Eamonn

"All the really kewl guys on this forum are from PA," I'll go along with that. But the kewlest are from tother end of state! Ea.

Skipper, While I'm OK with going along with what works! I kinda think that for me, what you are trying to do has a little bit too much starch?? All of us, adults and youth are in this organization for fun, the kids join not to have a character overhaul or because they have a yearning to learn about making ethical choices. The adults remain in because they like what they are doing. The best "Adult Leadership Teams" are made up of people who are friends and are able to get along with each other. (Having fun.) I don't in any way want or wish to put down any of the people that I have met over the years. But the other day I was thinking about people who make the program work and really come to life. The list I came up with wasn't very long, in fact I only came up with two people! One a very close and dear friend, the other a Sea Scouter from another state. Both of these guys, just seem to have a wonderful way of selling the program to the youth they serve. Both are wonderful communicators, both have found a way, even after many years of being leaders to remain enthusiastic and find ways of making things fun and challenging for the youth. These two both have a deep understanding of what the program really is and both have outstanding skills which they are able to pass on to the Scouts, which helps make the program more challenging and more fun. The uniform standard for both units is something to be seen. It is outstanding, not because of any rule or that sort of thing, just because! I have spend over 30 years trying to be a good as one of these guys, the other I only met about five or six years back. For my part, I don't need or want a committee to make me a better leader, I would hope that I would work on that myself. Sure I want the committee to support me in enabling the unit to provide a program that is challenging. Part of the job of the SM or Skipper is having the ASM's or Mates do things the way he wants them done. While I'm all for the BSA training's, but real on the job training is where the rubber meets the road. When I look at both these guys, both have what I'd call charisma. Both really enjoy what they do and have found ways of passing that enjoyment on to the Scouts. Rather than spending time on putting things down on paper, I would use that time to try and get a better grasp of what I was trying to do, look for ways to make things more of a challenge and fun for the Scouts and truly become an Imagineer. Once the Scouts are deeply engrossed in what they are doing, once they are really enjoying what the Troop is doing all the other stuff just seems to fall into place. Ea.

"Gender identity is becoming a huge issue" Where? Somehow it seems not to be an issue where I live! Ea.

I suppose at the end of the day the only thing I can pass on to others is how to be a responsible man. I would hope that when others see me they see someone who is a good husband and father. Someone who lives up to his responsibilities. Not someone who jumps into bed with the next passing woman and who fathers lots of illegitimate children. My hope would be that when young boys see that I can find ways of sorting things out without having to resort to fighting, they might take notice and learn from it. Maybe, I can pass on to others that there is a time to act like the stereotypical man and times when not to. As a male I'm able to set that example, where as a female can only try and teach it. Ea.

Just before I was married I would visit the USA several times a year. I used to stop in at a local bar. The first time I visited I asked for a beer. The guy behind the bar was the owner, asked what type? I said that I knew nothing about American beers, so he gave me a local beer, a Stoneys. It was OK and I thought all American beers were like it. Over the years I stopped in at this bar a fair amount and every-time the guy would put up a Stoneys. I never had the heart to tell him that I didn't like it. As a rule I'd drink a couple and change to scotch. About 15 years went by and one day this guy was playing in my golf tournament and he caught me with a Bass Ale. He was a little surprised. I explained that I'd never really liked Stoneys and was afraid that I might upset him. We both laughed. I think that there comes a time when we all work out what we really like and what we don't. When it comes to dealing with our own kids we can if we want take the hard line. Sometimes this is needed and necessary. But sometimes it just isn't worth the fight. Many times I've found that taking plenty of no notice is the best way to deal with things and all to often things have a way of working themselves out. Chances are that if this Lad feels that he is being forced into doing something, he will rebel against it all and find a way of walking away from it all. My son had a 101 reasons why he wasn't going to complete his Eagle Scout rank. His mother had bought all the Eagle Scout table cloths, napkins and cups and was saying how she wanted the room in the cupboard. He said that his reason for completing it was because Camp Staffers with Eagle got paid a $100 bonus at the end of the summer. I tend to think that there was more to it than that and this was his way of saving face. I don't know your son, each and every Lad is different. Some are very goal oriented and need a goal in order to move from point A to point B. Sadly all to often the goal really isn't their goal, just something that will please others, much like a good grade on a report card. Worse still is when the goal over-rides everything leaving no room for any real learning and any real fun. I really don't think that a lot of people who really haven't experienced scouts and scouting from the inside really understand it. Maybe having one of the relatives who made Eagle talk to your good Lady and explain that Eagle isn't all that there is to Scouting might be a good idea. Ea.

