Eagle94-A1

If you say "Boy Scouts" you are viewed as misogynistic, defiant, and some unScoutlike terms, and one who needs to leave Scouting. At least in certain areas of the country and on certain FB groups. This despite the fact that many old fogey's will use the term because it's been that way for 108+ years. You still have folks referring to Venturers as "Venture Scouts" 21 years later. ( An aside, when I spoke with the then National Venturing Director in May of 1998 at PDL-1, I and several others told him this would happen by using similar nomenclature used for the older Scout patrol at the time,i.e Venture crew, Venture Scouts. 21 years later it is still a problem) And if you use the term "girl Scouts," it is more ammo for the GSUSA lawsuit.

Point 6 refers to Point 4 of the G2I, 4. The unit leader provides a list of registered active members of the unit who meet all eligibility requirements, including attitude and participation.(emphasis added) The names of these members are entered on the report form and the unit leader signs the certification. It is important that the list be complete, as only one election can be held in a unit each year. So if the name is not on the ballot, the Scout not listed is not considered eligible, and thus cannot be a "write in candidate." I can understand your position. being a CA is tough. Been there, done that multiple times. And cleaning up messes previous CA's have done can be interesting. My favorite is the troop that was use to doing their own unit elections. Thankfully the SM was a former CA back in the day, and was polite and respectful when I showed him the rules. He thought it was odd that the troop could do elections without the chapter being there. And i told you my worse election story. I would not call the removal of an ineligible Scout voiding. But understand. As for mispellings, ditto. HOWEVER a SM cannot do the "expected requirements." The requirements must be met AT THE TIME OF ELECTION. (emphais)

Sadly, Pros sometimes won't listen, and they will downright ignore you. DE set a district Cub event 4 for the same time and place as the district camporee and IOLS training with only 4 weekds notice.. Camporee chief saw it on the calendar website, called the council office about it, and NO ONE knew about it. Asked to get it pulled from the council calendar. DE is furious because HIS event was removed. When both the camporee chief and ITOLS SM state that having that is a problem, they were ignored and told the event will go on. Camporee Chief had to make numerous last minute changes: designated parking areas, marking off an assigned campsite that was going to be surrounded by Cub Scouts, redoing the entire compass course to get to events because 1/2 the area to be used was now for the Cub Scouts, etc. Both Camporee chief and ITOLS SM quit after the weekend.

I was told that my lodge had adult Arrowmen of the specified gender up all nigh with the candidates. And that it is a new policy form national. Grant you that is hearsay from a lodge officer, and as seen in another thread, SE's sometimes make their own rules. Sadly the changes started before the girls were allowed. No more pioneering projects over shoulder height without safety gear (started in late 1990s and got stricter over time); restrictions on fun activities ( waterguns and waterballoon size restrictions) no more patrol camping on their own (2012); Lowering of advancement standards ("One and Done" mentality in adult training instead of"Master the Skill", "InstaPalms despite 94% opposition to it, and the "Therefore, make the Scout’s Eagle board of review a celebration of their achievement." instead of a review to insure requirements were met are a few changes that come to my mind, and there are more) and less focus on the Patrol Method (R.I.P. 10-1-2018) and Outdoors ( minimal training requirements and more focus on STEM and other non traditional Scouting programs) are just several examples of how the program has changed over time. I believe the BSA tried dumping the "traditional program baggage" in the 1970s with it's Improved Scouting Program of 1972-79. William "Green Bar Bill" Hillcourt had to come out of retirement to save the BSA from that fiasco, and even he was not able to restore it 100% He is no longer with us, and even the most devoted his followers do not have the knowledge, skills, abilities, charisma, and connections at National to fix today's problems at the national level. All we can do is focus on out local units.

Can you show me where the Scouts can write in candidates as I cannot find it in the Guide to Inductions? Also can you show me where the election team or SM can nullify a vote as I cannot find that either? This is a sore point with me. I had a SM provide me with a list of eligible Scouts, including "attitude and participation." He signed off on everyone. Once the election was completed, he was told the results. He was surprised one Scout got in, a Scout he approved, and wanted to remove the Scout. Election team refused and when he was berating them I intervened. Then he started cursing me out and following me into the parking lot. I was always taught once approved, there was no way to rescind approval. SM had his chance. And nowhere in teh Guide to Inductions can I find that a SM can rescind approval after the fact.

