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The gal that liked to camp, be outdoors, etc. doesn't mean that Venturing has gained a good or natural leader, it means the gal likes to camp, be outdoors and so she joined a Venturing Crew. Agreed, there is nothing in her equating Venturing to outdoor activity that indicates her leadership ability. You'll just have to take my word for it that she was a strong leader (not entirely natural, a work in progress), and without her efforts we would not have had half the hikes, no sailing, etc ... My point is she didn't name any of the leadership that she exercised as what defined her life in t

I've heard from youth who love their respective program as-is and don't want it to change. I know others who wish things we're different.

Adding to JMH, I would say that natural born leaders produce a vision that suits them, finds people who will fulfill that vision (either because they share it or are willing to adopt it) and ignores folks who don't have that vision or aren't willing to adopt it. That's where conflict may come in, and natural born leaders have to learn to become good leaders, just like the rest of us. Because you may need the folks who you've just ignored, and suddenly impersonal skills that might not have been part of your toolset have to be deployed. If you don't have them, you may have to set aside you

I hate to say it, but this may be one you can't win. But, before we throw in the towel ... By prepared, are we talking boys preparing their own meals? Are the recipes involved enough that scouts have to tend fire, get water etc ... as they prepare them? Ideally you have scouts busy enough that they work up an appetite as they cook. If not, the boys need to be active in a wide game until just before meals. Idle time is the carb-loader's playground. (Personal experience talking here!) Snacks are for after supper (that includes clean-up). Maybe even after evening campfire.

[Meant to post this as a new topic, but got an error. Anyway, it fits here.] I went to a Venturer's senior dance recital. The program had bios of the graduating class (submitted by the youth). This youth mentioned Venturing as one of her activities, but did not say that she was an officer at the crew or council level. What she did say: "often goes hiking, camping, and sailing" It's not that she wasn't a leader, or that we did not spend a lot of time focusing on leadership training. But her *focus* was not the leadership, but rather the tasks of our crew. I think natura

Same device, no delay reading topics this AM. However: - I tried to start a topic and got an error message. - I just got an attack warning trying to open a thread Ea just started.

I don't think there's a knot for that in the current program http://www.scouting.org/scoutsource/Media/InsigniaGuide/10K.aspx. There used to be one for Explorers who earned Ranger. Medals are intended to be worn on lapels for formal occasions.

If the pants are such an issue, then perhaps he is not suited to being an adult leader. I know this sounds harsh, but in the long run, what example is he setting for the Scouts? If the BSA is a uniformed organization, shouldn't the expectation be to wear the uniform. What does the Scout/Scouter gain from "cherry picking" parts of the program he doesn't like? How is that being obedient? Just doesn't mesh with the facts on the ground. Some of the most caring adults -- truly the best for the kids, the ones who best assist the SM -- uniform poorly. Some of the most pompus windbags -- ones w

While in Athens one summer, my son tried to find the scout shop to by me their equivalent of a council patch. But the shop (or the apartement that served as their HQ) was closed. I always kind of hoped it was because everyone was out Hiking and camping!

I mostly recall walking a mile to get a decent cell phone signal ... Shoot. If it were two miles I might have added it to my list.

peri - You mean Enable phase. :-) The Do the book phase! Calico, I agree. It should be natural. PL sees a boy navigating during the 5 mile hike, getting better at it each mile. Gets back to the meeting house. Gets the boy to open his book. Signs off on the navigation. Another scout brings up his book saying he hiked those same five miles. PL may refuse to sign if the only skill shown was repeating "Are we almost there yet?" every quarter mile. Most PL's are more comfortable doing this than making up a hike for everyone just so Johnny could fulfill his requirement. Al

I'm in the same boat. we're in the "muddle through" stage between old and new officers. In this situation, I pick the bare minimum that I can contribute, ask my co-advisors to do the same, and that becomes our program skeleton.

Tok, good work. My thought (trying to make it practice, but not there yet): Put as much fun into your VOA meetings as fun as possible. Get the word out that you had a blast (and conducted some business). Send letters to advisors and crew presidents making it clear that that they are missing out. Has anyone read the Venturing Monthly Program Forum guide (http://scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34342.pdf)? Were they able to implement it? Did it work?

