SeattlePioneer

> Unfortunately, the CC and COR are the key players in appointing new leaders. They are free to ignore the advice of the committee. And frankly, for good OR ill, you aren't eligible to be appointed SM until you are 21. Your opinion about that requirement isn't really relevent to the issue. If you fill out an adult leaders application get it signed off and turn it in, it will be rejected because of your age. You need to be smarter about how you play the game of Troop politics. Nevertheless, I admire your energy and passion, and I will await developments with interest.

So what were your best ideas as Cub Scout RT Commissioner? I'm one and always looking for good 'uns.

I regularly have families complete the previous year's badge requirements during the summer. I wish it would stop THEN! Haven't had anyone slap my hands yet.... I'm so slack...

Perhaqps it's worthwhile to review the BSA's official recommendation on how to recruit unit leaders. This is from "Foundations For Selecting Unit Leaders": Foundations for Selecting Unit Leaders 1 Hold a chartered organization briefing. The head of the chartered organization meets with a representative of the local council to discuss the process of recruiting and selecting quality leaders. It is important at this time for the chartered organization to understand its responsibilities for operating the BSA units, particularly its responsibility for identifying and recruiting new leaders. Action. The head of the chartered organization appoints a task force of two or three knowledgeable and influential people from the organization to recruit a high-caliber individual to serve as Cubmaster, Scoutmaster, Coach, Advisor, or other unit leader. 2 Hold a task force meeting. The head of the task force selects a date and time for the meeting and notifies task force members. Action. (a) Review the BSA Mission Statement and the traits of a unit leader. (b) Develop a list of prospects who fit the traits of a potential leader. Be prepared with lists of chartered organization members and other prospects. Choose prospects who live up to the values of the Scout Oath and Law in their daily lives. © Rank the prospects. (d) Clear the list of prospects with the head of the chartered organization before making any contact. (e) The task force calls on the primary prospect. At least one person in this group should be able to influence the prospects decision. 3 Make an appointment with the prospect. This should be done by the task force member who knows and has the respect of the prospect. Include the prospects spouse. The unit committee doesn't have a role in such selections unless delegated that responsibility by the chartered organization. There are no age limits for serving on such a committee.

My theory is that national wants to support the WORLD scouting movement with it's purchasing decisions....

Ann Laurel--- And e-mail your District Executive or District FOS Chair and let them know. They WANT good presentations, but they may not know if that's not happening.

> About ten years ago the city park department rebuilt a street end park near me located on a navigable waterway. About three years later, beavers I never knew were in the river felled a half dozen poplar trees that were within about six feet or so of the shoreline. The trees were about 6" in diameter at the time. I guess it can happen to the best of 'em --- and this one was presumably designed by professional landscapers.

I agree with your bias towards letting election results fall where they may. I have my doubts about rescinding election results after the election has been held, as you describe here. It seems to me that is likely to be humiliating to a boy who was elected, and then rescinded. I think I'd favor your earlier bias towards sticking with the election results. If the Scoutmaster didn't read what he was signing ----tough. But that's just my reaction. It sounds like you have a platefull trying to make elections work, and I prefer to commend you for your good faith efforts. Something like this is on the other new thread where an adult leader who was selected was later rescinded after some difficulties having the selection recognized. It sounds like being a Lodge Adviser is a tough business since you have a lot of egos on the line, with adult egos usually being the bigger problem and these seem rto be adult egos with which you have one shot contact with rather than an ongoing relationship.

I had a great Den Chief for my Tiger Cub Den a couple of 7years ago. I made a point of treating the Den Leader as a LEADER, which was the key to success in my view. The DC was a teacher and planner for the program. I did most of the teaching and planning, but the DC was given an assignment for pretty much every Den Meeting, and did it well. The key in this situation would be to have a good DL/DC relationship --- NOT a parent-son relationship. If the parent can't treat it like that I'd look for another Den for the DC. Being a DC is a fine act of service for the DC, and involves a large commitment of time. That deserves to be respected and the DC treated as a respected leader by other pack leaders, in my view. The worst thing would be to treat a DC as the Den Leaders Gofer.

This impresses me as a distinctly low performing Scout Patrol that deserved to win no awards for anything. The ASM has entirely the wrong ideas. MOST scouting is about asking people (adults too) to do more than anyone can do. That forces people to make choices about how to use their time. Cheating is the wrong solution. The main reason for the low performance is that the Scout ideals have been pretty much abandonned. I'd start by asking the patrol anjd patrol leaders to rededicate themselves to the Scout Oath and Law and to live by those ideals when on the next Scout outing.

I've always been able to remove Badge Magic completely by using a solvent and some elbow grease along with a wire brush. The dry cleaning option sounds attractive if you are doing a "clean sweep," but I'm making a note not to do dry clean my uniform otherwise!

