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It is common knowledge that BSA made its ineligible volunteer files available to an independent researcher at the University of Virginia. She provided initial findings in 2011, and an executive summary in 2012. Here's the reference to her formal work on the files, published years later on a sample of 6878 perpetrators of CSA: Warren, J. I., & Reed, J. (2021). Victim selection patterns of community‐residing child molesters identified by a nationwide youth‐serving organization. Behavioral Sciences & the Law, 39(3), 307-327. Those conclusions have been folded into the
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Is Becoming a MB Counselor Worth the Effort?
InquisitiveScouter replied to swilliams's topic in Open Discussion - Program
Thank you for trying to do this. And welcome to another headache of mistreatment by paid staffers. If your integrity and doing things with excellence are important to you, then yes, pursue. If you are not the type to jump through bureaucratic hoops, and you have a unit leader with access to Scoutbook who will approve MBs on your behalf, then consider that option. We are in a similar situation. We have an adult leader who submitted the application in Feb. He was approved as a MBC in March (about a month later), is populated in Scoutbook, but has NO MBs associated (yes, thi -
I am curious at the comment of the BSA rate and a comparison. That suggests that BSA or Scouts America has one of the lower stats compared to others in the comparative fields. Is that something that might be important to share more directly? I am asking, as a number of times when I have noted percenage comparisons I have been shouted down and called names. So, a verifiable link or notation would be useful, if nothing else. Thanks.
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I filled out my application and turned it in to Council April 12th. Heard nothing back, so I called and left a message asking about my status on May 3rd. Got an email on May 7th saying I needed to turn in another adult application, along with the consent form, as this is a separate position. That seems nonsensical and redundant, but sadly used to this with scouts. I filled out another application and sent it to our committee chair to sign (having received no instructions to the contrary), then she forwarded it to Council. We (CC and I) then got a passive-aggressive email back saying
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And I will just have add: When things go really bad in the outback, and your life depends on it (the news has stories weekly of folks who have died), having MASTERY of a skill is potentially lifesaving. And if not saving your life, will make a stressful situation more comfortable. Louis Pasteur's quote "Chance favors the prepared mind" means that the better prepared and more knowledgeable you are, the more you'll be able to take advantage of any chance opportunities or observations. Once, headed into a federal wilderness in winter time, the rangers, after looking at our gear sai
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Interesting comment, presents the question: is Scouting an "experience" or "learning (skills mastery)?" "Experience" implies: "Go through the steps, complete them in some measure of demonstrated competency of skills and you are done." (Whether you remember them tomorrow or not.) "Learning" implies: "You've made 8 failed attempts and now you've demonstrated the skill 3 times perfectly-you've learned. Come back tomorrow and if you can do it again, you've mastered it and passed." An anecdote: While on that camp staff in 1969, the waterfront director at an evening staff meeting
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That is a new one I haven't heard before: It's not coaches, then, but lurking predators who scope out kids and swipe them off the field in view of the public, other kids, parents, and ubiquitous surveillance cameras? Interesting. I guess these lurkers don't go after the tuba players very often. I think it's significant that BSA, the youth organization that probably has the most data about child sexual abuse cases over time, and that could produce information useful to scout parents and leaders as well as all other youth organizations regarding incident characteristics, age, gender of vi
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That’s some serious wishful thinking! Those “two hours in public view” are just the tip of the iceberg! From there, while noble coaches are trying to guide kids into a lifetime enjoyment of athletic pass time, the neighborhood predator, on the field or in the stands, is getting acquainted with hundreds of kids and ranking them by vulnerability. Sports and band camps are notorious for providing first exposures to pornography and worse. Some of the kids who are routinely assaulted at home:work their way up in the structure to where they can propagate assault. USA Gymnastics learned the hard way
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National Annual Reports
InquisitiveScouter replied to RememberSchiff's topic in Open Discussion - Program
Recommend a different thread. I never retest the Scout. Yes, we discuss the experience. "How did you like the badge?" "Tell me about a challenge you had, and what you did to deal with it." "Did the Merit Badge Counselor require you to do anything more than the written requirements in order to receive the badge?" "Would you recommend this badge or counselor to your friends? Why or why not?" etc. The attitude here is not to play "gotcha", but to gauge the Scout's experience with the badge and counselor. So, if a Scout comes to me with a Hiking MB card, for example, I would love -
So, a few observations: Comment 1: Back in 1969 and 1970, I was under age 18, and counseled merit badges both years. About a year ago, I asked my camp director, me being curious how it was I could counsel merit badges being under age 18, said, "we knew that you knew what you were doing, so if you approved a scout's completion of a merit badge, we (adults) signed off on the approval." Hmmm. On the one hand, I did know my skills dead-bang-cold, and I did not approve anyone who had not demonstrated that they could actually do the skill. (And, being a naive kid who knew h
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@Alec27, He does not need the form. If you need confirmation from the "chain of command", have your candidate check with the District or Council Approving Authority AFTER he submits his proposal. See the Preliminary Cost Estimate section: "Note that if your project requires a fundraising application, you do not need to submit it with your proposal." Worrying about the form now is putting the cart before the horse. During the proposal phase, he only need answer the question: "Fundraising: Explain how you will raise the money to pay for the total costs. If you intend to
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You mock, but somewhere there is a kid sitting at home on his device that needs to start being physically active so he can train to participate with the troop on a day-long hike, a canoe trip, a long bike ride, whatever. We have some kids who struggle. Everyone is different. For some the requirements are easy, for others, some might take a little work. I watched my son complete the physical fitness requirements and MB as a young scout, and no, it wasn't difficult for him. But there was a sense of accomplishment. That the activities he participates in and effort he made has a difference in his
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The thought here being that National is surreptitiously passing liability for injuries from the Council to volunteer adults with little or inadequate training without their knowledge of the shifting of risk? -
If money for the project is raised / solicited from the candidate, his parents or relatives, his unit or its chartered organization, parents or members in his unit, or the beneficiary then NO FORM is needed. Do not overthink.
