John-in-KC

What do National Camp Standards for Cub Scout Day Camps say? What does the Council say? What does the GS Council say?

Here's the deal: - If a Scout is not attending meetings, don't recharter him. At the same time: - If Scouts are not attending meetings, ask yourselves and them are you delivering a program which is interesting, challenging, and exciting? If as a SM you hear that Billy is doing something which is outside the Oath and Law at school, have a Scoutmaster Conference with him. Model the standard. If the Scout refuses to attend a SM Conference, make a note of it. Then, talk to you District Advancement Chair. The Troop which is working to support the Aims and Methods will get more support from the DAC than the unit he visits after an appeal is started. What am I saying: - It's the Oath and Law for the Scout to live. - It's up to us, the Scouters, to know what is happening in our charges' lives, and how they are living the Oath and the Law.

That's not a rumor. HOAC is part of the pilot group. We are two years ahead of most Councils. Last year, all Program Officers (CM, SM, Coach, ADV) had to be position specific trained. This year, all direct contact leaders must have the appropriate position specific training, or they will not re-register to that position. I presume ScoutNet is being tied off in such a way that the data dump for online recharter includes position specific training. For the rest of the US, implementation begins next recharter. There is a course week at Philmont Training Center called "Implementation of Required Training." The 1 paragraph blurb is: Implementation of Required Training Learn about the new unit level adult mandatory training requirements in order for the unit to be rechartered. The course will include training requirements for the top leaders (going into effect in 2011), and the contact leaders (going into effect 2012). Also included: updating the council training committee to meet the needs of trained leaders; and changes to training courses which will need to be taught in the district/council to meet these new requirements. June 20-26 It's going to happen.

What's going to be interesting is the part about 2 year lifespans of YP certificates. You can register for MyScouting without a BSA ID now. That means Mr and Mrs Smith can sign up and do the YP training ahead of turning in their app. I wonder if online recharter will block a member from recharter, and he/she will have to do a new app entry? ETA: I have absolutely no reason to doubt anything over Jim Terry's signature. He was our SE in Kansas City, he's a truly solid citizen.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

jhankins, Actually, not true. ACP&P (online), p32: "?The candidates unit leader introduces him to the members of the board of review. The unit leader may remain in the room, but does not participate in the board of review. The unit leader may be called on to clarify a point in question. In no case should a relative or guardian of the candidate attend the review, even as a unit leader. There is no set of questions that an Eagle candidate should be asked. However, the board should be assured of the candidates participation in the program. This is the highest award that a boy may achieve and, consequently, a thorough discussion of his successes and experiences in Scouting should be considered. After the review, the candidate and his unit leader leave the room while the board members discuss the acceptability of the candidate as an Eagle Scout. The decision must be unanimous. If the candidate meets the requirements, he is asked to return and is informed that he will receive the boards recommendation for the Eagle Scout rank." Emphasis added. While you cannot undo what's been done, you can and should revisit his trail. The other thing I would recommend to your DAC and District Chairman is that they send a co-signed letter to the Charter Organization Representative if there are deficiencies with the Scout and the Unit. The Commissioner's Service is to be a friend to the unit, but the Advancement Operations Committee serves to maintain the standards of the Boy Scouts of America.

I absolutely agree. Living the Scout Oath and Law begins the day a Scout joins. Peers, SMs, ASMs, Committee folk, and yes, parents accept an obligation to make support the youth in doing that. If a Troop passes a youth member up the line, then changes their mind at Eagle, I'd be asking "what changed and why?"

Stosh, Then tell him at 18, unless he joins Venturing, he is most likely finished with BSA.

There is a tremendous amount of emotional energy being spent right now. The young man is an Eagle. You cannot take that away from him. I've never known of a National revocation of rank. If the young man is worth investing time, energy, and care into, then do it. Keep him as a youth member. If, in your evaluation, the young man has learned everything you have to offer, thank him for his years of learning in your Troop, and show him the door. I really hope you make the former choice.

There's a reason why places like this, Scouts-L, and facebook are still heavily used and MyScouting is still chasing its tail.

Lisa, I agree ... this is moving out of the program world...