Can't help feeling that I'm walking on egg shells! I do not in any way consider myself to be Sexist, chauvinistic or hold any prejudices toward females. I do however think that young men and boys need male role models. As my son was growing up I watched as the posters on his bedroom wall changed. When he was little the walls were covered with posters from Disney movies. (He really liked 101 Dalmatians) As he grew up the posters changed and the walls were covered with posters of male athletes, mainly soccer and basketball players. There are of course a lot of great female athletes but they never made it to his bedroom walls. Much as he loves his mother, there were a couple of years when he was 15 and 16 when it seemed all that they (Him and his Mother) could do was disagree and argue. Mostly over things that were so trivial that it wasn't worth fighting about. When he would come to me, I was kinda stuck in the middle, much I agreed with him that his Mother might have been out of line? I also felt the need not to allow him to disrespect his mother. When it came time for "The Talk"! All the stuff about sex and responsibility this was very firmly placed on my plate. He said he was far more comfortable talking with me than his mother. I'll admit that I wasn't that comfortable, but I just can't imagine HWMBO talking with him about masturbation. We have at work talked a lot about the breakdown of the family especially in the homes of young African American males. So many of the young men that we see in jail come from families where there was no male role model. These young men have joined gangs because they need someone to look up too. I'm sure that when it comes to skills there are many females who perform as good or even better than males, the same can be said about males who work in jobs that were traditionally done by females. I also strongly believe that men can be as caring and nurturing as females. But even at my age there are times when I feel the need to just hang out with "The Boys". Even after being married to HWMBO for going on 30 years, there are things that she does that I just don't understand! But, I have learned that it's OK for me not to understand. A few weeks back on the PBS Nature program there was a documentary about Bald Eagles. One male Eagle had lost his mate, so he went to get a new one. He was trying to impress her, showing her his skills in nest building. He made trip after trip to the nest, bringing a twig or some grass. Each time he very carefully placed the item that he'd brought and each and every time the female would move it to another place. It seems that all female Eagles do this. Even in nature we see that there are differences between males and females. This doesn't in any way make one the better sex or the other the weaker sex, just different. Today when I look at my son, I see that there are things that he got from both of his parents.I'd like to say that all the good stuff came from me! But that isn't the case. He has been brought up to respect everyone, but also to use good manners, doing things like holding a door open for a woman or giving up his seat to a lady. He has been exposed to some very strong females both physically and emotionally strong. Even today when he is close to his 22 birthday there are times when he will choose which parent he feels will best deal with whatever it might be that he is trying to deal with. Rather than trying to fight the differences between the sexes, we do better to embrace them and work together using the differences for our benefit. Eamonn.

A few thoughts. I'd look at what the options are. 1/ Return all the tickets and inform the Council that the unit is not selling them. 2/Restrict the sale. Sell only to people who order them from an adult who can be contacted. Maybe an email to the friends and families in the unit, when they hand over the cash they receive the ticket. 3/ Set a date to sell the tickets and manage it the same way as wreaths in a blitz day was done. 4/ Limit the number of tickets you give each Scout to sell to only a few (3 or 5 tickets.) and keep your fingers crossed! That everything works out OK. I'm a real softie when it comes to buying stuff from a cute little kid who knocks on my door. I really dislike popcorn, but will buy it. The Girl Scouts no longer sell my favorite cookie, but I still buy a few boxes. I'm not so sure that I'd want to buy a ticket ahead of time to see the Blue Angels. Not when I know that I can buy a ticket on the day at the door. It is un lightly that the event will be a sell out, so I'm almost certain that I'd get in. I'm way too cheap to buy a load of tickets not knowing what the weather would be like on the day. Most of the stuff I buy from kids who knock on my door doesn't involve a big sum of money. I'm not sure that I'd be willing to hand over $100.00 or more on the spur of the moment. A few years back there was a big golf tournament at a course in our Council (Not sure which one, but Tiger Woods was to play.) The Council was given a lot of tickets. The tickets had a face value of $75.00 the Council was selling them for $50.00 with the idea that the unit would keep half and the unit the other half. It turned out that everyone in the free world had been given a load of these tickets. So many that it was just impossible to sell them. The Ship took 100 and tried selling them to the CO (The local Elks.) But the Elks had been given so many tickets that they were having a hard time just giving them away for nothing. We ended up selling just one ticket and returning 99. The organizer of the event really thought that he was doing a great thing giving these tickets to everyone, he just went a little overboard. Even though the tickets did have some value, the cost to the Council was zero as the tickets were given at no cost. So while of course everyone should be held accountable, I'm not sure if going after a Lad for a ticket that was truly lost is exactly kosher? Eamonn

