John-in-KC

Well, since in the 2009 Requirements #33215 National said they'd time new MBs for release with Requirements with an annual update of the website... I'd hope they decide to implement all these new MBs in December or so.

What is the focus of your Crew? Rather than a mass mail, target to those club sponsors in the HS who have parallel efforts... Has an interest inventory been done in your neck of the woods recently? Frankly, the best advertisers are your own youth.

Agree with acco40, in general. I think much depends for when youth get responsibility based on the actual membership of a Troop. If you got 2 Life, 3 Star, 2 First Class, 10 Second Class, and 10 Tenderfeet... then you may run out of experienced kids before you run out of jobs to be done. We do have to remember: Having young people in our Troops is all about them getting experience (This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

I have to agree; if the unit schedules and promotes the opportunity, it counts. It's up to parents to take advantage of opportunities in Cub Scouting, be they a Council Camp, a 4th of July parade, a picnic ... whatever. I also think generously on timeframe. Summertime begins when school lets out or Memorial Day, whichever is earlier. Summertime ends on Labor Day or when school is back in, whichever is later. That should give you 15-16 weeks of time. Frankly, this is all bling. The streamer is bling. I think it checks a box on the Centennial Quality Unit app. The boys pins or patches are bling. At 6-1/2 to 11, enthusiasm is easily maintained... just a little bling. Kids aren't jaded the way we can be. Relax This is about the kids and their trails

Our Council told me the main reason why Webelos weren't allowed at Camporee was that the Boy Scouts where doing shootgun, rifle, and axe throwing which Cub Scouts are not allowed to do. Which made me feel a lot better about being told we couldn't go. That sounds like a SWAG (Sophisticated Wild ### Guess) to me. I don't know why National changed the policy either. I remember one year we did one of our recruitments by taking the Web II dens to Camporee. Troops can still invite Webelos Dens to Troop campouts. Troops can still invite Webelos Dens on hikes. Troops can do a lot of things, just not invite them to CAmporee. I wonder how some of these 100th Year Council-wide Jamborees are going to happen? I've heard a bit about all 4 programs in one place...

The pins are not controlled items at the Scout shop, the last time I checked If they participated, give them the bling It's an enthusiasm thing

This isn't the Spanish Inquisition. Don't do a mock BOR!!! Get the formality out of the BOR for this kid at this point. He does not need that. Get him someplace where the adults are not a threat, and make it a convesation, not an Inquisition. (This message has been edited by a staff member.)

Wait in Line? What's that? I regularly get to visit EagleSon at his University. I pass a Missouri Department of Revenue weigh station on I-70. This thing has in-ground preliminary sensors about 2 miles out, and culls drivers at about 1/2 mile from the true scales. Trucks slow down from speed (limit is 70, most run about 65-68) to 25MPH or so. They normally generally most of the time make a running pass over the scales, then start building up to speed again. There is parking space, but the only time I see it occupied is during the winter, during/after storms. OTOH, rest areas seem to be an attractive option locally.

BSA is not the only owner of property for Youth Serving Organizations. In my neck of the woods, there are church camps as well as Camp Fire has a Council camp. The challenge is there's a cost increase. GB on BSA property, with members of BSA being the training audience, cuts costs a bunch. Logistically, a pilot course should be talked about with the SE or whoever manages his program support, and should strive to get the best folks possible for the faculty. Further, program development means lots of time investment by Staff. Finally, training audience needs to clearly understand they are a pilot, and Goofy Things Will Happen. That's why you have pilots, to find out and replace what does not work.

E, More importantly, you also have the bride! UA does make non-formfitting stuff. I have a polo from them. Not bad. My problem is that if cotton kills, so does polypro. It's 100% hydrocarbon. Wool is the material we need to work with. Sigh.