More likely lazy instead of pompous. The guy has one auto-signature and puts every catch-all position in it. (By the way, in my previous post, I forgot that right-left carets and anything between get interpreted as .html it's usually ... Yours in a spirit of fun and adventure, _First_Name_ Scouts and other youth it's often: Yours scoutingly, Mr. _Last_Name_)

If you can't spell it correctly, don't do it! Forget quizzing. Ask the boy, "Before we start this conference are you able to do or tell me about each requirement you have signed off so far?" If he hems and haws say, "What are you weak on?" Then say, "Why don't you practice it and come back?" Then, when he's ready, you can get to the nitty-gritty of the conference. (What he liked. What was challenging. His plan. Where to take the program next.) Really, isn't there already enough paperwork in this world?

Use the titles relevant to the message. Just enough to help recipients understand where they might know the writer. Parents in the troop only need to know I'm ASM and maybe crew advisor. Parents and youth in the crew only need to know I'm Advisor. And only then after we've had a bump in membership. Why? Because they may not remember my name -- even though they've just signed the youth over to my care. Folks around council might need to know I'm both of the above and Advisor to VP-Program VOA. My wood badge SM likes to know the positions I hold as well as my patrol, so I may add "O

Assist the SM. Nuff said. (But of course, I'll expound!) If you're a morning person, get the coffee started. Night person, clean up the adult site. If he'd like you to look sharp, throw on the uniform, if he'd rather you chill, dress down a little. If he wants you to demonstrate a skill, do it. If he would like you to sit in on an SM conference, do it. However you want your boy to act towards his patrol leader, do the same toward your SM. Get to know the SPL. Accord him a large measure of respect. Go to committee meetings and roundtables. Keep an ear open to things that m

On behalf of the many youth who will benefit from your hard work, thanks for stepping in and coaching your Skipper. I've learned so much from my youth. I think I still have a lot to learn. The biggest challenge is that parents-off-the-back thing.

Oh. I thought you were going to be the COR! Two words: brace yourself. "Ethical controversies" are a hallmark of a highly functional crew. They are part of the requirements for earning awards. I'm just saying you already come with couple of topics that may or may not be of interest to the youth. It sounds like you have a good plan for working them out. Since it's taken me six years to find a youth willing to host one, I'll let other advisors comment on how they made this part of the program work. There's absolutely no reason why you can't be a ministry group that does a truckloa

Obviously adults come with experience to evaluate if a program is needed and if Venturing meets that need or if something else is in order. But we started because a bunch of GS came up to us and said "Hey, we want to go to Seabase too!". My best recruiter was one young lady who rallied our friends with the line "come on, it'll be fun!". She refused to hold an office, but she drove the program for the first couple of years. She made flyers, collected fees for the treasurer, distributed paperwork for the VP-admin. My hardest job was keeping adults off her back! My point is an adult (

We turn them in to the CO. Sometimes we make that part of the Scout Sunday service. Most times we put them in a frame and display them at the head of the coffee line.

As little as possible. Print up the first few flyers inviting kids to meetings. Do those interest surveys and capability inventories or otherwise brainstorm. Next meeting leave the room while they elect officers and maybe appoint chairmen for the first few activities. Coach the chairs of those activities on how to plan, get the word out, etc... Call your president weekly. Buy your officers lunch sometime. Evaluate. Yes, you have to adjust to the age of the youth, but not by much. My crew was helicoptered the first few outings. (By folks who in a troop would rant incessantly a

That is the one thing national *does* offer: standards and examples that show how you (and your youth) can be distinctive. Simple case (one of the first I posted on this forum): several life scouts in or troop were officers in their crew. They put that as their POR on their Eagle application. Although I had cleared this with the district advancement chair years before, the registrar at council HQ thought they could only have troop POR's since their app went through the troop. Phone call to national settled that in our boys' favor. There are plenty of "my way or the highway" folks

One other fallout on this is that we may not participate in the camp's T21 (or whatever they call it now) program. We have had good results with our older scouts teaching the younger ones the skills while at camp and us checking them once the older scout felt they were proficient. Another convert! Your boys are the best T2FC instructors your crossovers will ever meet.

C42, Sounds like you have a great vision. In broad strokes, you are offering a youth program with unique opportunities for religious service in the Catholic church. Venturing provides the structure which will allow your youth to set goals and make the most of those opportunities. The greatest challenge I find with a co-Ed crew is sufficient female adult leadership. Moms willing to hike into a wilderness area ( or spend a week in the Bahamas without a shower) are hard to find! But then challenging outdoor activities are important to my youth, and this is a significant shift from w