dScouter15 Somewhere along the line you lost me! I have to the best of my knowledge never picked up a law book in my life. Everything I think I know about the law is stuff that I've been told or I have been led to believe is the law. Even when I'm driving I see the posted speed limit and most times follow it, because I think it is the law. I do carry a State photo ID which has a red band on it, which I have been told when there is a state of emergency allows to to drive faster than the posted limit. I haven't ever taken the time to look this up. But being as I was informed of this in an email from Pennsylvania Sectary for Corrections (My big boss!) I'm happy to take his word for it! I like to think I'm a person who uses common sense. I know and am aware that sometimes there is some risk in this. If a Lad at summer camp came to me telling me that he had diarrhea, I'd more than lightly offer him the right sized dose of OTC medication that would help. I think in 99.9999% of most cases he would either get better and everything would be fine or if he didn't we would seek professional help and he'd get better and again everything would be fine. There is I suppose a risk that he might not know and I defiantly wouldn't know that he was allergic to the medication and something bad might happen. In a perfect world I should have contacted his parents and got their OK before giving it to him! But for the sake of this post! Lets say I didn't! I have heard that I might be guilty of all sorts of things! Truth is that I have no idea what I might be guilty of! I do know that I'd never knowingly harm or hurt a Scout. So there would be no intent on my part. The BSA might have something somewhere that says I shouldn't do this (So far I've yet to see it and I guess I might be willing to ignore it anyway!) So as things are right now, I don't think I would have broken any laws. If the Lad had some nasty things happen to him because of my giving him the medication, I suppose his parents could file a suit against me and there is a good chance that they would win. In fact I think they should win. (In this new information age, I would try and contact the parent to cover my tail.) I'm not saying that I know what the law is or isn't. I'm not trying to set myself above the law. I might be taking a risk. I would never tell anyone that they should be willing to take the same risks that maybe I'm willing to take. I think at the end of the day each of us knows how much risk we are willing to bear. Some people want to have every last piece of information and know all the ins and outs before they are willing to make a move. That's fine, if that's how they want to go about things. Some people are so worried that something bad will happen that the end up doing nothing. I think that's a shame but in some ways I do understand it. While it might be good that someone is willing to explain to me the risk I might be taking. The last thing I need is some sanctimonious poop who knows as little about the law as I do, quoting chapter and verse about something he or she has no knowledge of. Ea.

"The principle consumers of the BSA program are parents." Boy oh Boy! I hope that isn't true! Have given this thread a little more thought! I do think that it's a shame that at times when I try to explain the Quartermaster Award to the unwashed. I at times have to fall back and call it a Sea Scout Eagle! While I'm not anti-advancement, I'll bet that I could provide a Scouting program without having to use the Advancement Method. As it is (Or should I say was, when I was actively working with youth members!) I always seemed to be playing catch up with the Scouts. Every now and then a Scout would corner me and ask if I'd update his book. We would spend the next half hour or so going over what he'd done, when he'd done it and at times how often he'd done it. Whatever we had done, we done because that was what we were doing. We very rarely did something because it was a requirement needed for advancement. I suppose the argument could be made that if it wasn't important the Scout wouldn't be cornering me! But there are times when we have covered the requirements and the Scout hasn't known that we have. When I talk with adults who have been Scouts they seem to want to dwell and talk about what they did as Scouts, places they went and activities they participated in. My eye doctor is an Eagle Scout, but get him talking about Philmont and it's hard to get away from him. As for: "The principle consumers of the BSA program are parents." I'm happy that parents are willing to support and at times pay for the program. But in my book the real consumers are the youth. I think old Lord BP and all that stuff about a game with a purpose (If he ever did really say that?) Has it right. Kids join Scouts to have fun, when they don't have fun or stop having fun they leave. All th good stuff that we might be able to do or pass on is lost when the Scout leaves or stops attending. If the truth be told, I don't think my on was a true member of his Troop for a couple of years.(This went hand in hand with him being able to drive at 16.) Sure he was on the charter, he had a uniform with the Troop number on. But he tended to look in when he didn't have anything better to do. When he did look in, there wasn't anything for him to do, so he hung out talking with others who had looked in or chatting with a few ASM's. Then he left, not returning for several weeks until he looked in again. Sure he did complete his Eagle Scout Rank. But even with his project most of the people who worked with him were guys from the OA and pals from school. Eagle Scout rank did keep him on the books. But I'd hope there is more to all of this than just being a name on paper? Ea.