Once upon a time, the OA was quite the honor. For some, being an Arrowman meant more to them than being an Eagle Scout. There were limits to how many Scouts could be voted in, basically 1/2 the number on the ballot, and it was common for Scouts to wait two or three years to get in. Being elected by your peers meant that they thought you were worthy. Is it work? Absolutely. Standing joke use to be the 3 W's on every OA patch stand for "WORK, WORK, WORK." I have busted my tail with various projects the OA was needed for. Is it educational? Absolutely. I have been able to get training on various leadership and American Indian Affairs stuff. For the folks screaming "Cultural Appropriation," I would recommend looking at some of the old works on Native American Culture. They may be surprised to find they were written by Arrowmen, They may be further surprised that it was a way for Native Americans to keep some of their culture alive since it was illegal for them to do some things. They may be surprised at the numbers of Arrowman who have helped First Nations in their quest for state and federal recognition, relearning lost arts, and in one case I am personally aware of, language. Is it fun? Absolutely. Some of my best memories in Scouting are events with the OA, from local lodge events, to section conclaves, to a regional American Indian Seminar, to NOAC. Is it a way to keep older Scouts and young ASMs active? Absolutely. Sadly when I got in the OA, the chapter was virtually dead, and I was not active. It was 4 years later and a chance encounter with a friend that I found out that my chapter was getting restarted. I got involved in American Indian Affairs, first ceremonies, and later dance. Using AIA we rebuilt the chapter, and insured growth of the chapter because we were inspiring Cub Scouts and Scouts with our ceremonies. But as others said, it is your son's choice. My oldest son, the son who helped make some of the stuff the OA is still using for their ceremonies, has no interest in the OA. Every time there is an election, he declines to be placed on the ballot. I am hoping that the new troop, which is extremely active with the OA will change his mind. I too kept the Vigil. Dances with Fools.

LOVELY. This is the first I heard that. Looks like I need to start collecting all of my regalia that I have been allowing the chapter to borrow for these years.

Get an REI membership and get yourself a harness. BEST INVESTMENT EVER! The dividend from the harness paid for the membership. While the harness is long gone, I still use my REI membership. And that harness I bought was super comfortable and had gear racks. Unlike the one size fits most harnesses the camp provided. Used that harness for several years. A good pair of gloves would be good to. Also one of those Froggs Toggs chilling bandanas, or something like it are awesome. I used a wet bandana back in the day to protect my neck and cool me off. Attached it inside my helmet and let it hang down the back. of my neck. When I was working CS day camp, wife got me a Froggs Toggs chiling bandana, and it was awesome. At the first camp I did climbing and rappelling at, one guy would bring up binoculars. Between classes, he would scan out over the horizon from top of the tower. That was at the former Kingsdown Scout Campsite in Kent, UK. On a good day you could see Calais France. EDITED Camp was on top of the White Cliffs of Dover.

EDITED" CO for Cross Over, not Call Out. although the word I heard is that they are the next ceremonies to lose Native American Regalia.

Well it got interesting this weekend. I have another troop working on Indian Lore. They sang at the council Webeloree last night, while I did the ceremony in my Southern Straight Dance regalia.. Prior to doing it, I had one of the lodge officers from my chapter approach me asking about the regalia I was using, what ceremony, etc. Then he tells me that the SE found out about the troop that did my youngest son's AOL Ceremony, was extremely upset, and chewed out the OA chapter DESPITE BEING TOLD THE CHAPTER HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH IT! (emphasis) . I told him, and his father later on, that if the SE has an issue, tell him to contact me about it. Later on I told the same lodge officer to leave the campfire circle while I and the troop's singers were practicing so that there would be no assumption that the OA had anything to do with it. The Scouts did great, and had several compliments. Webeloree Chief told me he wants everyone back next year. Told him only if the SE allows it. I am not going to get the Scouts in trouble. On a different note, several people told me it was different only seeing one person dressed in regalia doing the ceremony. Finally, I talked to my old Associate Adviser, who is still around. Both talked about how the changes over the years to elections and now the no regalia for AOL and CO ceremonies is destroying the OA. While Cheerful Service is the Heart of the OA, American Indian Affairs was the soul of the OA that inspired and motivated folks. Both of us do not see the OA lasting a lot longer, at least in our neck of the woods.