A minimal Troop such as yours is at risk. The loss of one Scout at recharter means no charter renewal. Simply put, these youth need to be mentored to start making the Troop grow. Peer-level recruitment is the short-term solution. Deploying Den Chiefs back to a Pack, building relationships, and bringing boys along in due course is a long term solution. Of course, good program is an essential. That means moving to the Patrol Method. There is another thread on Scouter on how a 1 Patrol Troop can run. Simply put, it's called simplify the Troop into a single Patrol. Instead of PLC, it's a Patrol Council. The object of the exercise, of letting the youth be a miniature working democracy and community, still works. Again ... complete training sequence through WB for adults. Training through Council NYLT for youth.

ACP&P #33088 used to (2007 ed) allow other than adult leader app methods for MBC renewals. Does anyone have a 2009 edition? Have the words changed? Annual renewal of MBC status is a requirement. One other possibility is the SE got a report back on how many Scouters did not have their background checks done from National, and decided one way to clean up that problem was to flush the MBC rolls. Pure speculation.

Agree with shortridge, Ed, and Mafaking... 1) SM talk to the Scout ... find out what scares him about 3 on 1. 2) Change the format. Sounds to me like this young man could use sitting around the picnic tables at the local park shelter, vice "The Trump Boardroom." 3) We're talking TF and 2C here. Let's help the boy out ... Tell him you'll all share the Oath and Law. That way, he's sharing a common ethic.

To go with Gunny's remark... There ARE times for true butt-chewings. I don't think this is one of them

Our distict has and does invite SPLs to RT for particular functions: Planning camporee program is one of them. I think the other part of this is that the 11-18 year band was to learn the functions in relatively small groupings. The Order provides leadership opportunities beyond the unit. Exploring (70s version), now Venturing also provides leadership opportunities beyond the unit.

A technique I've learned over the years: - Two positives for every negative. Many people, in fact, advocate 3: Two before the negative, then 1 after.

What Crew21Adv said. Now, I will reach my hand into Rick's rucksack. I do not advocate the current unit level youth leader training. STAY AWAY FROM IT. Find a copy of the past generation unit Junior Leader Training (JLT). It's more outdoor skills focused in teaching the skills of leadership. I will say, though, send the older youth to Council level youth leader training (that's next summer). Get the adult leaders fully position trained, and then get them to Wood Badge. THEN: Start giving the working democracy of the Troop to the youth. Sit back. Shut up. Be there as a mentor and a role model. Let them fail---> THEN, help them learn from the failure, and let them go again. As our friends Lisa and Gunny will tell you, it can work.

Scoutings' Reverence is not Christian Reverence. The DRP says not one word about Christianity. BSA supports all three major families of Christendom (Catholic, the Protestant denominations, and Orthodox), Judaism, Buddhism, Hindu, Islam, and a host of others. The family unit is the home of the Scouts' faith. Scouting is a support agency. A worship service which would deal with all the faith families I mentioned above ... would result in multiple layers of anathema. How does a Chaplain reconcile "I am the Way, the Truth, and the Life; no one comes to the Father but by me" with "There is no God but Allah, and Mohammed is his Prophet" ??? It's a reason I have yet to volunteer for camp Chaplaincy. The spiritual encouragement of other folks, I can handle. Staffers should have sacred writings or important teachings of their faith near to hand. Chaplains can leverage those. Homesickness is homesickness, a Dear John is a Dear John, a family death is a family death. Corporate worship is my challenge point. There are other ways to encourage campers and staff in faith. I know camps where the chaplain, in the evenings, in staff village, helps the young people earn their HS level religious emblem. I know ones who lead Bible studies (within their faith families). I know one who brings a barbecue cooker, and the staff have a fellowship night. Scouting is a support agency. We're expected to provide support, but there are ways to get there from here.

