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Like any quality program, it's the combination of elements, not any single element, that makes it distinctive. Change the thread to "doing without cheerful service" or "doing without brotherhood", and what answers will you get? I think Short's points about really making an effort to connect with your local Native American tribes is important. It's important that boys participate in preservation of something of value, but making an effort to capture the nuances of the ceremony may be the best cross-cultural experience some boys will ever have. (Not everyone goes to world Jamboree.)

jp's line of reasoning is not new, and if abstaining from certain meats helps him march through life with his head held high, more power to him. However, my upbringing was closer to EA's. In SW PA, cattle and bean-crops (your protein substitutes) were for paying bills. Wild game was for feeding the family -- God's blessing to your community for setting aside lands from farming or mining. We knew hunters who were in it just for sport (and to keep their corn fields from being ravaged), and knowing Dad was disabled and Mom had a knack for finding folk who would need some help to make it t

With my oldest B&G was nice, but my favorite memory was when he, his best buddy, his dad and I went on the boys' first backpacking trip. For those two, that defined the transition from cubs to boys..

I don't think a quota would make a difference with our troop. Not all of the boys eligible get elected. If over the past couple of days, you have not helped this year's crossovers adapt to camp, you've lost nearly half your voting block. Cuss and/or prattle on rudely about the gentler sex in front of 2nd year scouts, you've just lost another 20%. That's what I love about elections at camp. After not getting called out, those boys will approach me, and we have a pretty solid discussion about how to correctly "set the compass" for the following year. I tell them the next time I hear th

MT: The term applies to protestant worship as well. And when I grew up, 'dem Presbyterians served communion then. Besides, Meryl would be really upset if we took the mass out of Newton's day!

SSSc:It really would be appropriate to have a Faith and Chaplaincy forum (look at this series!), thus alleviating the load on the I&P and other forums. Face it, a lot of us simply don't believe and the separation of F&C and I&P! I can see it now. One of us makes a comment with religious overtones and SSSc and his thought police will petition Terry to move it to the virtual "Avenue of Churches" and leave it there. This entire thread is not about Faith and Chaplaincy. This is about what policy should be used to handle the issue of unfettered expression of religion

HC - Except for one or two really active individuals, my numbers are a lot like yours, and the Troop and Crew are under the same roof. This term, our troop's SPL has two leadership positions in our crew and our ASPL has one leadership position in the crew. So, yeah, it's a drain on both units when that happens. (But it's a youth decision, so we're stuck with it.) On the flip-side, in their positions with the crew they hone some leadership skills that I've seen them apply in the troop. So our patrol method isn't any more broken than it was before we rolled out the Venturing program. IMH

Pack. It was a Papal thing. (Might makes right, basically.) There are Christians (strident anti-Catholics) who oppose a set date. Then in the U.S. capitalists seized it as a money-maker. The Nativity scene was the invention of St. Francis of Assisi. His parishioners didn't have much to offer for Christmas besides themselves, so he said "OK, That works." Then, folks who saw it said "Hey I could make a carving of that so I don't have to go out in the cold and stare at these peasants ..." Then, folks looked at the carvings and said, "Hey, we could dress up like peasants and do that!"

MT: What was wrong with allowing a Jewish display?? Not always on (and usually finished by) the 25th. Or a Santa display?? St. Nicolas day is the 8th. Or some other winter wonderland display?? Sure, how about Jan 2nd - Feb 13th? I don't think Orthodox Christians would mind -- they usually don't insist on displays in public squares on Jan 6th. The counter question: Why insist that every day/season that is special to one religion be turned into a pantheon? P.S.- In the show you were watching, did the characters actually disallow a menorah? That would be funny since t

TT We have POR descriptions that say "attend 75% of meetings and Troop activities" and then do not take attendance., Have you asked your boys the question my theapist friends hate asking. "Tell me, how does that make you feel?" If they say "Don't worry, we know who's a 50%-er, and we'll tell you if he should not be on a ballot." Then you probably are okay. If they say "Nobody can meet that mark. It stinks." Then you might want to rethink the policy with them. (Possibly increasing the importance of troop Scribe.) If they say "Who cares? You adults are going to do what you

No surprise that Christians want special treatment. They spent centuries co-opting this holiday from the pagans (and suppressing some Evangelicals who insist that one day on the Julian calendar not be elevated above any other). Now that they've made the whole thing into a syncretic secular economic engine that no idol-fashioner could ever have imagined, and demand a token of respect for their success, every marginalized group wants in on the action! Well boo hoo! Get your own day. Now if the atheists want to organize a unified display around some prominent date (say Voltaire's bir

I like your definition Brent. It meshes with our communication-oriented society. Sometimes I think we should do role call at meetings just like we do at camp. At the SPL's direction each patrol sounds off: "All present or accounted for sir" "Who is not present Mr. PL?" "Joey and Johnny, sir" "Did they both call/text/E-mail you as to to their absence?" "Well sir Joey told me he had to visit his grandma, and I know Johny has practice for the game." "Mr. PL, that was not the question I asked you." "Sorry sir. No, they did not both tell me." "Would you please, then, revise you

