Swimming & Water Rescue, cloth, No. 10862; recognizes successful completion of Swimming & Water Rescue Training." and "Paddle Craft Safety, cloth, No. 18063; recognizes successful completion of Paddle Craft Safety Training." from this link. https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/33066/33066_Universal_and_Nonunit_Insignia_WEB.pdf?_gl=1*w220wt*_ga*ODIxNzM2MDM3LjE2MjUyMzgzMDM.*_ga_20G0JHESG4*MTYyNjE5OTI0Ny4zLjEuMTYyNjE5OTQ5NS4xNw.. Considering they are certifications like BSA Lifeguard and BSA Aquatics Instructor and not awards like Mile Swim and Kayaking BSA, I have worn my 2 Aquatics Supervision patches on the right leg of my swim trunks.

Nor did he play the Global Thermonuclear War game. I hear it is a MAD game, worse than Tic Tac Toe. 🤣

This is anecdotal and hearsay, but from my perspective it appears dead on. The ones with the youth experience tend to leave, and the "good" DEs have no prior experience. I know when I eas a DE, most of us with youth experience left due to frustration. We did not see our upper management living the Oath and Law. We became disillusioned with the movement. And talking to other former pros, that has been their experience as well. Hearsay is what one high level council pro once told me: the best DEs and pros have no youth experience. They have no preconceived notions of thd job, and are "objective" when it comes to goals.

I think both you and @yknot are on to something Leadership does indeed play a role, but it is the CUB SCOUT, or more specifically WEBELOS LEVEL (emphasis) adult leadership, and not the Scouts BSA level. If things are happening elsewhere as I have seen them happening locally, and from some of the pushback I get for my advice on other forums I believe it is a national problem, Webelos leaders are not making the transition from Cub Scouts to Scouts BSA. Webelos leaders are NOT helping to transition from adult lead to self responsibility like the Webelos Program was intended. Thus when the new Scouts and their parents join a troop they are overwhelmed. When Webelos leaders do their jobs properly, the Webelos are ready for the transition. And more importantly the parents. When my old troop had a Webelos Castaway Adventure Overnighter, two different Webelos Dens from two different packs showed up. One den began the transition from Cub Scouts to Boy Scouts as soon as the Cubs became Webelos. The WDL and AWDL started to slowly began giving responsibility to the Webelos, and kept reminding the parents to let the Scouts do it themselves. The other den kept treating the Webelos like Cub Scouts, with the parents still doing things for their kids. On the camp out, the first den had their members complete their survival shelters and started cooking their meals before the second den's parents even completed the group shelter. Yep the parents built the shelter, not the kids. After congratulating themselves on the group survival shelter, the second den left while the first den stayed behind and had fun. That was 5 years ago. 100% ( 10 Scouts) of the first den is still involved in Scouting. Out of the second den, 80% (8 Scouts) left between 3 and 12 months, and a 9th Scout left within 2 years. Only one remains. And he and his parents had an extremely hard time adjusting to the differences between Cub Scouts and Scouts BSA. And IMHO, National is not helping them matter. Not only is the online training inadequate, but also they are mandating that before you can work on AOL required badges, you must earn the Webelos badge. So You now you cannot earn the Scouting Adventure badge until March of 4th grade at the earliest for most packs that start up in September. They really need to begin the transition in September of 4th grade, during the summer between 3rd and 4th if you are meeting.

Could the NDA be with National and the Ad Hoc committee?

My experiece is similar to others, if you have a good program, that thr Scouts have ownership of, they will stay. Our 2 last Eagles have stayed around doing stuff. In fact one is at camp now, taking some fun MBs.

I concur with the new Scouters with no experience as youth sentiments. The good ones will listen to your advice, allow you to mentor them, etc. The bad ones will get all their training, then ignore it and your attempts to mentor them, then complain when Scouts transfer out or not join. The worse will tell you you don't know what you are talking about, Scouting needs to change with the times, call you names, or even curse you out.

Anyone at Raven Knob this week? Wondering who else is here.

My understanding was that each council was given a dollar amount based upon not only unrestricted AND limited restriction assets but also number of abuse cases against it. I do not know if SOL also plays a part of that. I say limited restrictions as well because I have been informed that 1 or 2 of the 4 council camps in my council will need to be sold. All have limited restrictions on them.

Once upon a time, BSA DID allow units to come up with and use BSA logos. Heck they sold CD-ROMs with BSA trademarked images so that units could create their own recruiting flyers, letterhead, patches, etc. I have two of those disks at home somewhere, and the images can be found on Macscouter.com. Heck the "newer" disk, the one I got from 1998, had the Venturing logo in maroon and gold in addition to the green and gold. But that changed somewhere in the mid to late 2000s. BSA's marketing department started cracking down on local printers and patch makers.