His Troop, where he is a youth member? Should not even be an issue. His employer, who pays him to be working on time? Might well be an issue. The local Council is paying him $$$ to come to work, have his head in the game, and serve the paying customers. When a boss sets a standard, and then enforces the standard, no one should be surprised. There'll be an end-of-year staff banquet, if your Council is anything like mine. The staff will get an envelope of stuff given to them. Often, there is a letter from the Camp Director. At my camp, the Director has two versions: One is an explicit invitation back for next years staff. One thanks the employee for his work, but does not invite him to apply again. He made his own bed, soon will be the time to sleep in it.

Basically, what shortridge said. The first step is to share your concerns, quietly, calmly, with Mr Scoutmaster. I recommend away from the Troop or Committee meeting site, someplace neutral, someplace where you can get "a friendly cup of coffee." Have your own Scouting program knowledge in a row. If he listens and acknowledges, great. If not, Mr ASM, you have a decision to make. As an ASM, you work for the SM. He's the principal program officer. If you wish to carry this forward, you may need to ask for a new adult leader app and shift to the Committee (as an ASM, you're NOT a member thereof). From the Committee, you can raise the issue, first quietly with the CC, and there less quietly, by way of the committee as a whole. If this still doesn't work, then your right path is to ask for a business meeting with the CC and the COR, and lay it on the table. How important is this to you? How far are you willing to carry it? Are you prepared to be thanked for your past service to the Troop, and given a farewell? That is a real and potential second order consequence.

We have enough problems with unmastered skills. We have enough problems with integrity as is. No, I disagree, boomer. Log should not open until First Class.

krb, Feedback is a gift. We're asking for it from you? What happened? What have you decided with your son or for your son? Were we able to help you?

My 1st generation Camp Trails Skyline pack lasted well into the 90s. I had the one that you had nylon flatcord cinches. Dad's pack, bought the very next year, discarded the cinch cord and went to rivets. Dad's pack also had the first of the 4" hip belts. Mine was 2" nylon web, period. What might make sense is a very careful review of the entire Camping MB curriculum. Some of my thoughts: - Camping log cannot open until you are a First Class Scout. - Bump the camping requirement up to 30 days and nights. - Allow ONE long-term residential camp in the log, up to 6 nights. AND - Allow ONE backpacking expedition in the log, up to 6 nights OR - Allow ONE canoeing expedition in the log, up to 6 nights. Either of those latter two require set-up/tear down nightly. One goal of camping is the ability to establish a comfortable sleep for yourself. I think also increasing requirement 8 (camp cookery) be increased to: While at a long-term camp or on an expedition, serve as Patrol Cook for six meals (two breakfasts, two lunches, and two suppers). Prepare meals for yourself, at least seven other Scouts, and one adult. NOTE: This is absent an Advancement change which brings Cooking MB back to the Eagle List.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

Couple of thoughts: 1) What ScoutNut and Ed said. Parent and Own Child does not make what he did any more right or palatable though. 2) As a DL, you can control the adults who attend your meetings. 3) As a DL, you can visit with parents and explain how you expect parents to support Cubbing, including encouraging all your youth. 4) Observe your young charges closely. If they merit praise for behaving maturely for their age, give it to them and their parents. 5) Nolo Bastardus Carborundum.

Long, long ago my Explorer post did a holiday weekend trip on the lower Colorado River. We put in at Needles, CA, overnighted on a sandbar by the Santa Fe railroad trestle at Topock, and we came out I think at Road's End Camp on the California side. For that trip, we were all relatively new to canoeing; we did the ARC Basic Canoeing course at Marina Del Rey to put us on the commong grid. The trip was co-ed; there was a GSUSA group of teens who were part of the trip. All of us had Swimming and Lifesaving MBs (while there were no Eagles among us, all the boys were experienced Scouts), the girls had similar basic skills. For boating pairs, we buddied off naturally, with the adults rotating through boats at each break, so there was some shifting. I still remember how dead the water was on Lake Havasu, after having had a current for most of the float. I thought being a 400 freestyle swimmer caused me to have good arms. Wrongo.