Eagle94-A1

I remember when a Lifeguard Instructor was classified as a Non-Swimmer because he did not go to summer camp that year, and thus did not take a swim test in time for the troop's canoe trip. No annual swim test, no longer classified as a Swimmer. Luckily at the time, non-swimmers could still do boating activities with a certified Lifeguard. So I rode with the 16 year old Lifeguard I had certified prior to summer camp. And there is a reason for doing swim tests annually. I know that after my first accident, the one where I was in a leg brace for 3 months and gained 60 pounds, I could not pass a swim test if I had tried. And the only thing that allowed me to pass the swim test after the second accident was the 6 to 7 months of physical therapy.

I think that is one reason why the council is failing. We have folks going to out of council shops because we get better service or have more customer friendly hours. Plus they are tired of orders "not arriving at the office" or being lost. Best example of that is the Eagle application that was mailed and "never received." I know some folks have stopped giving FOS not only because of the increases in National fees, but also they are not seeing any benefits. They never see their DE, we are unable to get in the schools, which the DE should be working on and hasn't, When volunteers try to do their own recruiting, they are told to stop. In fact multiple events have been interfered with when the pros intervene (basically saying "No you cannnot do this" and "yes this will happen despite everyone's objections", etc as opposed to actually being there. And the interference is causing longtime volunteers to quit and/or focus solely on their units. Which has caused a lot of problems i.e. training, putting on events, etc. I think that is why only 35% of the units go to the council camp. The staff's attitude is not customer friendly, like campers are an inconvenience. Equipment and supplies are wholly inadequate. I have seen rescue equipment fall apart while used for training lifeguards and Lifesaving MB, not enough boats for everyone to do boating activities during their time, and not enough supplies that the Scouts paid for to the point that Scouts are "sharing" kits needed for various MBs. As for program, well it's a MB giveaway. I had Scouts earn MBs that could not do the skills, and 1 Scout earn a MB that he never went to class because he switched on Sunday to another. Folks have complained for years about the problems, and nothing is done to make the situation better. Sadly I wish my council realized I and my Scouts were their customer.

Would you mind editing my post too? Change the name I used to zzzzz.

This letter is so much BS and zzzzzzzz should know better. He was a SE in a council in which his immediate predecessor did retaliate against those who questioned him. One district level volunteer was placed in the Ineligible Volunteer Files, not for any YP violation, but because he questioned the SE. Zzzzzzzz know it happens.

In my professional opinion as a former lifeguard instructor and swimming instructor, I think they should be EXTREMELY RARE (emphasis). I taught swimming to physically and mentally handicapped kids. It may be more difficult. they may not make "First Class, First Year," but I have seen kids and adults with these handicaps do it. Anytime we try to "shortcut" advancement, we are not helping the Scouts.

Yep, Sea Scouts were officially Sea Explorers from sometime in the 1960s/early 70s until 1998. However, in my ship we still called ourselves Sea Scouts, every "Sea Explorer" I met outside of my ship called themselves a Sea Scout, and if memory serves, Sea Scout was used in Sea Explorer literature. Both the First Class Anchor and Exploring Anchor (below) were used. During the Sea Explorer phase you had traditional ships that used the traditional Sea Scout program, and non-traditional ships (like mine) that did they own thing like Explorer posts. the unofficial terms Blue Fleet and Red Fleet to describe the two types of ships. The Small Boat Handler and Qualified Seaman badges were developed for the non traditional ships. Advancement was still around and anyone could earn it, but it was a lot harder to earn in a non-traditional ship. I only got as far as Ordinary before diving into the OA.

My council is in a similar situation financially, and are looking to sell properties. I did not attend the town hall meeting last night, but I had friends that did. One of the slides was the 2019 cost per camper for the 4 council camps. Let's just say the data is HEAVILY skewed against one local camp. They included a $50,000 new road into the camp in "Maintenance" when it should have been a capital expense. The old road was washed out and caused the camp to be inoperable for 6 months. Second the council only used the 2019 camp attendance. Since that camp was closed for 6 months, there were no day camps, weekend camp outs, or district camporees. So the attendance was much lower than usual. Council is trying to make it appear the camp is burden.But what is ironic is if they used the past 3-5 year data, the camp is the most used, and least costly camp. In fact the camp brings n more money than needed to support itself. It is the only council camp that Cubs can go boating at since the other camps are on rivers. And because of its location, a major metropolitan area is within 45 minutes of the camp. It's just the metro area is in another council, for the moment.

My council has a history of not following national policy. For a very long period of time, NO ONE was trained in the nationally required training for volunteers to run district and council cub scout weekend camp outs. They have allowed Cubs to go canoeing in the rivers at 2 of the councils camps. And they have never published an official guide where Packs cam camp at. So many packs use the OA's "Where To Go Camping" book to select campgrounds outside of the council properties.