I do at times think "We" (Maybe not me?) Tend to allow somethings in Scouting to get ... A little more than what they really are. I think Wood Badge is wonderful, but at the end of the day it is just another training course. I was very much the proud father when OJ received his Eagle Scout Award. I'm happy when I see almost any Lad receive the award. For me I see one big problem with or maybe I should say about? The Eagle Scout Award is who it really belongs to? Again for me, I'd love to see the award (Rank) belong entirely to the Scout. In a perfect world (My perfect world?) The Eagle should belong the Scout. It should all be about him: His goals, his attitude, his work toward earning it and once awarded it should be him who should know deep down in his heart as to if he has really earned it and deserves it. From a marketing point of view the BSA has done a wonderful job of "Selling" the Eagle Scout Award and allowing it to be maybe a little more than at times it really is. I can see both pros and cons if the Award was no longer there. I keep hearing about the "5%" Thing?? I have never really worked out how anyone comes up with this. Is it 5% of the boys who at one time have joined Scouts? Being as we tend to lose a big percentage of the Lads who join, this 5% thing seems a little meaningless. In the area where I live we have Troops where it seems that almost every Lad who hangs around after the age of 14 or 15 is going to make Eagle. I watched OJ as he went through Scouting. When he was a little fellow he really enjoyed all the recognition that went along with badges and rank advancement. I think part of this was in some way in his mind a way of pleasing HWMBO and me. As he got older he kinda out grew the Troop he was in, became more involved in th OA and all that entailed, only needing the Troop because without it he couldn't belong to the OA. He didn't like in any way the people who tried to push him into completing his Eagle and when he looked and saw some of the people his age who in his eyes were not worthy of the award receiving it, he seen it as being worthless. Part of the reason he did complete it was because the camp paid an extra $100 to Camp Staff members who had it! Much as I know it is wrong to generalize and I'm very much aware that there are exceptions to every rule, I'm not really sure that the very young Lads who receive the award are really capable of knowing if they have really earned it? I'm not sure it they might be still trying to please other people. But then again I'm unsure if this is a good or a bad thing! To the best of my knowledge advancement of some kind has been around in Scouting all over the world since it started. For the most part it has served us well. If all we were to do if we done away with the Eagle Scout Award were to replace it with something else? I think it would serve little or no purpose. When I was a Lad in the UK, a Scout could earn the Chief Scouts Award as a Scout, but had to be a Venture Scout before he started working on the Queen's Scout Award. As he (Or she) couldn't be a Venture Scout until he or she was 16, I tend to think that the Queen's Scout Award entailed a lot more work and the people who received it had put more thought into it. But I'll admit to having a bias. Some time back I started a thread that I think was titled "What if we did away with Advancement?" I do think we could do away with it, but I don't think we would want to. Done right it is a very good thing, sadly it seems more and more that the goal (Eagle) is being allowed to overshadow all the really good stuff that Scouts and Scouting should be about. This doesn't make the Eagle Scout award bad, it should mean that we have to take a closer look at what we are doing, how we communicate what we are doing and what we are about. I'd really like to see the award become a little more difficult entailing more community service and more outdoor challenges. Eamonn

Why do they do that? Was watching Friday Night Lights on TV this past Friday. One of the main characters was send to do an internship with an artist who was more than a little of base, working in scrap metal, in a very dirty pair of y-fronts and nothing else. Deep down I think I in some ways envy this guy. I'm about as artistic as a cauliflower that's been overcooked. While I have tried to follow paths that have interested me and made me feel good and worth while. For the most part my primary goal has been about making money. I needed money to provide for myself and my family. Money made things work a lot better and made my life a lot easier. Even today when I don't need the money as much as I once did, providing for my family is still my main goal. I'm lucky that I have found a job that I like and one where I think in some small way I might make a bit of a difference. The money I have made has also at times done some good for some others. Last week I was following a thread, which I didn't participate in. (Someone else had done a much better job of saying what I would have said.) In this thread someone posted that young people are not good at time management and goal setting. I'm not sure how true or false this might be. It did however get my little gray cells working. I kept asking myself "What is the job of a kid?" Not just a Scout but a kid. I do have some thoughts on this but I'm hoping to post them after I have put this out there. So what is the job of a kid? What do we expect from them and for them? Are we happy for them to find their own way? If so how much risk are we willing to tolerate? Ea.

