Eagle94-A1

That's because most of the units have Scouters who have had experience as youth and know how the program is to run, or came into established units, and were mentored by the experienced Scouters, and then took over as the experienced folks stepped down. Problem is we are now getting a lot of adults with little to no experience as youth, forming new units. We had a new troop locally whose new adults complained so much about camping in the cold, that the experienced SM was forced to cancel a trip. And these are "trained" new adults I might add.

Respectfully disagree regarding volunteers failing. IT IS BECAUSE THE PROFESSIONALS ARE FAILING. (everything is emphasis, not shouting). Yes, volunteers run the units and some units have issues. But who is responsible for developing the training materials to create the program? The Professionals. And when you have professionals with little to no experience in the movement, either as a youth or volunteeer, but instead has a rich academic career and are pushing their theories into training, there will be problems. None of the current training syllabi compares to the previous versions. And even the previous versions left out so much information compared to earlier versions. And Volunteers are being ignored, and are getting fed up. Don't believe me? let's look at some recent history. When National does surveys and polls, they either A) ignore the published results of the poll and do what they want anyway (InstaPalms); not count a segment of the membership (LDS Church members in the Western region were not counted in one poll), using leading questions to get desired results ( the girls in Scouting poll), or not even publish the results of the poll (BSA to this day has not published the MEMBER (emphasis) results of the girls in Scouting poll; they only use the public poll that leaves out the BSA's involvement). And don't forget about the last minute registration fee increases. These have happened twice now. The first time was right in the middle of Fall Round UP season when they announced it, after many units had created budgets, recruiting flyers, etc. A lot of folks were ticked off and you would think the Pros at National would have listened. NO, they did it again, and they did it AFTER Round Up season started, and 3 days before it went into effect for recharter! (Again emphasis) Don't know how other areas recruiting went, but ours was horrible, worse it has been ever. And it is apparently the Pros at National are ignoring their own, hand picked national level volunteers. We now know that long time, national level volunteers are being ignored and uninformed on matters that they are suppose to be responsible for. Look at Mark Stinnett, 1975-1978: Camp Director and Ranger (Philmont) 2009: first recipient Distinguished Service Award, Philmont Staff Association 2011: This year, Silver Sage Awards were presented to David Caffey, Edward Pease and Mark Stinnett. Mark Stinnett worked at Philmont four years in the 1970s and has served as a former PSA President and the longest-tenured editor of High Country. He has also served on the Philmont Ranch Committee, the Program and Risk Management Task Force and the Health Lodge Task Force. Stinnett has also chaired the BSA Outdoor Programs Committee, the Fieldbook Task Force and the Biannual National Outdoor Conference. Civic Involvement (from lawfirm profile ) Boy Scouts of America – National Council Chairman, National Outdoor Programs Support Committee Chairman, Fieldbook Task Force Chairman, National Outdoor Conference Chairman, Camping & Properties Implementation Task Force, National Membership Standards Study Initiative Member, National Camp Accreditation Committee Member, Outdoor Adventures Committee Member, Philmont Ranch Committee Boy Scouts of America – Philmont Scout Ranch Chairman, Program Task Force, Philmont Ranch Committee Chairman, Strategic Planning Task Force Member, Philmont Health Lodge Task Force Instructor, Risk Management Training for Camp Directors Boy Scouts of America – Pikes Peak Council Member, Troop 78 Committee Challenger Learning Center of Colorado Former Advisor, Aerospace Explorer Post 1986 National Eagle Scout Association Outdoor Organization Memberships: American Camp Association American Hiking Society Leave No Trace Center for Outdoor Ethics Philmont Staff Association President, 1994-1997 National Director, 1990-1993 Editor, High Country Magazine, 1998-2008 Chairman, Presidents Committee, 2005-present Contributing Editor, High Country Magazine, 2009-present Here is a guy who has dedicated over 40 years to the Movement, and the pros at national won't even keep him informed of what they are doing to the property he is responsible for overseeing? I'm sorry but the volunteers are NOT to be blamed. I'm a former pro, and served on district and council committees in several councils. I know what the Pros want, 'Yes Men," and when you start thinking for yourself and questioning why things are done, you are removed. As a DE, I was "advised" to remove over 1/2 my district committee because they were questioning things at the council level. Seen long time volunteers removed from positions, and I have not been on a council committee for several years because I questioned things. Volunteers are NOT the reason for BSA failing, the professionals are