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It appears that the Eagle Scout Service Project Fundraising Application and the Procedures And Limitations page are "self-contained," that is, comply with all the provisions of both and the Eagle Scout Candidate has fully complied with all rules. I note that the Application requires Council approval. The text in both the Application and the Procedures mention "donations," with little discussion on how much effort is expended to "fund raise." So, I'd treat the cash donation as being the result of "fund raising," complete the Application accordingly, submit it for Council approval. If appr
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Page 2 of the fundraising form. *This application is not necessary for contributions from the candidate, his parents or relatives, his unit or its chartered organization, parents or members in his unit, or the beneficiary. All proceeds left over from fundraising or donations, whether money, materials, supplies, etc., regardless of the source, go to the beneficiary. If the beneficiary is not allowed, for whatever reason, to retain any excess funds or materials, etc., the beneficiary should designate a suitable charity to receive them, or allow the unit to retain them. The unit must not influe
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Mike, I think the issue is that per the "Fundraising" form you attached, that we already know about, that is in question is to "raise funds" meaning a donation is being solicited or asked for. So in essence, you are "raising funds" by asking for donations and that's what the "fundraising form" addresses. Here's the problem. No funds were solicited. Nobody was asked. Nothing was raised. My son's project donor came forward and volunteered funding of the project on his own initiative and directly to the beneficiary. So exactly what "fundraising" was done? Per the form "If people or
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Actually there is a form in the project workbook. Eagle_Scout_Service_Project_Fundraising_Application.pdf
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If your ASM thinks there should be a form ask him to show it to you. But unless your council has something weird there isn’t one. As you said, have your son answer the question on form F: “Mr. Smith has generously agreed to donate all the costs necessary for this project.” If he wants to elaborate a bit he can add some thing like, “because Mr. Smith is a supporter of both Scouting and the community organization this project benefits.” As a guess, I would guess ASM is sort of waving at some IRS rule about donations over $500, but that’s not for the scout to worry about, that’s
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Hey all. I got a tough one here. and this one's personal. My son has his project proposal next week and I have a MC, ASM and myself as Dad and son getting conflicting information regarding private monetary donations for his eagle project. The kid is building a deck and the whole thing is being funded by a private donation from one of our unit members who is also a parent who is also a friend of the family. Total is just under $900. The problem is that I have an ASM that has sat on our district eagle board telling me that because it's over $500 my son needs to fill out a form. It's n
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And there is a place that makes summer camp badges difficult at times. Going through dozens of signed blue cards from camp, how many of us will have a serious talk with each scout about what he learned or did? Hard to selectively judge unless something rings an alarm, like hearing from the counselor that the youth was not going, or not participating. Of course then, the card also should never be signed as completed if that were the case. We want to trust the youth, and hopefully will find few times to seriously challenge some things. Fine lines and balance much of the time. I am reminded
- Yesterday
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Well, the parents would be right. The average kid is far safer from sexual abuse in sports than the average kid in scouting. Sexual abuse of children is a society wide problem in any setting where adults have access to kids, but a kid on a soccer field for two hours in public view is far safer than a kid on a campground overnight in a remote location with unrelated adults. Studies like this highlight our problems with CSA but have little bearing on BSA's experiences and track record with it.