Never saw a big problem with NS leaders. We all come to the table with different skills. And sometimes different baggage. On the flip side, I am excited that some of my first venturers are now old enough to sign on as co-advisors. I would like my replacement to have a better "from the bottom up" perspective than I had starting out as a non-venturing leader. (Yes, having a bit of scouting experience helped, but not much.) No problem with female SM's. If the boys love and respect 'em, keep them in charge. If you ever make it down to Key West, check out the sculpture garden on the

Other facts not in evidence: The impending military career, noble as it is, can sometimes be a "wake-up" call to go after Eagle. The sudden realization that a boy might get a bump in pay-grade is enough to motivate some boys who three months earlier were dismissive of the badge. Even if that was his motivation, would I ask the SPL to find the boy a POR? Probably. But, then again, our troop does not have fixed elections. I have no idea what the history of the OP's troop is that would require them to stick to the schedule, but our troop plays fast-and-loose with elections and appoin

Our crew had several advantages when it chartered. One of them was that the youth where a healthy mix of jocks, geniuses, and thugs. Some of them wore two of those hats. I certainly think our venturing ladies were the finest in the district. The dolled up nicely for dances. But, I always thought they looked their best when they were dropping off a cliff, scrambling out of a hole in the ground, or pulling out of some rapids.

I am told the original law in PA was more for religious reasons. But religious or not, everyone's used to it now. I kinda buy into that "let the land rest" sentiment a little. And like, noname, there are folks counting on that one day a week to be able to run around and not get shot. I think some beasts count on it too. Last year I was out with my crew on the last weekend of deer season, and Sunday morning it was something to hear all of the dear whistling -- almost to say "hey guys, they stopped shooting!" Of course I get that the idiot hunter is as likely to be out on a ban

Just handed down a "vintage" venturing shirt to our VOA VP admin last night. She's seen the green shirts before but never wore one. She was especially enthralled by the fleur-de-lis on the buttons. I think it actually made her day. Can I suggest we get that detail back on the new unis?

OGE - BD's generalization is very true to my experience. The girls we know are a rare breed. I have one senior and one potential associate advisor who felt that this muck-about stuff was not for them until their husbands/boyfriends dragged them into it. des - Although true in principle, I've found crews that become "helicopter parented" as well. In fact, there are very few troop related problems that don't find their way into venturing. That said, venturing's place, I think, is to provide that "growing room" where the youth are responsible to pull everything they got from BS/GS

Do you offer elections at summer camp? Surely you have enough arrowmen among camp staff to facilitate this. As a youth you got my attention by authentic dancing during tap-outs. But as to getting my attention as an adult, O/A did the following: - The lodge/chapter chief visited roundtables asking what went well and what could be done differently. - Chapter meetings concurrent with roundtable increased visibility and were convenient if a youth from my troop wanted to attend. - My youth love some of the weekends hosted by O/A. - The lodge chief wrote a reflection in the counci

Our state has a ban on hunting on Sundays, which some sportsman are lobbying to lift. I hike and camp year-round and have not given much thought to hunters in the woods. (Occasionally when a gobbler is courting at 5 AM, I say a special prayer of guidance for any nearby hunters. ) I simply am more judicious of where I hike, and have my youth put on orange and stick to designated trails. However, I know a lot of folks who won't go out this time of year 'cept on Sunday. Lifting the ban, they feel, would remove the only opportunity for a 'safe' hike in the winter. Opinions? Especi

I was in the Bahamas on a boat full of youth who didn't like seafood. Good thing I didn't catch anything big. On the other hand, the one girl who over the past year had developed a seafood allergy loved learning to fish. Go figure. Would have been nice to see her with a tarpon on the line.

Venturing just became its own district in our council, so adult leaders of crews have an equal chance of DAM's, I suppose. Can youth submit nominations? Youth recommendations of adults was the most significant part of the VLA's in my opinion.

Sticking with the theater example, a HS group may not: Be directed solely by youth. Have a group discussion as to the next play they'll put on. Travel to visit theaters of movie shoots in the area. Examine ethical controversies regarding issues in the entertainment industry. Plan overnights on the stage of a historic theater. Run a program that helps grade-school kids plan and implement skits. Organize a special dramatic service for a religious group. A venturing crew could do all of those things. Of course, crews do mold themselves to their advisors. If the crew advis

Lisa, Ditto the above. Tell the boy when he goes to college, he'll look back and wonder why he thought any of those were hard. But tell him failure is a distinct possibility. As long as he has the sense that he might not fulfill the requirements if he slacks, the odds are in his favor that he'll overcome. We know one Eagle candidate who had the attitude that he could put everything off up until the last minute. He was only a candidate. Denial is a great path, until you slam into the wall at the end of it!

The boy didn't outright say that he explained to his SM about the catch-22 of February elections. Definitely talk to the SM about whatever you do. Maybe something got lost in translation. Another strategy -- and it's a long shot -- is to look for a venturing crew that needs an officer and multiple register with them (or transfer to it outright). Very few crews would appoint a new leader sight-unseen. (Appointment is generally up to the youth, so the boy had better come with some serious qualities to offer.) And any board of review worth its salt will query the boy extensively abo