"Is there a BSA policy on how to discipline Adult Leaders? No there isn't. The BSA has however written a fair amount about the selection of leaders. While I don't know how it came to be that these adults were selected? I do know that very often when we allow positions to be filled with a warm body the end result is problems. Here in the forum, we can go on about Chartering Organizations and COR's. I'm not entirely sold on how active or involved these are? Back when I was the CM for a Pack chartered by the R/C Church I attend. I was left with filling and finding the people who would serve on the Committee, I hand picked the COR and we went through 3 Committee Chairs in that many years. The PP would sign just about anything I placed in front of him or left with his secretary to be signed. So I'm not sold on he idea that when we have problems we can just pass the buck. - No matter what the books might say. It is worth always remembering that we deal with adults, we need to remember that they are adults and need to be treated as adults. When someone is messing up and there are problems these need to be dealt with as soon and as quickly as is possible. Not doing so only allows the problem to grow and fester. It helps if one person is given the task of sorting these problems out. It needs to be understood from the get go that this person is doing this and that he or she needs all the support they can get, even if the outcome isn't what some people want or expect. This person needs to find the right time and place to explain to the wrong doers what they are not doing right and why it's not right. This person needs to be able to deal with the problem at hand, not dive back into ancient history or go over things that have no bearing on what the real problem is. In most cases when done right this will solve the problem. Sometimes the wrong doer will get so upset that they will get mad and quit. While this is sad, sometimes it is for the best. Sometimes they will continue to hang around and be un-willing to change. When this happens steps have to be taken to remove them. This will, no matter how uninvolved the CO is mean that someone from the CO will have to step up to the plate. Having the CO remove them will save the CO from any embarrassments and save the Pack leadership from having to defend what happened. It was the CO who removed them not "The Pack". None of us are perfect, just because we put on a Scout uniform doesn't make us so. Everyone deserves our respect, especially people who are willing to volunteer their time to work for the kids in our communities. It can be all to easy to dwell on the thing that some people do wrong and become blind to the things that they do well and right. Sometimes a person with a ax to grind can become a bigger problem than anyone else. Ea.

A lot of people might say that I'm a member of the "Good Old Boys" I know I'm not as young as I used to be. I'm also, without going into detail a "Boy" So that only leaves the "Good"? Still working on that one. While I like to think that I try to welcome and make the new faces I see feel at ease. I have to admit that when I get together with the guys that I've known for a very long time, we do tend to pull each others legs, laugh, joke and of course tell war stories about each other. I have been around for a while and it seems that most people know me and many have known me for a long time. I don't think when we get together that we are in anyway trying to be rude or avoid new people, we just know so much more about each other that we have a lot to talk about and share. Over the years I have picked up a fair amount of knots, medals, beads, dingle-dangles -Call them what you will. I'll admit that I enjoyed my time in the lime-light. While I know that there are others who deserve as much recognition as I've received and more maybe more so. I have been honored and pleased to accept them. I have sat on a good many District Award of Merit selection committees and have been somewhat taken back by how few people take the time to fill in the nomination form. I've also sat on the Silver Beaver selection committee a few times. I'm unsure how many Scouters we have in our Council, but I've never sat on the Beaver committee when there has been more than 15 names put in. I think at times some of these awards are given to people either because there are so few names put in or because all the "Good Old Boys" already have the award. I think that was the case when I received the Silver Antelope. Just about everyone else on the committee I was on had it already. I know the only reason I was selected to be a CD for Wood Badge was because I'd been around for a while, knew the other Good Old Boys and these guys had put my name on the list. -Still I like to think that I did a good job. I would never ever in a million years take anything away from the people who do the "Real Work" -The people who work with the youth. In my book the Den Leader who has her own little ones at home is facing all the trials and tribulations that a young parent has to face and still makes time to be a Den Leader is as close to a saint as I'm properly ever going to meet. But on the same hand I know some very busy people who just could never have the time to make a commitment to be at a weekly meeting, who still give what time they can and are very generous with their treasure, sitting on Boards and eating over priced not so great dinners. I think I am a good old boy. I also think the time is about near when I'll call it a day and make room for someone to take my place. I'm OK with being a "Good Old Boy" but I'm not comfortable being an "Old F!*$ " (The Oxford Dictionary used to say it was a small explosion between the legs!) Eamonn.