Both my Life and Star Scout hated having to do cyberchip for Star. Youngest doesn't realize he needs to do it again for Star yet. All 3 hated it.

Can I verify it for him? I looked her up as well, and I would considered myself a pretty good researcher. As Evie O'Connell said, "I am a librarian. "

In the UK, Scout bands were a big deal. Usually district or county wide, and they would only perform on special occasions. Not like US marching bands.

It was a complete flop. Can't believe someone is going to try it again.

I too would rather 10 serious Arrowman, than 100 going through the motions. I remember upsetting a SM when I stated that those who are not interested in the OA could leave their names off the ballots, and several of his Scouts volunteered NOT to be on the ballot. This is the Same SM who had a bunch of Arrowman in the troop, but none active I knew this would happen when they changed the election process in the 1990s. I just didn't know how long it would take. Combined with some other decisions by national OA, specifically the new new AOL and Cross Over Policies, I do not see anything inspiring Scouts to be interested. And of course, the poor Call Out Ceremony I attended really upset people.

I think there is a ton of pressure on lodges and chapters to up membership and Brotherhood conversion rates, especially since it now takes only 6 months to earn. From reports elsewhere, OA is in a downward spiral nationally. P.S. I think pressuring candidates and Ordeal members will backfire.

While to a Webelos it may be "backpacking," I do not think it is. I remember my old council having a mega event where people had a choice of either carrying their gear 1 mile or more from the parking lot to their campsite, or using the "4th Marine Division Delivery Service" to drop off their gear at some point at their campsite. We had a number of families carry things in. So I have seen Cubs carrying their own gear a mile or more to a campsite. I know when my youngest was a Webelos, he was ticked off that his older 2 brothers were going to go backpacking on the AT, and he could not go. To prove his point that he was capable of backpacking with his brothers, on a pack camp out that included hiking, he wore his pack and carried everything but his hammock and tarp. He did about 6-7 miles that day. And the only reason he didn't carry the hammock and tarp was good trees to hang in were few and far between. I would make sure that the campground is approved by your council for Cub Scouts, if they even have a list. I know my council does not have one, and packs in my district use the OA's WHERE TO GO CAMPING BOOK as their guide on whether the campground is approved or not. Sadly I have met a few council level Scouters who have stated, "Cubs don't need to camp."

I. HATE. ONLINE. TRAINING. Not only for the lack of contact with others, especially experienced Scouters who have "been there, done that," but also because the Powers That Be don't seem the grasp that technological disparities across the country. Not everyone has high speed internet. One person took over 4 hours to do just the YPT2.0 training because he had to use dial up; there are no high speed providers in the area that will service him. We had a group so fed up with trying to do YPT2.0 online, that they begged council to allow a live class, which thankfully council obliged. We would have lost several units if we didn't have that class. And don't get me started on the Specific Leader courses. Out of all the Cub Leaders in my district, 5 are completely trained. And 3 of those are experienced Cub Scout Leaders who took Cub Scout Basic Leader Training way back in the day. The bulk of the problem lies in internet connectivity issues. But also the way the training is presented, in a series of courses and not as a single, standalone course as in the old days,is confusing and intimidating some folks. Add in the fact that National changed all the courses, and if you were in the middle of training you had to start all over again, was the complaint I head from one of the 2 trained CSDLs who did it online last year. Plus National has attempted to state that in order to be "Trained" you have to have all the current courses, which makes people ask "why get trained at all if they will be invalid when they change?" Thankfully enough volunteers complained about that policy that it was quickly, but quietly , reversed. But sadly even the classroom training appears watered down. I was asked to be training chair again, and I am in the process of getting my syllabi to start setting up courses. In comparing my old syllabi to the ones I have used in the past, I am noticing the following: Length of courses have shortened; Topics have been watered down, or omitted completely; writing style of the syllabi seems to be geared towards a Middle School First Class Scout instead of adult learners.