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I'm salivating waiting for this. It's going to exactly like climb on safely! A legal chokehold that elevates national from liability and voiding the indemnification clause for leaders who do not have the training and experience an incident. This is directly from climb on safely. "The adult supervisor works cooperatively with the climbing instructor and is responsible for all matters outside of the climbing/rappelling activity. " Climb on safely is not a training course in climbing. Contrary to popular belief it's a sideways acknowledgment from the leader who takes it that if BSA policies -
The sporting thing; there's an aspect of this compare and contrast that is not being discussed. https://childusa.org/wp-content/uploads/2021/03/Five-Key-Findings-from-the-EAS-7.9.2021-Updated.pdf#:~:text=18.3% (nearly 1 in 5) of elite athletes,minor by a sport official or peer athlete. Because of the decentralized nature of sports, schools, clubs, etc ... there's no great big target with a big pocket of money (when comparing to BSA). So for 30 years there are local discussion when a pedo coach or physically abusive coach or exclusionary club gets caught doing the wrong thing; however, the
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Lot of wrong information about that second discussion with the SM about the MB. Page 41 of the GTA states that the 2nd discussion with the SM is supposed to be about the scouts experience, not a retest. As a SM you're signing the blue card not as an approval or denial, but acknowledging that the adult association of the discussion has taken place.
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Posts
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It is common knowledge that BSA made its ineligible volunteer files available to an independent researcher at the University of Virginia. She provided initial findings in 2011, and an executive summary in 2012. Here's the reference to her formal work on the files, published years later on a sample of 6878 perpetrators of CSA: Warren, J. I., & Reed, J. (2021). Victim selection patterns of community‐residing child molesters identified by a nationwide youth‐serving organization. Behavioral Sciences & the Law, 39(3), 307-327. Those conclusions have been folded into the YPT program that we ask all parents to take. This year, one other publication reported on a randomly drawn sample of 48 cases ... Mackinem, M. B., & Laufersweiler-Dwyer, D. (2024). A Deeper Look at the Boy Scouts of America “Perversion” Files: Structural Factors Related to Access and Abuse. Journal of Interpersonal Violence, 08862605241230091. It goes over many of the structural problems unique to the organization and tries to make optimistic conclusions. We need to remind ourselves that criminology is hard. The data that are gleaned from these reports are also studied by folks who think it is their God-given right to lure our nation's children for their basest desires. May none of us make the error that any given activity is such a safe haven that our guard should be lowered to any degree. -
By InquisitiveScouter · Posted
Thank you for trying to do this. And welcome to another headache of mistreatment by paid staffers. If your integrity and doing things with excellence are important to you, then yes, pursue. If you are not the type to jump through bureaucratic hoops, and you have a unit leader with access to Scoutbook who will approve MBs on your behalf, then consider that option. We are in a similar situation. We have an adult leader who submitted the application in Feb. He was approved as a MBC in March (about a month later), is populated in Scoutbook, but has NO MBs associated (yes, this is a two step process.) Our Registrar is overworked and underpaid. I spoke with District Advancement Chair... since this leader is not counseling any "restricted" MBs, we told him to go ahead and counsel in good faith. He will fill out a blue card, and we will approve things in Scoutbook based on the signed blue card. Sometimes you have to "help" the system. -
I am curious at the comment of the BSA rate and a comparison. That suggests that BSA or Scouts America has one of the lower stats compared to others in the comparative fields. Is that something that might be important to share more directly? I am asking, as a number of times when I have noted percenage comparisons I have been shouted down and called names. So, a verifiable link or notation would be useful, if nothing else. Thanks. -
I filled out my application and turned it in to Council April 12th. Heard nothing back, so I called and left a message asking about my status on May 3rd. Got an email on May 7th saying I needed to turn in another adult application, along with the consent form, as this is a separate position. That seems nonsensical and redundant, but sadly used to this with scouts. I filled out another application and sent it to our committee chair to sign (having received no instructions to the contrary), then she forwarded it to Council. We (CC and I) then got a passive-aggressive email back saying, “M, I communicated directly with S because merit badge counselors are not a unit position and the application is not signed by the chartered org rep.“ Then I got a separate email telling me I needed to turn in another application. I foresee nothing but headache here. Convince me otherwise. Or confirm and I can tell her forget it with no qualms, lol. -
By SiouxRanger · Posted
And I will just have add: When things go really bad in the outback, and your life depends on it (the news has stories weekly of folks who have died), having MASTERY of a skill is potentially lifesaving. And if not saving your life, will make a stressful situation more comfortable. Louis Pasteur's quote "Chance favors the prepared mind" means that the better prepared and more knowledgeable you are, the more you'll be able to take advantage of any chance opportunities or observations. Once, headed into a federal wilderness in winter time, the rangers, after looking at our gear said we passed and could go in. Knowing the difficult decisions rescuers faced in crisis, I told him, if a crisis, come look for us last. We will be OK. (Well, and not knowing the future crisis, maybe that doomed us, but we were confident of our skills.) And, many times merely having confidence in one's ability, allows one emotionally to continue on to solve an unknown crisis, that without that confidence would have caused them to hesitate and be lost. THAT is what Scouting did for me.
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