So.... How valuable are Eagle projects? How valuable to the Scout, the benefitting organization, the Troop, the community? How beneficial is it to have a formal and bureaucratic approval process that a Scout must follow? Does this really build "leadership skills"? How often are the Scouts doing the Eagle Project and how often are the parents or Troop Leaders main actors? Would you continue Eagle projects as requirements, end the practice or modify it in specific ways if you were consulted about such options?

This is a pretty good example of why democracy in Scout units is the worst of all possible methods. My bias is that the CC takes an adult application to the COR for approval, and the COR rep either signs it or doesn't. If a COR plays an active role in the unit, they may be in a position to be a more important player in selecting leaders, but usually they are not. The CC is probably wise to discuss various options with parents and committee members, and building a consensus is desirable but not necessary. Personally I'd avoid formal elections or votes. The main criteria the CC should be interested in is finding the best person to fill the position at hand. Scout units aren't democracies.

In 2004 I accepted an AS position with a troop when I was interested in getting back into Scouting. Over a period of five months I saw some good things and some bad things in this struggling troop. On one overnight camp several young men and women I'd never seen before participated as "youth." Perhaps it was a coincidence, but the next morning the state park restrooms had most of the fixtures ripped out of the wall and the place was trashed. These "youth" said they'd seen some people in the park the previous night driving around. I had no first hand knowledge of who might have done the damage. At camporee several siblings went along as part of the camp. I was later told by the mother of one teen age girl that an AS had had sex with her daughter in a tent during the camporee. I had no reason to disbelieve the comments of the mother. Neither did I have any first hand knowledge of what might have happened. I wound up finding another troop with which to work. Several months later I heard gossip that the AS the mom had referred to had been suspended for life by BSA. I don't know if that was true or what the reason may have been. The AS was probably forty or so and had been a Scout in the troop and a Scouter in the same troop for many years. The troop has rechartered each year, but hasn't had a program, leaders or youth since about that time.

Some Scout shops are picky about selling badges without an advancement report. Ours will sometimes ask about it as a reminder but will sell badges if any suitable reason is advanced. I would think that if you take the old uniform in and explain you want new badges for a new uniform they will be glad to sell them to you. You could call and ask as a double check if you wish. Also, our Scout shop will arrange to sew on badges and such for an extra fee. You could ask about such a service if you wish.

Frankly I know very little about the Scoutreach program. Who can describe it's role and financing? What is the attraction of Scoutreach programs for councils? To what extent does Scoutreach compete for funding, the time of professionals and volunteers with traditional Scouting programs?

> It sounds like you have people with good intentions and that the problem is varying degrees of ability and experience. It's not surprising to have program problems when doing an activity for the first time. One approach would be to review the previous months activities at your committee meeting and decide how to improve things the next year. Letting everyone know that mistakes are being reviewed with an aim towards correcting them should help reduce irritation. Does the CC have the basic planning and leadership skills needed to do the job? If the problem is lack of program planning experience, that will correct itself over time. If it's a lack of basic leadership ability, it wont. Are the same mistakes being made in activity after activity? That would be a problem. If NEW mistakes are made with different activities, that's not surprising. If the CC can't really do the job, I'd be looking for someone to serve as a new CC and encourage the current CC to do just the Webelos DL position.

Often times camporees will have separate categories for competetors ---- recently formed patrols of new Scouts, experienced patrols, Webelos dens and such. I'm guessing that's why there were several 1st place finishers. Glad your SeaScouts had a good time!

Hello Eagle Scout, > Suppose your chapter started scheduling a few terrific camping trips per year --- some fine adventure opportunities that were announced and signed up for at OA events and activities. Get coverage of those events in council newsletters and such. It seems to me that OA needs to spice up it's reputation among Scouts. What better way than doing some terrific camping?

Occasionally I like to tease my liberal friends about this issue a bit, because it tends to drive them NUTZ!

From an earlier post of mine on this thread: > As it happened, while I was driving this youth home, my District Executive called me to discuss a membership issue. I happened to mention that I was driving a Scout home alone and why. He reminded me that this was a Youth Protection policy violation and that by not following the policy I was taking a risk of accusations being made against me. That would be an example of how a DE did respond to a particular case.

Uniform inspections haven't been a part of our district camporees to the best of my knowledge. But perhaps they would be a good activity for a troop or OA chapter to have as part of the camporee competitions.

Listen, we've all been trained in the uncompromising language of youth protection policies. And as described, pretty much everyone is going to ignore what we decide are trivial violations of such policies. That insures that in the future when problems arise that BSA and councils will always be able to show clean hands and volunteers will always be found to be dirty, since an investigation will disclose violations that weren't reported. It's a great system. For the council.

Just a note--- The first American to summit Mt Everest was Jim Whittaker, an Eagle Scout who started climbing with his Boy Scout Troop.

I had a Scout not picked up after a troop activity several years ago. After waiting twenty minutes or so for the parents to show up, I drove the boy the couple of miles to his home. I later had mildly unhappy comments made about that decision. Not a lot of choice there since I was left with the boy in any case.