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Some older venturing youth were in my WB class. Did just fine. No idea how they are doing with their tickets. No clue about NYLT. I know younger boys in our crew are no less goofy around the older girls. If that's your fear, I haven't experienced any problems with it one way or the other. (Of course boys in the crew have signed on to the co-ed thing, so that may make a difference.) My suggestion, if you do have to deal with it, is ask the older girls what the ground-rules should be.

I really like the broader concept of "Outdoor Ethics." It gives folks the perspective that LNT is part of a bigger picture of collective responsibility. It also should cover the concept that not everyone understands "the rules", so part of our responsibility is education.

BD - Piggybacking on what Stosh said, you have some specific experiences that can add to the life of your crew. First, your recent experience on the AT and that whole discussion about outdoor ethics could be a meeting topic. Second, let your daughter know that you'll be going on the hike in the near future and would like the crew to come along. (The challenge there is finding a female chaperon who's willing to do the miles.) But, they'll need a meeting or two to collect gear and prep. Hopefully if you're available for one thing, another half-dozen parents will be available for

jb, Your model really resonates with me because that's about where I saw my kids want to interact with their world. Thanks to college and military hauling away most of my 18+ y.o.s (and one 17 y.o. who got early admission) that's about all I have to work with. I wish the T2FC were accessible to Jr. High Girls. It would make the venturing program so much easier.

BD: choosing a focus or interest. I am not going to interject my desires or thoughts on what they should pick, but we got a list of possibilities from nationals site and offer that for suggestions. Well, we hike and avoid cabins. So I guess that categorizes us as general interest outdoor crew. But, the only reason is because that's the path of least resistance. If any one of them wants to plan a conditioning program for a backpacking trip, there are four adults (one female) who can serve as consultants. We love it and will make it happen. Their's nothing keeping us from being all

All of these, descriptions, although true, miss the point of Venturing's place. Yes, youth can do anything they want ('cept sky-diving, ATV's and paintball). But that's not the point. Yes, boys and girls can operate in close proximity while safely chaperoned. But that's not the point. Yes, yes a crew can be specialists. They can work closely with a troop, or be very independent. But that's not the point. Yes, they can help a council's recruitment/retention stats. But that's not the point. Awards are optional, but they demand skills in their category at roughly the level of what

Thanks for more details. The guy's a slug. You need some salt. First, remove him from PL before this goes any further. Tell him he can reapply to the SPL for the position (or any other leadership position) when he actually starts teaching and helping for a couple of months in a way that befits the POR he would like to be in. (E.g. for PL, teach a few scout skills; for QM inventory the troop's supplies; for Librarian measure shelf space or sort books.) Show scout spirit by doing stuff without looking for a reward. Second, make it clear that as he gets older, you will expect qualit

Our crew and troop once served as victims in a triage drill at the local airport. They needed hundreds of volunteers. The youths' time and availability was greatly appreciated.

I think the boy has given you an "out" by proceeding slowly with his workbook. This is your opportunity to agree with him and say, "Hey, since we're not focusing on your project workbook this winter would you like to try some things that might make you a better patrol leader?" You could suggest teaching/communication skills. Planning an activity, building a tower, gateway, or (brace yourself for committee member backlash) trebuchet! Is he weak on all skills? For example, can he fold a flag properly? Does he know the parts of the badge well enough to host a Jeopardy game? You want

This past week, I had a couple of non-scouting youth on separate occasions if I've ever hiked the AT. Just goes to show how popular it is. We have to be prepared to "educate" on trail. Chances are the one's who need it will not have read this thread! In fact, the more I think about it. Most of the stuff I've learned about hiking, I've learned while hiking!

E92, I assure you even here in the "great white north" something of the sort would thrill the boys. Although it would take a special group of den parents to let it happen. One of my sons favorite campouts was in a survival shelter as the snow started to fall. Our crew has a standing rule that the kid who speaks up about wanting an activity runs point to make it happen. This is a little less formal than the "activity chair model", but it is basically a play stolen from the leadership manual. Depending on the maturity of the youth and the level of "must-do" the officers give the ide

M2C, there's no "kinda" subtracting. Either you are or you aren't. We discussed the 5-mile-hike at length in another thread (http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=327760). Applying a footnote is following a requirement. It enables a boy to prove his orienteering skills -- the point of the 5-mile hike -- by using means that compensate for his inability to walk distances.