Maybe it is my old age cynicism, but I think it will get worse.

Well there is at least one OA chapter ignoring the new mandate. Got word that the OA chapter will continue to do their district AOL and Cross Over Ceremony that they have done for a number of years.

Where to begin. For one camp I bought a wetsuit. Water temps were in the 50s, and after getting hypothermia once due to water submersion, I HATE cold water. Despite being laughed at by the Laplander, wore it every time I went kayaking, or canoeing as the Brits called it. Best investment. At that same camp, I had my Smokey Bear hat. Glad I did have a wide brimmed hat because when I was not on the water, I was on the rifle range. If you are going to be in the sun, any wide brimmed hat is a must. When I was COPE director, I went out and bought my own harness before camp. Pricey, but well worth it. More comfortable and less bulky than the ones the camp bought since they were one size fits most. For another camp I worked at, radio and loud cheery music. The Scouters in camp thought I was the most important person as I drove around camp delivering coffee and newspapers in the morning. After Reveille was played, the Scouters knew coffee was on the way when they heard 'You are my Sunshine" baring from my car. Coffee is your friend! 😎 But the ABSOLUTE MOST IMPORTANT thing to have is A POSITIVE MENTAL ATTITUDE! Camp staff is fun, i did a total of 5 years at 4 different camps. While there is a lot of fun, there is at times stress and frustration. 2 AM Lost Campers in the rain is not fun. Dealing with ticked off SMs because you kicked out their misbehaving Scouts from you class is frustrating. Worse is when the PD says you cannot kick them out, and you are stuck with them in the class the rest of the week. THEN having to deal with the ticked off SMs because their Scouts did not complete the MB because of the problem Scouts above is frustrating. But the friendships you make, the Scouts you meet, and the fun you have more than compensate. The closest I've had to those Summer camp days has been working Cub Scout Day Camp. That and when I go with my troop to summer camp. I am usually in Aquatics

I don't recommend it. The hole will get bigger and ragged over time. Only reason I keep mine with the holes is that A) it is a reminder to me to ALWAYS keep safety #1 when on the range and not assume that everyone is listening and following instructions and B) to show shooters on a range what could possibly happen when they are not paying attentions and following safety rules. Yes, my Smokey Bear has holes in it from a rifle range. My fault and I was lucky. Thanks for the reminder, I got to pack that Smokey for this weekend.

Unless they are Webelos, I have never had good experiences with siblings attending, except 1 family camp out. As a youth, the accompanying siblings ruined a trip we had planned for a year, and caused damage at the facility we were staying out so we never even thought of going back because of them. We never had another family camp out until all of the youth at the time had aged out. No one ever wanted a repeat of that experience. Even when my own son was a Webelos, I had some challenges with him. First time they were major, and I had to step away to deal with him instead of dealing with the Scouts. Siblings can be a major distraction. Understatement.Some of you know from other posts how two sets of parents who wanted a continuation of Cub Scouts caused me and my sons to leave a troop, and nearly destroyed it. Despite the Scouts and a few Scouters complaining, it took me leaving before the rest of the Scouters to see the problem, and the CO to finally put their foot down and intervene. I am told the troop is doing a lot better now. Key questions to remember when in the situation: "Have you asked your PL?" And if they are the PL, " Have you asked your SPL?" Unfortunately after oldest's term as a PL, I could no longer ask those two questions. The troop elected him SPL, and I had to deal with him.