"so making stuff up in committee is a failure by the adult leadership to live up to the Scout Law." I have been accused of at times seeing things through rose tinted glasses. Never the less. I find it really hard to believe that anyone who is willing to invest the time it takes to be a leader in our organization, is going to want to waste their time by doing stuff that knowingly hurts and harms the kids that we are in the business of serving. Sure at times people do get things wrong. Even the most daffy of things that I have seen and heard of and take my word for it, I've seen and heard of the most daffy! Were in almost every case done with the very best of intentions. I have a son that I love very dearly. (Well - Most of the time!) A long time back I gave some thought to what was best for both of us. I of course wanted him to know that I cared for him. I wanted to feel needed and really wanted to share in what he was doing. He yearned for his Independence. A good friend of mine, the mother of three sons who are all Eagle Scouts once said to me that the best thing we can give our kids is "Roots and Wings" Roots so they know that they are loved and do have our support (When needed.) Wings so they go out and see the world and try new things. One great thing about Scouts and Scouting is that it offers the kids a great opportunity to spread their wings and become independent in a safe place. The roots are also about the values we as parents give our kids and the values that Scouting has. I have this strange idea that for anyone to be Trustworthy we need to place trust in that person. Be it an adult or a youth. When we lose the trust or are un-willing to trust, things have a way of going haywire. Sure not all Troops are the same, different Troops do things differently. Your son for better or worse opted to join the Troop that he is in. Maybe everything is not as fair as you might like it to be or want it to be. But this isn't about you. Given half a chance I'll bet that your son will spread his wings and learn how to deal with this situation and with a lot more situations that are sure to follow him for the rest of his days on this planet -Long after you and I are gone! Just give him a chance. Ea.

I would hope that I would never go out of my way to hurt or upset people. At times I get a little lost, not knowing what the politically term of the day is today: African American or is it Black? Native American or American Indian? So it goes on. Last week, for work I had to attend a training given by an outside company on "Dealing with difficult people". It wasn't that great. At one stage the presenter started on about the differences between men and woman. As you might imagine a lot of the females who work in the Department of Corrections tend to be very assertive types. As this guy started, I sat there thinking "Hey Buddy, if I were you I just wouldn't go there!" Sure enough in less then 3 minutes he had managed to upset a good many of the woman in the room. Having been born and raised in an Irish Catholic home, I think I was about 27 before I noticed that the entire world wasn't Irish Roman Catholic! (Joke!) I was brought up in the belief that we (Us R/C's) Were right and everyone else was just wrong! - There was no argument about it. Even at Easter (Back then) We would pray that the Jews would one day see the light. As a little fellow I made a point of not saying "For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever and ever. Amen" When I was at Protestant services. (Now this is part of the Mass.) I don't pretend to understand all the rites and rituals of other religions, I have over the years become a lot more open minded and I am of course willing to respect them. HWMBO is not R/C. We agreed before we were married that any children we had would be brought up as Roman Catholics and that when they were old enough they could choose what religion they wanted to follow. She has tagged along with me to Mass every week. It has at times caused some confusion as she lists her religion as Presbyterian and when a form asks Church attended she lists the local R/C church. I'm not that sensitive about my religion. Which in the light of some of what has gone on with some priests molesting children, is at times hard. I don't think that I'm as good a Catholic as my parents or my grandparents were. Maybe because I'm not willing to just accept things the way they did. I have to admit to at times being a little uncomfortable around people who are overly religious and seem to want to change me. When that happens I tend to just close up. I think I'm worried that I might say or do something that might upset them. To be very honest I'm happy when the dogs make a fuss when the Jehovah Witnesses or the young men from the LDS Church knock at the door! It provides me a good excuse not to have to talk with them. When I lived in England I got into it with a very persistent member of the Jehovah Witnesses, who just wasn't going away! I mentioned that just about every other religion seemed to do good outside of their chuch for other, the Catholics ran hospitals and looked after the sick and dying, the Jews did much the same thing as did the Protestants, but I'd never heard of the Jehovah Witnesses doing anything. Looking back, I see that I was not being very kind, but at the time my goal was to close the door and get back to watching the telly! Ea.

How about: Forever Young - Rod Stewart? Come Sail Away - Styx ? A Mother's Prayer - Celine Dion? Where Is The Love? - Blackeyed Peas? Ea.

