desertrat77

BSA24, you raise interesting points. Nostalgia can be deceiving, but I recall the scouters of the '70s as an overall much jollier bunch than what I see today. Lots of long faces nowadays. Adults earning Eagle and such: I don't see a problem with it. Those who have the desire to earn badges are already doing it via knots and WB, so why not experience the trail to Eagle? They might have a better idea of what it takes. Concur 100 percent--scouters should be running and doing pull ups, along with swimming, hiking, shooting, rock climbing, chopping wood. A few might not be able to do all that due to physical limitation, but we should set the example to do our best, and to be physically strong.(This message has been edited by desertrat77)

EDIT: I searched the ancient threads and "Mrs. Smith" set up a thread to lobby for FOG to be banned. Seemed to me, at the time, that FOG was Mrs. Smith, just baiting the forums. Good times!(This message has been edited by desertrat77)

Now that you mention it...though I had no evidence, it sure seemed that FOG was Mrs Smith as well.

DrMicrowave, While I can't speak to the subject myself, I think if you look up Kudu's past posts on ISP and Woodbadge, you'll find alot of background.

Wow, those names bring back memories of some very unique dialogue...and eccentric behavior! I like the free-ranging threads here. Chasing rabbits, pot shots, beating of dead horses...all quite interesting and valuable. Nothing more annoying than nanny-like approach I see in other forums--stay strictly on topic or you'll get scolded or put in the corner. Thanks to the mods here for their enduring patience.

Gsdad, I can identify! As a military guy, I've just sewn on my fourth different council patch, in a five year span. Though each stay was short, I appreciated each council, all quite different in their own way. Really tough to take off the old OA flap. Kept the flap from the small but outstanding lodge in the deep South. The next two lodges were dead as a doornails. Only heard from one when it was time for dues, plus I never got around to sewing on their flap anyway. The next lodge wouldn't even give me a membership app, though I asked politely a few times after I arrived. They seemed to be happy with just the way they were, so I quit asking and kept proudly wearing the old flap. Current lodge is on the ball. This is my last move, and hope to retire here and keep this council patch more than two years. Though painful, change is good. Picked up alot of good stuff along the way and met alot of good folks.

Ponce3, Welcome to the forums! Are you referring to the BSA Yucca Packs and Haversacks? The Yucca was a bigger pack than the Haversack. Either way, the BSA stopped making them in the mid-70s, maybe earlier. Darn shame, because that canvas wore like iron, and they were affordable and a good entry-level pack for a scout. Seems to me that many packs today are over-engineered and thus over-priced. My Yucca from the '70s is long gone, but I've picked up a few used ones off ebay for reasonable prices. Look closely at the photos, as the leather straps for the outer pocket may be dry rotted, even if the rest of the pack looks good. I still use one as a gym bag, overnight stays, day hikes, and such. Can't beat them.

I think the CCs are definitely value added, and Gklose hit the nail on the head. It's important for camp leadership to have a general idea of what's going on in camp. Not to meddle, or spy, but to keep an eye on morale, sanitation, etc. If all is well, great, a little chit chat about the weather, and off he goes. If something ain't right, the CC can detect it and help make it okay. Ref my previous post, this particular summer we had a very toxic SM. Looking back, I think the CC's visits each day helped keep things in check.

Oddly enough, I only recall one, a good one...summer of '77, Camp Geronimo, AZ. He stopped by the campsite regularly to say hi and see how things were going.

Welcome, Eagledin86, looking forward to your insights!

CFA's spicy chicken sandwich is wonderful...add their seasonal peach shake, and we're talking about a great meal. (But not in the two months preceeding my annual PT test...after passing, tastes all the better!)(This message has been edited by desertrat77)

Welcome NH and Young Owl!

Sure, the driver kinda backslide on her commitment to take your son. More importantly, though, if your son really, really, really wanted to go, and there was a seatbelt available for him in the tiny vehicle, he would have left behind most of his gear, taken just his pocket knife, canteen, bed roll and toothbrush, and squeezed in. A sacrifice on his part? Yes. Worth it? Yes. A good lesson in setting aside personal comfort for going on a great outting. Plus, an 11 hour round trip drive, with someone else incurring the wear and tear on their vehicle, is worth it too, from a logistical standpoint. I'm speaking from personal experience. As a scout, my parents rarely were involved in my troop, and many times I was the beneficiary of rides from other parents...sometimes in the circumstances you just described, and worse. Sure, cramped and unpleasant, being treated like the proverbial stepchild, but a good life lesson and once you get to the trailhead, all is well.

I kinda liked my skill awards, especially the early versions that were made of heavier metal. They got all scratched up over the years, camping and playing british bulldog at meetings. When I got my Philmont belt, that's when I retired the SAs.

Indeed, entertainers should stick to entertaining. A few might legitimately transition to statesmanship, but not many.

In the '80s, as an Airman I was stationed overseas. One of my neighbors in the dorm was a DJ on Armed Forces Radio and Television Service, darn good at his job, and played all kinds of music on the air. Prior to the AF, he had several years experience as a DJ on a country station. He enjoyed the experience thoroughly, but wanted to see the world, so he enlisted. Shooting the breeze one night in the day room, he talked about country music fans. He said "One thing about country fans--they are consistently loyal. To their favorite artist, the radio station, their brand of truck, and especially America. If someone criticizes America, country fans will never forgive them."

Sum effect of Eagle badge turn in: zero. Sure, a staffer at National will have to accept the medal, patch, certificate, whathaveyou...probably log the items and circumstances in a database, then file the items in a '60s-era metal creaky six-drawer cabinet with the other Eagle stuff returned over the years. I'd log that job out at 20 mins, give or take 5, if someone stops by the cubical to chat. Maybe add ten if there is a surprise birthday cake in the break room. The former Eagles will have their moment on TV. Any other value is entirely self-perceived.

The BSA would clearly benefit from going coed. More scouts, more volunteers, more resources. New life to an organization that has slowly become hidebound over the last couple decades.(This message has been edited by desertrat77)

I concur with BSA24...lots of old school Eagle medals, made of sterling silver, going very low prices on ebay. Now is a good time to get a piece of history.

Whatever you wish to call 'em, they are profoundly useless.

If National wants to streamline the oaths individually, great (like the Venture one), but each should be unique. Smooth out wordiness, work on eloquence. Get some articulate folks on the project. Be it the BSA or the military, I think any oath/slogan/motto/creed that has been written since 1980 is the result of a committee of bureaucrats. Uninspiring and clunky. Avoid one oath. It would reek of an impersonal form letter.

I think these words from the E. Urner Goodman are apt: (OA Handbook, 1977, quoted at wiki) "The Order of the Arrow is a 'thing of the spirit' rather than of mechanics. Organization, operational procedure, and paraphernalia are necessary in any large and growing movement, but they are not what count in the end. The things of the spirit count: Brotherhood in a day when there is too much hatred at home and abroad. Cheerfulness in a day when the pessimists have the floor. Service in a day when millions are interested only in getting or grasping rather than giving. These are of the spirit, blessed of God, the great Divine Spirit."

question withdrawn.(This message has been edited by desertrat77)

The scouts would be keen for the challenge. The adults: not up for the challenge themselves, or like Basement said, they would be too dumb to manage it properly.

If the scout is ready for Eagle, a mock board will not distress him in the least.