skeptic

"We should not expect children to fix adult messes." Sadly, IMHO, that is in a way, exactly what we, as adults are doing by not tending to our societal issues, by non participatory citizenship in regard to finding leaders that can and will do what is needed. I have joked a few times of late with more senior youth that my generation is leaving the mess for their generation to fix. Not the way it should be, oviously.

The kind found by advertising done by legal vultures. Jus t saying.

We have no idea how many of those claims are real. And this link suggests this is also just the point of the iceberg. The tar and feathers is due most likely many schools, the Y as here noted, Boys and Girls clubs, uncounted sports groups, and any other youth group the creeps manage to get into. That is the point. The issue is not just BSA, and indications are that based on membership over many decades, the percentages of proven abuse are low in comparison to many. But, the stats are vague, and more is likely unreported or acknowledged than is known. IF the legal vultures decide to go af

https://www.cbalawfirm.com/news/ymca-sexual-abuse/ Just to remind some; the issue is not just one for BSA. Yet, even though this link certainly suggests the Y had just as many issues as BSA, I do not remember seeing any media stories that were tar and feathering them with the intensity of BSA. None of it is okay, but when do we stop somehow making BSA more of a pyria than others?

Thinking a bit more about this thread, I think we are speaking of a variation of answers. Whose success are we perhaps trying to measure? The obvious answer appears to be the success of the youth. But we also can expand our discussion to the success of the adults who mentor the Scouts. And, we also then are reviewing the success of the program, which is variable, depending on the membership involved, and also the actual program in play. Each level and type of program and group may have different points of consideration, depending on how detailed we may choose to get. Ultimately though, w

Ah, just not a simple label. Now we see clearly? Remember, it is against the law to remove some labels, or so it is said. 🙄

Yes might be the answer to both or either. We had a similar incident or two where once it was made clear to someone they were not allowed to work until cleared, other than with other adults they disappeared. Follow the rules and it works most of the time.

Okay, while I may be one of the few that might recall, but we are verging on the circus that the Forum shared when Bob White and our resident "Atheist" of the time exchanged loud typing. Reality, at least to me, is that IF we care about those building blocks on which Scouting is set, and IF we "do our best" to adhere to them, then we will serve the youth and society in a good way. Sadly, much of today's society does not appear to be ready for the balance that those ideals noted represent. Back to the Golden Rule and similar concepts. I fear some have possibly breached on here the thing we t

"Heck, I'd even support liberals if they ever wanted to join scouting." Guess I will need to scan through this, but wanted to just note, perhaps already done, that being Liberal or Conservative or something between has nothing to do with someone having an interest in Scouting. I probably know more people that would be "labeled" as that than would be labeled otherwise, all of whom support the basic ideals of Scouting and strive to grow the newer generations.

You do the buddy system in some form. No absolute safety in the public domain, and no manner of "rules" or "dictates" will solve every possible issue.

I should add that Scouting and the hundreds of outdoor experiences with them, especially my bed beneath the stars so many time, solidified a lot, though for some reason I again find myself searching. Possibly the hint of a trail nearing its apex could have something to do with that?

For me, the Atheist issue is mute. I say that because the definition of Atheist is a denial of God, and thus, a denial of "something", which negates their concept at the beginning. That is just me, and some can say I am nuts. Still, we always get to similar questions that at some point will necessitate accepting something we cannot see or explain. For many of us that is God, in some form or sense. Eighty years of life has strengthened this for me. Others must live with their own beliefs or lack thereof.

On a related note, there appears to be an April Fool joke posted on a Philmont site as well, something about turning Baldy into an image from Willy Wonka, a green toupee of sorts.

This should be fun. Guess we will see how many will not over react?

It depends on the person I suspect. There was a time I would have jumped at the opportunity if I could have worked it out. But, focus changes, and priorities do also. Likely a great experience if interactions happen that are worthwhile. I know that the best things I brought back from the jamborees I was able to attend were all NOT patches and such, but the meetings with other Scouters and youth from around the world and the U.S. But, the pressure schedules of many of the Scouters with whom I would liked to sit down and talk negated real substance, and I have never been able to get respons

With the ongoing back and forth relating to girls and boys and Scouting, I found this historical synopsis of the interactions of early youth serving groups being established very interesting. Take a look. It seems clear to me that major players in BSA, along with other groups of the time were very interested in girls and boys being involved, often together. Take a look. Historical origins of Camp Fire - by Alice Marie Beard The organizational history and the story of the origins of Camp Fire are complex. There is the official version presented in the book Wo-He-Lo: The Camp Fir

A bit of a reach, but cotton is not the best choice often. Modern wicking type materials are generally a better choice. On the other hand, a uniform worn for formal and indoor use is fine, though they likely could simply use all the modern materials and then have no issue. For info; Here is an article that quantifies the heat loss effects of cotton, polyester and polypropylene: Rossi et al., Dry and Wet Heat Transfer Through Clothing Dependent on the Clothing Properties Under Cold Conditions, International Journal of Occupational Safety and Ergonomics (JOSE) 2008, Vol. 14, No. 1, 69–7

"Encounter a Cougar while hiking ...what would your scouts do?" Hopefully not say "here kitty, kitty".

Follow YP guidelines, live the meaning of Scout Spirit, and let the youth be youth as they figure it out. We continue to try to make a mountain, and Scouting is only one more opportunity to find a path. Balance and that shady concept, common sense.

Few, if any World groups would face what the BSA has and does. Our legal system is a mess, and totally illogical in many instances. Add on the "sympathetic jury" awards, and judges that will not use their legal knowledge to over ride pie in the sky monetary damages, and it is no wonder we have issues. JMO of course. Balance, as I continue to suggest, is the key.

This fits into the general subject, though it may need to be moved. I found it interesting that it discusses similar concerns that seem connected to the BSA problems. And it too has been apparently swept under the proverbial rugs. It relates to the staging and filming of preteen and early teen TV shows on Nickelodeon and other similar channels. https://www.aol.com/why-quiet-set-documentary-nickelodeon-204637311.html

Sadly, at least in our society, it seems as if the concepts on which Scouting is built, again what we all Scout Spirit, are too often seen as out of the main stream, or quaint. We come back to the slurring tone of "you are such a Boy Scout", and so on. Well, being a Boy Scout is a positive thing in my view. And that includes the modern model that includes girls, women, and any that can abide by the Spirit.

The sad thing with this is that historically, BSA has been very inclusive overall. They were far ahead in acceptance of other races, especially Blacks, though dealing with the larger society was a real challenge. Yet even in the South, there are historical proof that some found a way for them to be involved. Similarly, when the Gay issue hit the fan, the issue was forced on BSA from society, rather than BSA making it an issue. I still feel that the Dale fiasco was brought on by people outside the actual unit and it members. They were aware, but simply had not felt it worth worrying about.

It is a continuing mystery to me why some cannot simply separate themselves mentally, and if possible physically from things that annoy them. We all hear the comment, "turn off the TV" on a fairly regular basis. That more or less is the same thing. IF it bothers you, separate as you can and then stay away as you choose. In most cases nobody is forcing you to do anything other than be in the same vicinity. JMHO of course.

Some very cogent statements here, and it seems to me to verify my oft made comment that the changes in BSA, or our society in general, have to occur in the normal evolutionary way. Almost every forced change finds serous societal kickbacks, and sadly, tends to bring out the worst in those with the least aptitude for interpersonal living. We again come back to the simple premise of the "Golden Rule".