I've been around Scouting for a while and this question has never come up. The dates, times and location of the committee meeting are out there and everyone knows about them. I'll admit that there has never been an open invitation, but there has never been anything that would say that the meeting is closed. Most committees I have known in Scouting units are made up of parents and people who at one time or another have seemed like people who want to get involved and are willing to serve. At times they might not have known just how willing they were and have needed a little nudge and maybe even a slight amount of arm-twisting. The meetings are for the most part more about a meeting of the minds. A friendly group who want to help get things done for the kids in the unit. Sure there is an agenda, but the minutes tend to be more note-like than what I'd call minute like. The meetings are fairly informal. A vote is un-usual with most things just moving ahead because whatever it is seems to be the right thing to do. Someone once said to me that the one person after your mother that you don't want to upset is your bartender! As a SM or Skipper I found that the last person you want to upset is the Unit Treasurer. Even more so than the Committee Chairman. I think the reason why parents have not attended the meetings is in part because we have never gone out of our way to invite them. Maybe some know that if they were to start attending they would end up with some kind of a job or responsibility? It somehow has just come to be that parents are unwelcome, not because anyone has ever said so or it is in black and white. If and when there have been problems non-committee parents first port of call seems to be the unit leader. If that has been me, I have taken their concerns to the committee or have tended to fix what wasn't right and then reported what I've done to the committee. When I as a leader had a problem that I needed help with my first port of call was to the Committee Chair. While we might be guilty of by-passing the committee, a report of what was done was given to the committee. In over 20 years, other than the one time the committee had to discuss the removal of a Scout, there really has been nothing secret done at these meetings. For the most part Troop and Ship Committee meetings seem to be more like a monthly meeting of good friends, Pack Committee meetings I've been involved with have a slightly different tone. Seems like some of these parents need o learn how to get along with other people a little better? I think this might be because the Pack is split into Dens and at times the "Who is the real leader?" Becomes a little cloudy. In Troops and Ships most of the parents seem to really appreciate the time and energy that the SM or Skipper puts into looking after the Scouts and the leader is the face of the unit. Maybe I'm wrong but it would seem to me that when someone has to ask if the meetings are open or closed? That something somewhere isn't working. I'm not saying for a minute that markrvp is the problem, but if the problem he has is not being sorted out? I very much doubt that the Troop Committee will sort it out. Chances are that the SM will already have had the ear of the Chairman and the Chair will side with the SM. This might sound un-fair, but in most units it's the way it is. I have found that in Scouting most things can be fixed a lot faster and better with a face to face meeting with one or two people who are willing to listen and work toward a compromise, which can then be taken to the committee than trying to change the way things are at a committee meeting. What tends to happen is that someone will dig their heels in and the longer it goes on the bigger the chance is that someone gets upset. When someone gets very upset they really have very little place to hide or go, so they just quit. Which while maybe not always a bad thing! May not be in the best interests of the unit. Ea.

"There is no trumping policy." Poppycock! Whenever I think that the policy is going to place a child in a situation that is dangerous, I for one have no problem trumping it. Ea.

Far be it for me to tell anyone how they should spend their hard earned money. In fact, I have at times got a little bit peeved and upset when people choose to look down their noses because people seem to have too much or not enough money. While I'm aware that there isn't anything that might back me up, I have found that in most units the parents of the Scouts in that unit do seem to be in the same financial boat. Of course in just about every unit you will find the odd very well to do family and the very not so well to do family. We have a Troop in the Council where all the parents seem to be Doctors, lawyers and well off. They have no problem sending their son's to Sea Base and on the more expensive Scout trips. Back when I was a CM the Scouts in the pack, were mostly kids who went to the private school that my son attended. While at that time the parking lot wasn't filled with expensive German sports cars the Moms were driving nice Caravans and the Dads all seemed to have new pick-up trucks. Paying for Scouting activities was never a real problem. I didn't have to drive that far to find a unit where it seemed clear that most of the families were having a hard time and were facing financial challenges. I know that it might sound unfair to say it! But most units tend to provide a program that the people in the unit can afford. At the risk of sounding like some sort of a snob! I see very little point in a pack offering all sorts of Belt Loops, when the Scouts can't afford and don't have a uniform. The Scouts in the Ship have talked about a trip to England or Europe, but when we have looked into the cost and the time it would take to fund raise the amount of money needed, the idea has been put on hold. In fact the Ship Committee has asked that we don't have trips that cost over $1,000. Many units do find ways of helping the family of a few financially challenged Scouts, but most units could never do that for every family and so tailor their program so that it suits the needs of most of the families in that unit. Eamonn

I kinda think that most of us would agree that the three most important things for a Lad in Scouts and Scouting are: Program, Program, Program. I have spent a lot of time not serving at the unit level. I have served as a District and Council Training Chair. My big hope was that maybe some of the stuff we covered in different training's would work their way back to the unit level and help the Scouts get a better program I have served as a Camping Chair. Again my hope was that we might be able to provide more opportunities and better facilities for the Scouts and the Leaders would again be able to provide the Scouts they served with a better program. I have served on the Membership Committee, doing what I could to help recruit more Lads into Scouting and help units see that retention was just as big a part of Membership as recruiting is. But it all comes down to the program that the Scouts are offered and receive. I have at times go on and on about how Scouts who are enjoying what they are offered are more lightly to bring their pals along to join them. More Scouts of course means more families who might when they see that their son is having a great time and growing within the program, will be more lightly to support things like FOS and popcorn sales. I know a great program when I see it in practice. Sometimes it differs from unit to unit. Sure I've seen the Troop that looks like it should be on the cover of the Boy Scout Handbook. All very smartly turned out in nice clean, pressed uniforms. I've also seen Troops who seem to live in blue jeans and t-shirts have Scouts who rarely if ever wear the uniform, because they are so busy doing stuff. Some great Troops have found that wonderful balance when advancement and all the other fine methods all seem to be in balance. While other Troops might focus on one activity and spend most of their time doing that. I don't think when it comes to program that one size fits all. While of course there are many wrong ways of doing what we need to do. There is also many right ways of doing it. It seems a little odd that when we talk about the methods of Scouting, we go on to say that they are all of equal importance. Yet a Council or anyone would want to make a goal of just one method? Sure this might be because it's so easy to count. Kinda hard to count some of the other methods. I always knew that no matter what I did at the District or Council Level it wasn't worth a tinker's if the adults in the unit discarded it all. Program happens at the unit level. Volunteer Leaders allow it to happen and at times make it happen. Districts and Councils can do a lot to help and support the units. I'm not sold on the idea that District and Council goals do that much to help and support. They might provide some sort of a picture of what is going on? But before I'd set a goal for advancement, I'd st one for outdoor activities. - But that's just me! Ea.