The young lady is a Venturing youth, so it is not required for her to take it for any needs of her crew. That said, I would be thrilled to have a IOLS trained youth in my crew. I would ask her to throw the gauntlet down to other venturing leaders. Because IOLS is for leaders and she's doing this for her troop, she doesn't need a chaperon of the same sex. However, depending on the maturity of the individual (or the immaturity of the other students), you may want to ask around if there is another female adult willing to take the course. You may or may not know your district's volun

We have all kinds of pockets. No secret that we take donations and hand-me-downs. The Mrs. feels blessed with with a job and a love for shopping, so when she hears that Johnny or Janey needs boots or pack she'll get 'em for bottom dollar and have me leave them on their door step no questions asked. Every boy knows that gear just sitting in his closet is doing nobody good. As a result our place is a revolving door for gear. But, charity has its limits. We don't float anyone for high adventures. If they can't put up the cash through fundraisers or their own job, they're off the ro

Honestly, the fact that the boy is having dialogue on this level shows some impressive communication skills. I'm glad you want to take the time to help him take it to the next level. Hopefully he will plan a time to teach another skill and meet with you ahead of time.

I like the way Sail thinks. The advantage of this, by the way, is that a boy can be working on a number of requirements at once, mastering each. I had the opposite experience of SP. We had a sprained (potentially broken) wrist while backpacking. And the boys had a hard time addressing it on their own, in spite of the 1st aid merit badge. They kind of had the concepts, and I bet they could repeat the skill with the materials laid out for them, but they didn't get so comfortable with the skill that the materials would be secondary. They couldn't rig a splint absent a triangular bandage.

Ea, Eag and Rat, Ditto. There is no "boy feeling he met a requirement". There is going to the PL and saying "Let me show this to you." or "Did you like the meal I cooked for you all?" or "You remember how I kept us from hiking miles out of our way?" and following up, "Well here's my book, it deserves a signature on that line." Some of the pro-O&D posters sound like they are signing off on requirements instead of the PL/SPL. First of all, that's really tiring watching 10 newbs tie bowlines, etc .... Second, that sets yourself up as the sole judge and jury. Trust me, the o

Yep, BD you did these boys a disservice. 1. You did not ask where this unit (if indeed it was a BSA unit) was from. You weren't friendly in spite of their lack of courtesy. 2. You did not take it upon yourself to explain the rules of courtesy along the AT. The simplest being: first-comers get dibs. The more nuanced being: give the old guy a little space for cryin' out loud! 3. After having read all of Kudu's posts, you didn't take time to educate this group on the patrol method (groups of 8 at least 300' apart). So thanks a lot. I'll probably be sitting on a boulder someplace

... thank you to the powers that be that Engineer61 is not a parent in our Troop ... How do you know? I can see a lot of parents in our troop fitting this mold. The SM and ASMs and talk at length to them when they raise concerns. Sometime they're right. Sometimes we offer apologies. Other times we make it clear that change is not forthcoming and explain why.

1. Not sure of the percentage. And leadership structure was not the only issue. 2. The boys in our troop love it there. Some boys whose parents spun off to another troop miss "our grass." 3. You all heard me say it before. We need a sign: "Troop ___, we take bad kids!"

100% of boys FCFY is what offends us. That a couple of "ahead of the curve" boys deservedly earn FCFY is not a problem. When you tell me that my unit lacks quality because it's taking on average 2.5 years for a boy to achieve FC, I reply that that is precicely why our unit is quality!

I think Kathy nailed it. Not only does a scout learn, a scout teaches. We teach our PLs to find out what their boys need for their next rank, build a program around it, and teach the skills for it. We have our scout-ranks/tenderfoots teaching newbies the parts of the badge. Second class scouts teach basic knots and let the tenderfoots know who they can talk to about rights and responsibilities. First class scouts demonstrate line rescues and arrange hikes. Now we don't intentionally make every SMC a review session, but if a boy can't show he knows a skill, we send hi

Nag is a hard job. Done well, everyone loves you. Done poorly, you're doomed. The parent who shows up or sends her boy with a box of homemade chocolate chip cookies -- troop cookie-master.

As a crew advisor, this comes to the fore a lot. I've known parents who simply couldn't trust the YP guidelines to keep their daughter (on case it was a son) safe. Explaining the G2SS to them in detail didn't help. One youth upon turning 18 wanted to join the crew, and I encouraged her to still get the okay of her folks. It was sad when they didn't approve, but I told her I admired her for respecting their wishes and left it at that. The parents who could trust us were the ones who were willing to come on outings and see things in operation.

Way to go, Bart, now I LOST THE GAME! I figure it's renamed because a lot of us have read or studied game theory. And you've made the WB-ers point. If you are "in the game" to "win all you can" you loose sight of the possibility that "you all can win". In other words, if the aims of scouting are not valuable, your best strategy is to get the most out of the program for you and your kid and not return too many favors. But, if the aims do have intrinsic value, your best strategy is to make sure the way is clear for everyone to achieve those aims in hope that you'll be included in