Funny thing this topic of recruitment. We were doing a compass course at a local park. One group was about 30 minutes behind schedule because two non-scout friends showed up riding bikes. They ended up tagging along and watching the Scouts do their thing. I am hoping one, if not both show up at the meeting they were invited to.

Because we have shrunk so much. 10 years ago, the troop had 4 patrols . Not having a feeder pack is killing us

Sadly we would apply as a neighborhood patrol. Oldest picture we have of the troop is their 1926 trip to DC and the White House. At lease 50 Scouts are in the picture, if not more.

Troop I grew up in made their own shirts. We had a silk screen made, and used it every year. Each year was a different color shirt and ink. Got them at the Christmas COH/ party. It was way cheaper making your own.

Don't I know it. My old troop had Cubs coming in from 2 different packs at one time. One pack had an outstanding program, and their Webelos were fully prepared, if not chomping at the bit to join a troop. Their WDL started off with SCOUTING ADVENTURE so that A) to give them, and their parents, as much time to transition to Scouts and B) prepare them for the Webeloree Competition in March. The second pack did not have a mediocre program, still treated their Webelos as Cub Scouts incapable of doing things on their own. They were not ready for Scouts, and over 1/2 dropped within a year. One good comparison between the two packs is watching the dens at Webeloree. First pack's den may struggle some, but you see them doing it on their own. Second pack's adults kept jumping in and doing stuff for them every time they struggled. Best comparison was a CASTAWAY WEEKEND with the troop, 3 weeks before Cross Over for the first pack, and 3 months before the second. First pack had their shelters either completed are almost finished before the second pack even started the single large group shelter.And then the parents were doing the bulk of the work.

So yes, they SHOULD have Cyberchip.

Theoretically, Webelos 2s/AOLs who Cross Over SHOULD (emphasis) be able to earn Scout after their very first Troop meeting. Here's why.

You may have read my feelings on NSPs on other threads. I am not a fan. Currently my troop is a one patrol troop, and hence use the Traditional patrol model. They placed 3rd overall at camporee, and that is with the patrol being DQed for one event. The two patrols that beat them were also Traditional Patrols.

HastTagScouts reminded me of another factor, how the troop is organized? Some troops have aged based patrols, i.e. New Scout Patrol (NSPs) , Experienced Patrol, and Older Scout Patrol; while others use Traditional Patrols, aka Mixed Aged Patrols. In My experience, NSPs focus more on advancement, whereas Traditional Patrols tend to focus on skills. For whatever reason troops around here don;t like youth signing off. I.HATE.THAT. (emphasis) If there was one thing I could change in my current troop, is have more youth than the SPL sign off.

