Eagle94-A1

I think the missing word is in the letter is "CURRENTLY." Over the past 35+ years in Scouting, i have seen so many changes, including changes that we were previously told would never happen, that I have no faith in anything coming out of National. To make matters worse, i would believe the national volunteers because there is a history of them being lied to by national's pros. The Philmont committee is the most recent example. The letter that came out recommending Sea Scouts become part of Exploring again took the National Commodore completely by surprise. So just because OA says no changes will happen, does not make it so.

My thoughts 1. Get rid of the green on tan numbers and trained patches. Everyone wears white on red numbers and red on tan trained strips.. better yet, mate the trained strips white on red. That way it could be worn on Scout, Sea Scout, and Venturing uniforms. 2. Get rid of the white on navy and navy on white numbers that Sea Scouts wear. We can wear red too. Last time I ordered numbers and other Sea Scout stuff from national, the labeling still said Sea Explorer, and Sea Scouts split from Exploring about 15 years prior to that purchase. 3. Get rid of all the high dollar extras like jewelry, cufflinks, collector books, etc.. 4.Get rid of the dated stuff, i.e. Scout Sunday 2020, 2020 collector's hat, etc. 5. Do not have our own brand of camping gear, instead stick with established gear. 6. instead of selling gimicky stuff, listen to what the customers need. Anyone remember the AOL belt buckle for leather belts?

Are you getting into the schools to do Round Ups? We are not, and I put that squarely on the DE and pros. Because share a DE with another district, the bulk of his time is there. And when Volunteers do try to get things going, it's negativity, or outright overruling. We had lots of contacts with the schools system, and we lost them because of the pros. We now have a new superintendent, and we have not been allowed in the schools since. And our DE is not helkping.

You just described my district and council. Council is on a conditional charter, not having met membership and/or financial goals for several years. Because the pros are overruling event volunteers, and verbally abusing other volunteers when they don't meet goals, longtime vounteers are backing off or quitting outright. As a result, volunteers have no ownership of the district and council. Its gotten to the point that some volunteers cannot wait to merge with neighboring councils because they believe it could not be any worse. You do have some who are trying to do damage control on the district level. But I compare it to sinking ship. An Ensign out of the academy is in charge (DC), a master chief is acting XO (Dis. Commissioner), 1 chief on damage control(former district committee whose back),1 disillusioned petty officer assisting in damage control but not being effective because of the fires (me not doing my job due to COVID), 1/2 the crew dead, wounded, or missing (we have lost that much membership and units over the past 10 years) and 1/2 the crew is every man for themselves (9 remaing units doing their own thing). There is no support from the fleet. And we got an enemy wolfpack out there trying to sink us (lawsuit and sex abuse ads.) I am not optimistic. So why keep struggling to keep the program alive? First and foremost my 3 sons. I want them to have the same good experience I had, if not better ones. Second the Scouts. We have youth who need Scouting. Third, I think the influx if adults with little to no experience as youth is a major problem, and online training is not helping. Don't believe me, look at the influx of virtual MB classes, camp outs, and summer camps. Look at the number of adults who will just give away MBs. Look at the number of adults who have no problem signing off on requirements, Second Class and First Class swimming requirements come to mind, even if the Scout never did them. I hope and pray that live training will help stem some of this. Fourth, there is no way I could ever repay all the adults who sacrificed their time and treasure. Closest I can do is pay it forward.

Soon it will be BSA footing the bill. We have to pay for several months of advertising and mail outs as part of the lawsuit.

Not only NO, but HECK NO! I've heard stories of over 100 Scouts in a "class." I took two online classes for one of my masters. One class had over 80 students, and I know the teacher did not read all the work turned in. Thank goodness the class was something I had experience in.In addition to the large class numbers, I am hearing about paperwork not being given to the Scouts once they complete the requirements. We had zoom meetings while we were not able to meet, and we did some MB work. Even in a small group like my troop, I have caught Scouts goofing off playing video games, walking away from meetings and doing other things, etc. And here is the part I hate: you have qualified MBCs locally for the bulk of the MBs, and all you need to do is make a phone call to get in touch with them. One of my Scouts is pushing to get Eagle before he turns 18. He needs 6 Eagle required MBs, including 2 with 90 day requirements. His parents wanted him to do all 6 at an online summer camp paying over $150 to do them. We have at least 2 MBCs in the troop for each MB he needs.