Caveat, I am a former professional. Regarding DEs, a GOOD DE (major emphasis) is worth their weight in platinum. They can provide a lot of assistance to their units. And I don't mean picking up and dropping off paperwork and supplies to and from council office. The problem is that most new DEs are just out of college with little to no experience in Scouting, let alone as a Scouter. If they have experience with Scouting, it is usually as a Cub Scout or Scout. When I went to PDL-1 back in the day, out of 72 new professionals (71 new DEs and Exploring Execs. 1 "retread" professional was Director of Development who had to redo professional training because it was over 5-10 years since he left the profession), less than 20 had any experience as an adult Scouter. Of the Group that did have experience, the bulk of them were either military retirees looking for a post-service career, or folks looking to start a new career. I want to say 3-5 of us had experience as adult Scouters during college, i.e. summer camp staff, attending a local college and remaining active in our units or OA, etc. So one of the reasons for the high turnover is the lack of preparedness for the new folks. They just are ready for all the demands of the job. Job descriptions and interviews do not adequately describe the full responsibilities. Another reason is pay. The pay is low for the skill set required for the job. Almost all of the DEs I knew who quit either went to the private sector and doubled their salaries ( in one case tripling the DE salary) or they went back to school. DEs are on call 24/7, and it does take it's toll. Especially if you are a newlywed like I was. But the biggest reason many DEs left when I was a DE was the hostile culture in the professional ranks and unreasonable demands and goals. While growth is important, the unreasonable demands to XYZ growth and focus on quantity over quality is why many new units fail within a few years, and why existing units tend to get neglected. And the threats and intimidation by the higher ranks to meet immediate goals, regardless of other issues that if fixed would increase retention long term, was extreme. I cannot tell you how stressful and exhausting it was to try and fix problems AND start new units the right way, while being under constant pressure and hostility from management to get membership and unit numbers up. Two of my coworkers had nervous breakdowns, and I was on my way to one. Thankfully, my wife saw what the job was doing to me, and gave me an ultimatum: her or the job. The irony was that supporting her was one of the reasons I stuck with the job as long as I did.

Be careful what you wish for. My council is down to 1 Professional and the office staff. 2 consultants, retired pros, are currently running things on a temporary basis until we hire a SE. I can tell you right now, it is a mess.

When we conducted our own summer camp last year, we did a block format for the entire troop. They did not like it, but understood why it was done, and the complaining was minimal. But there was some. Some things that helped was that A) we got some input from the Scouts. B) we adjusted the schedule as needed. While the adults did the bulk of the planning, i.e. the adults were rushing find a place, get MBCs out there, put together a plan etc, we did have a PLC meeting to go over everything that was being planned and see if they liked it, had alternatives, etc. Program was changed based upon their input (NO to Environmental Science, YES to Cycling MB). Overall they were glad to be camping and having fun. And yes we adjusted the schedule to suit their wants. and weather. The day the survival camping was planned was supposed to have thunderstorms, so we moved it up a day. The Bike ride took longer than anticipated, and wore them slam out. We let them have the afternoon off to recuperate. The only thing that we could not change was BORs. We had a hard and fast time for those because the committee was had a set time to visit us for them. Unless it is an absolute emergency, I would not do block scheduling.

You will not hear anything because they had to sign Non-Disclosure Agreements in order to be part of the deal. That question, and others related to the lawsuit were asked recently at a meeting. All they could say was property would need to be sold to pay the council's share. EDITED: Best information I have found on the topic is reviewing all the case docs that @CynicalScouter and others have been posting. I cannot speak for others, but for me it is the outrageous monthly fees on both sides that is upsetting. I would rather that money go to the victims directly. Again for me, the lawyers getting a large percentage ( I hope it's not the 40% someone posted, but even 35% which I am told is the average is too high IMHO) is also upsetting. I would rather 85-90% of the fund go the victims instead of 65-60% BUT I will give credit, where credit is due. The TCC lawyers did promised, give 10% of their earning back to the fund. Wish BSA's lawyers would do the same.

@yknot I AM SO SORRY ABOUT YOUR SITUATION! I have encountered parents and units like that. And making the change to a more youth-led and fun unit is extremely challenging when you do not have support. I am dealing with one grandmother right now who is just like that. She has custody of the grandson, and is forcing him to stay in Scouting and is pushing him very hard to be an Eagle. Nice kid, doesn't cause major problems thankfully, but it is very obvious he has no interest in Scouting. When it was time to turn in MB class schedules, he didn't have the paperwork, and had no idea what his grandmother signed him up for. He messaged her for the schedule, but between when he and I received it (she sent it to both of us and it was not the form we sent out so it made no sense anyway) We had him 1/2 way through picking the MBs he wanted to take. SHE WAS FURIOUS. Thankfully she got over it. This will be the first time she has not gone to a summer camp or winter camp to make sure he is taking the MBs she signed him up for. And here is the funny thing. Before he had no interest whatsoever in summer camp. Now that he made his own choices, his interest has perked up some. I am hoping the week away from grandmother and having fun will change his outlook. Forgot to add, in my experience, if you focus on fun and adventure, the Scouts stick around a lot longer. Advancement may be slower, but they tend to stick around even after making Eagle. Current troop has an 18 y.o. ASM and 17 Y.O. Eagle Scout who are having fun. Another troop had a group having so much fun, that they formed a Venture patrol and organized one final HA trip before they left for college. Two troops I was involved with had alumni stick around as ASMs and attend functions and camp when they could. And one troop formed a Venturing Crew so they could have some fun outside of the troop.