There are a lot of variables that affect how fast a Scout advances. One of the biggest differences between Cub Scouts and Scouts BSA is the standard for. Cub Scouts is "Do Your Best." Scouts BSA is currently'"DO, " and once upon a time it was "master the skills." Whereas a Cub Scout could have some trouble with something and still earn advancement, Scouts need to meet the requirements as written. So that is one factor. As for having AOL, I use to say if they had it, they should get it within a month or two since SCOUTING ADVENTURE Activity Badge is 86% of the Scout Rank. BUT I have found the quality of Webelos dens vary from pack to pack, and even from WDL to WDL within a pack. Best example are the WDLs my three boys had. Oldest had a good WDL who really prepared them for Boy Scouts. They knew the stuff, and advancement occurred fairly quickly, 1 to 2 months tops. Middle son had 2 great WDLs, and most of his group that joined the troop he was in got it withing 2 weeks of joining. One thing his WDL did was SCOUTING ADVENTURE in 4th grade, using it as an elective for Webelos rank, and then having them do an elective to make up for it during 5th grade. Youngest had a good WDL, but started the transition late. Since she started working on Scouting Adventure a few months before Cross Over, they didn't have as much repetition fro the Scouting Adventure as the other dens. Most of them got Scout either during or after Summer camp, 5 months after Cross Over. So that is another factor. A third factor is who is authorized to sign off? I have found that when PLs, SPL, and select older Scouts sign off, the Scouts tend to take more ownership on the matter, especially PLs. The PLS work a lot more with the Scouts, and are easier to get access for the sign off. If only adults sign off, everyone is trying to get their attention. Another factor is how flexible is whomever is signing off. Sadly my older 2 boys had been in a troop that only adults sign off. All three boys' current troop only allows the adults AND the SPL. A little better IMHO. Anyway they have met adults outside of meeting nights, at their homes, at Starbuck, or at a park to get stuff signed off. I have met Scouts at the library too. Regarding meetings, that really isn't the time set aside for that because each Scout advances at their own pace. In adults only sign off troops, It is either before the meeting, during the Interpatrol Activity aka Game Time, after the meeting, or some other time.

While I have not done N. Tier, I did fly up to LaDomaine, Quebec for canoeing. Here are my thoughts. Weight and space are not nearly as important compared to backpacking. I would use the tents they provide. MAKE SURE YOU SET THEM UP PRIOR TO LEAVING BASE CAMP! (emphasis). We used a Canadian troop's gear Saved weight and cost when flying. Whatever you do, do not rely just on a dry bag. Have layers of protection. I usually have 3 layers of protection, 2 waterproof ( items in individual bags and one for the compartments of my pack) and 1 strong, protective water resistant bag, aka ALICE. ALICE protects the garbage bags I use, and I carry extra bags. I have not had any problems in 31 years using this method. And that includes 3 water based 50 milers, and numerous weekend trips and training sessions. I have a dry bag and used it for less than a year before it got holes in it. Yes it was a Coleman, so it was cheap. If you do use a drybag, make sure you got materials to patch the holes if you get any. And I would still uses the layers of protection above. Your call. I didn't have a chair back in the day. But I'm older now and enjoy my creature comforts. 😀 OH HECK NO!!!!!!!!!!!!! (emphasis) I had a friend relying on an iphone sized drybag, and it leaked, destroying his phone. I would keep electronics to a minimum. You can have too many issues. Only reason I would carry a phone is for pictures. Do they still sell the disposable waterproof camera's still? There are cheaper options. I've seen someone use stretchy work gloves before. I personally use diving gloves, but I've had them for 25 years now. I do not see why not. I've heard good things about them, but never used one before. And when i went to Canada, would not have been able to afford it. We were advised to get either a military surplus European rucksack or a USGI medium ALICE. I got the European rucksack because it was canvas and cheaper. MISTAKE! Fell apart within a few months of use as a school book bag. My ALICE has been with me a long time, and still going. Plus the quick release straps make it easy to attach to thwarts. Good luck.

I am told the move to belt loops was because parents did not want to sew the arrow points.

Apparently the chapter is no longer giving that option. My boys received their letters today. When I gave it to the oldest, he told me he is still not interested. He told the OA election team that, but they still left his name on the ballot.

I bet those stats do not include those eligible who do not want to be part of the OA and declined to put their name on the ballots. Again my oldest declined when his name came up to be on the ballot the previous 3 years. Ditto my middle son last year. In fact thinking about it, the last time I witnessed an election, 1/2 of those eligible declined.

Yes. Rationale for that is to allow the Scouts to compete and have fun. HOWEVER the ideas for the events are picked by the SPLs. We have a SPL & SM Crackerbarrel Saturday nite that is a Thorns and Rose's session as well as planning session for next year. All of next year's events have already been selected by the SPLs.