My Council is truly screwed up. We are having a series of Town Hall meetings to go over the challenges we are facing. They have mentioned they may need to sell properties. Looks like they are trying to argue that the oldest camp in the council, the only camp that Cubs can do boating activities at needs to be sold. They are using 2019 data to show that it cost almost $60 per camper to operate the camp, whereas the other camps cost $16-18 per camper to operate. I love statistics While there stats are correct, they are missing some important factors. 1. the camp was shut down for 6 months, so no day camps, camporees, or weekend camping was allowed. and 2. the road was washed out and had to be rebuilt costing $50K. Instead of being "maintence" it should have been part of "Capital" since the repair was a one time expense. taking out the $50K, the cost is about $10.50/ camper. I am so fed up.

Let him cross over and get him to swim lessons! Summer camps have good swim lessons. I was one of those Scouts who could not swim. I was terrified of the water because I did in fact drown. One minute I am jumping into a raft and missing it. landing into the water and not able to stay afloat, and the next I am in the house, on the floor coughing up water with someone over me that was doing CPR. I had enjoyed Cub Scouts, and was looking forward to Scouts. And my Mom gave me an ultimatum, learn to swim or get out. Swim lessons at the YMCA were challenging until the swim instructor worked with me during his break between classes, and got me swimming. Swimming is a life skill that is needed.

Councils are suppose to support units, not units support the council. Focus on your existing Cub Scouts and families. If your council is offering online signups, make sure someone in the pack STAYS ON TOP OF YOUR COUNCIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There was 1 year where the DE did not coordinate with the packs, he did it all for them, and it was a major charley foxtrot. Compounding that issue was A. a minor hurricane that caused packs not to meet and B. a major district Cub Scout event called Cubmobile. Cubmobile is the first event these new Cubs went to, and no one knew what packs they signed up for. We had Cubs signed up with one Pack, and ended up actually joining another pack they met at the Cubmobile. Charter that year was a mess. Can you meet outside? What about dens meeting at folk's home? And Webelos Dens, with properly trained adults (Pre2019 WeLOT and BALOO or 2019 BALOO) can camp with out the pack, and that is something I recomend: camping by den to get them use to Scouts BSA. Most families understand things beyond your control FORGET JOURNEY TO EXCELLENCE AND FOCUS ON KEEPING THE PACK ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (Emphasis) While JTE is used to judge qualities of units, districts, and councils, this not a normal year. It is more important that the pack survives

We did our own program. We did an activity based program instead of MBs. Activities included Canoeing, Cycling, Emergency Preparedness and Wilderness Survival. We were super flexible. Our emergency preparedness drill and survival shelter building took a lot longer than planned. Cycling 22 miles wore them slammed out, and the afternoon was spend chilling out, advancement sign offs, and SM Conferences (5 total). #1 complaint was no showers, they had to use spigots in the campsite. The PVC shower they created fell apart while the first scout was in it. So far no problems.

Yes, the youth will complain loudly about inept adults. When enough youth started complaining about the interfering adults in the old troop, the matter got fixed.

Thanks for stating they ask for council. I have started the survey, but kept getting a 'minimum 2000 character" message for two questions. So I was really complaining about my council. Even though the council will be gone by 2022, they can still make my life miserable. I've seen SEs abuse their authority. 2 oustanding volunteers have had their membership revoked because they questioned the council to hard.

No, the Insta-palms poll was the last one they published the results of. 18% Against and 76% Strongly Against. But they did it anyway. The last poll they did was the membership changes one. They did not give enough time to conduct the prerequisite town hall meeting in order to take the poll ( which limited the numbers of members who could do the poll), the questions were biased as to what they wanted to do, a segment of the BSA's membership who took the poll were excluded from being included in the results (LDS members in the Western Region according to the foot note on something the BSA published about ht epoll) , and they never did publish the actual results of that poll.

I do it for both selfish and selfless reasons. 1) I am addicted to Scouting. I have been in continuously for over 35 years now in either volunteer or professional positions. 2) I want my three hoodlums to have some of the same experiences I had. Scouting made a major impact on my life, and I want it to make the same impact for them. 3) A lot of older Scouts and adults helped me as both a youth and young Scouter. There is no way I could ever repay them for giving up their time and treasure to help me out back in the day. Closets I could come is following their example.

As others stated, talk to the CC and COR or the Charter Org's legal rep ASAP! One troop I was in had that issue, and we could not remove the parent until we had a court order. Once we got the court order, parent was removed from all unit communications. When parent showed up, they were advised that they needed to leave, or they would be arrested for trespassing (ASM is law enforcement).

Here is how I see it regarding pros. Disclosure, I was a DE and worked for National Supply. There are a lot of good, honest professionals who wants what is best for the youth. I was one, some of my workers were as well. And I have had some good DEs I've worked with over the years. But there are also a lot of pros who do not live up to the Oath and Law. They will lie, steal, and do whatever it takes to get ahead. The good ones tend to not stick around long.They get burned out, frustrated, or harassed into leaving. Because they have to work twice and thrice as hard as the unscrupulous pros, they get burnt out much faster or get so frustrated with their situation that they leave. Why work so hard and not get truly recognized for the hard work. Worse is being harassed to leave. When I was a DE, my DFS and SE were both willing to do anything to not only meet goals, but be #1 in their division. When they realized I would not play their games, they harassed me into quitting. Cancelling training 4 days before leaving, rearranging my my week of summer camp until after I was married, causing me to cut short my honeymoon for a "mandatory meeting" in which only 1 other DE was at because he was at camp, having me drive 2 hours round trip for a "meeting" which lasted all of 1 minute because I was picking up a video for them to return, etc. They few good pros that advance tend to get sidelined to smaller councils. Their performance does not compare to those taking all the shortcuts.