I'm not a lawyer or a doctor, have never played one on TV. - Did spent a week in a holiday Inn Express a week or so back. I don't really understand HIPPA. Seems to me that most ordinary folks don't. As a parent I was fine and dandy with my son taking his own meds. (He had allergies.) As an adult leader I was OK with looking after a Lads meds and reminding him when to take them. As a leader I know at times I broke the rules! If a Lad came and informed me that he had an upset stomach or a headache I pointed him to my car where there was OTC meds. I know and am aware that I was taking a risk. I used to get upset when leaders told me that my son had to hand over his meds and I made a point of telling them not to! If an adult is uncomfortable giving a Lad his meds? That is up to the individual. He really doesn't have to. Ea.

I for the most part agree with you. Still I have to admit that when I was District Commish and later as District Chair. I requested that the Registrar send me a monthly copy of the District Advancement Report. I used this as a tool to keep an eye on what was happening at the unit level. While it wasn't the best way to know what might be going on. If a Troop was maybe showing no advancement and no MB's, it send up a red flag that maybe all was not well and a word with someone from that Troop would be a good idea. Sometimes there were good reasons why the report showed no advancement. At times I was guilty of trying to push membership goals on to units. I really did try and push this, while at times it might have worked with Packs, for the most part with Troops it was like trying to teach a pig to sing. Not only didn't it work, but I was upsetting the Troop Leaders. So I quit doing it! Ea.

Many of us have things that if we were in charge of the BSA for a week or so, we might want to change. I believe that in the area around where I live that we are never going to see more African-American Scouts until we see more African-American adult leaders. Sadly a lot of male African-Americans in the area have at one time when they were young got mixed up with drugs. They would more than lightly never get past the background check. I would love to see us be able to recruit more African-American adults. I can and do see that no one in their right mind would ever want a child around someone who was selling crack cocaine outside of the Troop meeting place or someone who was high on drugs. Like it or not the only way we have of knowing what people might do? Is to look back at what they have done. I'm not and I'm thankful I'm the guy who decides who will and who won't serve. I'm happy to leave that to the powers that be. I'm not happy not knowing what problems I might be lightly to have to face. I really don't have any real need to know what someone has done. All I need is the green light to say that everything is fine or the red light to say that this person isn't someone we want around our kids. Sure I might like the idea of being able to say that the young African-American who was caught dealing drugs when he was 20 and is now 40 has changed and is not the same guy. But that's not up to me. All I want is for everyone to be checked out. Without the check what have I got on my side? Only what the person tells me? Do criminals ever lie? You bet they do. Ea.

I know this is going to sound silly! But it seems with a good many of our male 17 + Sea Scouts that they want to go not with what has been planned and worked on, but with the last offer they receive! We don't have this problem with the female Scouts. We have tried a no refund policy, which the QD does at times put on some trips. Ea.

Troops in the area where I live tend to not be very big. By the time a Lad gets to about 15 most of the guys of his age are long gone. The OA in our area offers these older guys the opportunity to spend time with guys their own age. I think without the involvement my son had in the OA he'd have quit Scouts. He went on to serve at the Sectional level.One of his best friends served as NE-Region Chief. Most of his OA pals also served as Camp Staff members. I think that the Troop is all about serving the boys, if a Lad becomes active in the OA the Troop should do everything it can to support him. No good comes when we try to make it a "Them or Us" sort of thing. Sure at times having Scouts especially older Scouts not be around when the Troop "Needs" them can be an inconvenience, but if we remember that this is all for the Scout, the individual we end up doing what it is we are in the business of doing. Ea.