Agree. 22 years after the terms officially went away, I still hear "Venture Scout" and "venture crew" to incorrectly id Venturers and Venturing Crew.

At least you aren't the nuns who used psychological warfare on us when we misbehaved.Still remember Sr. Patricia making me tutor the guy I got in a fight with. A smack on the knuckles would have been much welcomed.

Well if they want to get rid of Scoutmaster, let's use the term "Skip" which is what they call SMs over in the UK instead of Mr. ________.

Law Enforcement Exploring is a specific program name like Sea Scouts, Cub Scouts, Venturing, and Scouts BSA. Hence the capitalization.

Sorry I couldn't resist.

WAIT I thought this was the Doctor....

I honestly do not know how it will affect councils and their properties. I do know that the lead attorney has stated on several occasions that he wants the complete dissolution of the BSA. He has also threatened to launch a wave of lawsuits against individual councils where he can, and National has asked the councils to become part of the lawsuit so that the matter is settled once and for all. Always in motion, the future is.

Hi, My name is Eagle94-a1 and I am a Scouting Addict. :) Seriously though, if you don't want to quit, don't. Make sure you do have a corps of ASMs who can do the job when you are on vacation with the wife. If you do want to quit, as @Sentinel947 stated create a succession plan now and stay long enough to have it go through. A troop I was in had the SM die unexpectedly, and there was no one prepared to step up. They did not have a SM for about 6-8 months, and it was not a good time. Good luck.

I would say National is encouraging it. Look at the "one and done" mentality it now promotes in literature. As for virtual MBUs, anyone remember the video from NAM where they are pushing the number of awards earned virtually, and praised one council for their numbers?

I've been in a variety of volunteer and professional positions lover the years.The #2 hardest job in Scouting is being a den leader. I did it for 6 years and was burned out.

Must have been a troop requirement. I was inducted in the late 80s, served on the election/camp promo team (my lodge combined to two activities into 1 visit) in the early 90s, and was a chapter adviser/chapter staff adviser in the mid to late 90s. in that time there was never an official age limit.

One other thing that made the OA special, candidates that were not willing to undergo the Ordeal fully would be told to leave. That is not longer allowed, only candidates can decide whether they should leave or not. If the lodge was to send them home, it would be considered "hazing." I found this out at one Ordeal where an adult candidate complained a lot about doing the work. After three counseling sessions, he was separated from the rest of the Candidate, had 2 adult members to supervise him, and they became a 3 man work party. He still complained, and at one point refused to work any more. When I found out, I asked the lodge adviser why we don't send him home, and was told national no longer allows it.

Must have been prior to the 1980s. BUT I can tell you from my experience in my troop, everyone getting elected tended to be in the 15-17 year old age range. Not because of any age restriction, but because it was considered an honor and we had an active Leadership Corps I remember 1 14 year old getting elected, and he turned 15 prior to the Ordeal.

That was how it was in the 80s. First Class, 15 days and night of camping, including 1 (and only 1) long term camp within the past 2 years, SM's approval, and voted in. Up to 50% eligible got in with an even number eligible. Odd number varied since they rounded up to the next even number, then divided by half. So 2 out of 3 could get elected, 3 out of 5 could get elected, etc. That policy changed in the mid 90s, and a bunch of us thought it was a mistake.

I don't remember any age requirements for OA. But I do remember tenure requirements for Tenderfoot Second Class, and First Class. I also remember "Master the Skill" and "The badge represents what the Scout CAN DO, not what he has done" (sic) were the advancement standards to meet, and not "one and done." like today. I also remember being able to vote for 1/2 the number eligible. In my first OA election, they were 3 of us eligible. I could only vote for 2, and I did not myself as the other 2 were my role models and mentors. I think the old standards produced a more mature, capable Arrowman. I also believe the prestige of being an Arrowman, being recognized by not only your SM ( he had to approve you name on the ballot) but also by your peers through the election. Sadly it is not that way anymore in my neck of the woods. And with the OA hemorrhaging membership, I think it is nationally anymore

Only if your troop does it itself.

Currently Camp Raven Knob in NC is open and looking for units to attend. They have a great program.

@Sentinel947 said it best. There is no way to replace it.

IMHO worse still, first aid. I had a Life Scout with First Aid MB, not able to do basic T-2-1 first aid skills. When I asked him about why he couldn't do the skills, He told me "I took that class my first summer camp, I don't remember that stuff."