I agree with full medical disclosure for everyone, adults and youth alike. I had someone going into shock while taking him to the hospital. I wish I had the form with me to answer questions when I got to the hospital. Camp medic still had the form. I could not answer any thing they asked me, and he was not 100% there due to shock. Thankfully he was aware enough to give them a phone number and his parents were able to help. Compare that to when I had to got the the ER, my form answered a lot of their questions. As an adult who has taken responsibility for those forms for summer camp, I freely admit I go over every single one. I am making darn sure that all the i's are dotted and t's crossed. Had an incident one year where the parent did not approve the administration of over the counter drugs (Advil, Pepto-Bismal, etc). Thankfully they drove us to the camp and were still around to sign it. Otherwise no one would be able to give him anything if he got sick. I am not trying to find out anything, and in fact do not remember anything other than whether the things I am looking for are signed or not. Oh and to make sure we have all three parts ( one year a mom sent in only Parts A and B. Thankfully we had a physician in the troop who gave him a physical right before we left!) While I do see the day coming in which out the forms will no longer be needed, it won't happen for a while. With everything going to Electronic Medical Records (EMRs), once the different systems are integrated into each other, anyplace you go you will have access to a patients records. As it is right now, any facility using the EPIC EMR has access to anyone who has an EPIC record. So if you are in California and go to the ER there, that ER has all of your EPIC records recorded from your primary care physician in South Carolina, and vice versa.

I am with @ParkMan . I am against it, because I have seen Scouts participate in Cub siblings' events AS IF THEY ARE STILL CUB SCOUTS (emphasis) and those Scouts had major issues acting as Scouts at their own events. They still depended on adults and not try and take care of themselves. It slows down their development.

Can you provide more details?

Sadly, the 63 old fogeys (60 Scouters and 3 Professionals) of the National OA COmmittee seem to be ignoring the youth as every single youth I have talked to HATED the new scripts (caps, bold, etc for emphasis). And if you are doing these ceremonies as the OA national requires you to use their new skits ceremonies. My chapter will no longer do those ceremonies. Correct National OA Committee no longer wants Native American references in the OA AOL and Cross Over Ceremonies. Still allowed for the rest of the ceremonies. HOWEVER many noted the absence of Native American ceremonies at the last NOAC shows. In fact the only reference to Native American culture was the AIA powwow and show. One of the challenges is that the OA has used NA images and references since 1915. And when it is done properly it is a thing of beauty that inspires and motivates. I had a troop working on Indian Lore borrow my regalia and did one of the old scripts, leaving out references to OA. You could literally hear a pin drop at the meeting because everyone was interested in the "Indians." Try keeping Lions and Tigers quiet and paying attention for 20-30 minutes!

Looks like folks in my neck of the woods are asking individuals to do these ceremonies as NO ONE (emphasis) like the new national scripts and the local chapter refuses to due them as they are embarrased just reading them. I am a Southern Straight dancer and was just asked if I could do a ceremony for an event.

My wife embroiders. She did mine and two of the hoodlums shirts.

Question for the long time Scouters out here, do you consider the Scouts you worked with YOUR Scouts even 5, 10, 20+ years after working with them? I mentioned a few months back how I had one Eagle come and stay with me a few days. He's a "Nomad," converting a UHaul truck into a mobile office and apartment. He's driving all over the US and I keep up via Facebook. Last time I saw him was 21 years ago. I visited another Eagle when I went home for a few days. Wasn't a long visit, but it brought back memories and we were able to catch up on folks we knew and had not heard from. Again it was 21 years since I last saw him. Last night it really hit. One of my Eagles got married, and I was at the wedding. At the reception, I ran into his dad, who also was an ASM with me. We spent over 20 minutes catching up, no only on what we have been doing, but also on our Scouts. We mostly discussed the good things in our Scouts' lives: graduations, marriages, jobs and promotions, children, etc. Negative events were not mentioned, but from the tone, we both keep up with those as well: divorces, deaths, etc. It seemed as if no matter where they go, or how old they become, we both consider them "My Scouts."

Sadly, unless they are shooting at targets, it is not allowed. Unauthorized and Restricted Activities Q. Is laser tag an approved activity? A. Scout units may plan or participate in paintball, laser tag, or similar events where participants shoot at targets that are neither living nor human representations. Please review additional information located in the Unauthorized and Restricted Activities section of the Guide to Safe Scouting.

Not just in an online forum. It is an extremely fine balancing act. Especially when you personally agree with the volunteers. Or have never been involved until hired. Extremely frustrating when policies are made by folks with academic credentials and no Scouting credentials.

Also, does anyone else find it coincidental that the Patrol Method truly died just before the introduction of girls into the program? After 108 years, we can no longer trust the boys?