The lead lawyer has stated at least twice that I have personally heard in public interviews (NPR's DIANE RHEEM SHOW is the one I remember of the top of my head, and it was around the end of the interview) that the dissolution of the BSA is his goal. Baden-Powell Service Association? Trails Life? I am willing to bet the volunteers will have no problems. But what will the pros do? Sadly they control BSA, and not the volunteers, despite how it is suppose to be done. Instead of getting the best people for the job, I was told to get the most agreeable when I was a DE.

I don't know. I guess the belief is that if the exec committee failed once, it will fail again? What I do know there are a multitude of factors affecting my council and the ability to retain quality volunteers. We are in a very conservative part of the country, and membership changes over the past 10 years have affected volunteer retention. Those that remained have been burned by the professional staff. We have had professionals overrule volunteers in charge of events. We have dedicated and knowledgeable volunteers being ignored and removed from council level positions, to be replaced with 'yes men." We have had some volunteer positions deliberately left vacant (my district had no chairman, thus no representation, for over 3 years, and before that the DC got so frustrated, he stepped down). We have had volunteers yelled at and cursed out by professionals when the volunteers disagreed with professionals' decisions or where the professional is at. Volunteers have not been kept informed, i.e. conditional charter for the past 4 years, or lied to, i.e. being told one thing only to find out later it was a completely different reason. It has gotten to the point that some volunteers cannot wait for the council to be dissolved and disseminated amongst neighboring councils. They do not believe things could be worse. But I know otherwise.I have been through a district merger, and know how things can cause problems. I also know that this council does not enforce a lot of rules and policies that other councils do enforce. In fact when one ranger tried to enforce some standard rules regarding the camp, he was told to let it be to be "camper friendly." I think a lot of folks will be in for a rude awakening when the mergers hits.

This brings up a question I have : what happens to a council's endowment when it is dissolved and absorbed by multiple councils? I ask because my council is doomed, see my post in Council Relations on the latest info, and I know at one time my council was #1 for it's council size in the Southern Region for it's endowment. One individual's bequest gave every Eagle Scout and all council support staff a West Fellowship the year he died. I don't know how large it is now, but i personally know that several of the donors, including the one who left the large bequest, wanted the money to support local Scouting, with the hopes it benefited the Scouts of their district.

With all do respect, the pros WILL ignore the desires of the youth and volunteers and do whatever they want. They ignored the published results on instapalms, and they still have not published the results of the poll regarding membership changes.

The Brownsea Strip in your post is supposed worn between council patch and unit number. If I can find my syllabus, i will post the image. And i do know adult staffers wearing it during the course. Need to check if it is a permanent award, or youth only. If you took it in the 1990s, it have been the JLTC course, but your council called it BROWNSEA II. And the patch may have been a local creation. I know when i did BROWNSEA 22 back in the day, the strips were available. But the patch you earned for completing the course was no longer available. My council ordered a bunch of Canadian BP patches to compensate

I found out that my council has been on a conditional charter for 4 years now. We don't make goals this year, merger process begins next year. With COVID-19, and increases in fees ($99 for existing youth including $33 in council fees) i see us losing existing members. Add in the incoming lawsuit commercials, i see no chance of meeting membership goals. As for financial goals, we have been running in the red for a few years. Council cut 3 professional positions and increased facility fees. Now there is talk of harvesting and selling properties. Hopefully they will not sell the local camp, the neighboring council has a lot of units use it, and i bet they would love to have it. And i told you how the pros have been running off volunteers, we are about to lose our district commissioner. DE has been MIA for some time, and the commissioner emailed his boss and the SE to see what was up. DE sent a very rude text cursing out the commissioner over the matter. So we are losing our commissioner, and more than likely our DE. So this situation explains my negative attitude towards BSA at the moment. The only positives, the things keeping my sanity, is the troop is surviving and my boys are advancing. Troop is meeting again, and we just did summer camp locally on our own. Overall a good time by all. Oldest got his credentials from, national, so he can plan his Eagle COH. Middle son just passed Life this week, and has a goal of earning Eagle at an earlier age than his brother. I keep reminding him it's not a race, but what does dad know. And youngest is now Second Class. Additionally 3 other Scouts have passed BORs at camp. The other 3 at camp are on their way.

Baltimore was experimenting with an alternate uniform that was a colored UA performance tshirt with the rank on it. So everytime you advanced, you needed a new tshirt. I think the tshirts were $25 to $35 a pop. That's $175 to $245 just on uniform shirts!