IMO, If you unit is doing this as a Scouting activity, you follow SSD and follow procedures to check the swimming hole. Then, you follow procedures to operate the swimming hole. From G2SS: http://www.scouting.org/sitecore/content/Home/HealthandSafety/GSS/gss02.aspx#_safe Safe Area: All swimming areas must be carefully inspected and prepared for safety prior to each activity. Water depth, quality, temperature, movement, and clarity are important considerations. Hazards must be eliminated or isolated by conspicuous markings and discussed with participants. Controlled Access: There must be safe areas for all participating ability groups to enter and leave the water. Swimming areas of appropriate depth must be defined for each ability group. The entire area must be within easy reach of designated rescue personnel. The area must be clear of boat traffic, surfing, or other nonswimming activities. Bottom Conditions and Depth: The bottom must be clear of trees and debris. Abrupt changes in depth are not allowed in the nonswimmer area. Isolated underwater hazards should be marked with floats. Rescue personnel must be able to easily reach the bottom. Maximum recommended water depth in clear water is 12 feet. Maximum water depth in turbid water is 8 feet. Visibility: Underwater swimming and diving are prohibited in turbid water. Turbid water exists when a swimmer treading water cannot see his feet. Swimming at night is allowed only in areas with water clarity and lighting sufficient for good visibility both above and below the surface. Diving and elevated entry: Diving is permitted only into clear, unobstructed water from heights no greater than 40 inches. Water depth must be at least 7 feet. Bottom depth contours below diving boards and elevated surfaces require greater water depths and must conform to state regulations. Persons should not jump into water from heights greater than they are tall, and should jump only into water chest deep or greater with minimal risk from contact with the bottom. No elevated entry is permitted where the person must clear any obstacle, including land. Water temperature: Comfortable water temperature for swimming is near 80 degrees. Activity in water at 70 degrees or less should be of limited duration and closely monitored for negative effects of chilling. Water quality: Bodies of stagnant, foul water, areas with significant algae or foam, or areas polluted by livestock or waterfowl should be avoided. Comply with any signs posted by local health authorities. Swimming is not allowed in swimming pools with green, murky, or cloudy water. Moving water: Participants should be able to easily regain and maintain their footing in currents or waves. Areas with large waves, swiftly flowing currents, or moderate currents that flow toward the open sea or into areas of danger should be avoided. Weather: Participants should be moved from the water to a position of safety whenever lightning or thunder threatens. Wait at least 30 minutes after the last lightning flash or thunder before leaving shelter. Take precautions to prevent sunburn, dehydration, and hypothermia. Life jacket use: Swimming in clear water over 12 feet deep, in turbid water over 8 feet deep, or in flowing water may be allowed if all participants wear properly fitted, Coast Guardapproved life jackets and the supervisor determines that swimming with life jackets is safe under the circumstances.(This message has been edited by John-in-Kc)

Roundtable is one of the obligations of the Local Council to the Chartered Partner and its unit(s). I extracted the following from a charter agreement 12-182R (I googled this one, you can too!): The council agrees to Provide year-round training, service, and ***program resources*** emphasis added to the organization and its unit(s). From the 2009-10 Boy Scout Roundtable Planning Guide #34253: The mission of the Boy Scout roundtable is to provide quality resources, knowledge, and skills to unit leaders to enable and motivate them to deliver an outstanding program to their Scout troops. Roundtables focus on program highlights for upcoming months, not on the current month. Who attends Roundtables, again from the same document (I googled it, you can too!): Who Attends Roundtables? Roundtables are for all troop leadersScoutmasters, assistant Scoutmasters, and troop committee members. Unit commissioners attend the roundtables in which their leaders are involved. This may mean dividing their time between Boy Scout and Cub Scout leader roundtables. The quality of a District Roundtable is a direct responsibility of the District Commissioner. It's in his lane. He/she appoints Roundtable Commissioners for each of the 4 programs of Scouting (I think Varsity has a "Huddle Coordinator" vice a RT Commish). These folks are to recruit a staff and serve the units. I will say this: We just completed our Program Planning Fair for the 2010-2011 program year. As part of that, we gave each of our attendees a survey. The District I serve has the attendance problem common to all Districts. Even so, our goal is 100% Scouter attendance. We look critically at what we're doing and what we need to do to boost attendance, both in terms of units attending and people attending. Simply put, RT Commish and staff have to look at themselves as deliverers of the Scouting Charter promises to the units, and have to comport themselves as professionally as they would in their day jobs.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

In our Lodge, the Publicity Chair of the LEC grants "press passes." Others are asked to refrain during the ceremony proper (sashings and congratulations are considered outside the ceremony proper). The stated reason is the same as turning off cell phones... distractors to the Candidates and the Ceremony Team.

We have been here before: http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=172912

Sometimes we adults need the Scout Oath and Law worse than our youth members

A Scout is Reverent. There are churches in the US which take a strict reading of the New Testament. The church the OP comments about seems to be one of them. They have chartered one or more units but have given guidance on who will be permitted to serve as a Scouter. There remain three questions the OP must ask herself: - Does this Troop apply the aims and methods to its Scouting program such that her son and charge shall get value from membership? - Do the temporal practices of Faith by this church conform with her understanding of Scripture? - Does she beleve this church and its Scout troop is the right place for the growth and development of her son? If one or more answers are NO, she has a moral and personal duty to part ways with this church and unit. Otherwise, let her son enjoy Scouting

Would someone lock the barn door please? The horse ran away ... If you want to be increidibly technical, use 124 days ( 4 x 31 ) for Star and 186 days ( 6 x 31 ) for Life and Eagle. No one can question the quantity of tenure then. (Quality is another story...) Now, the only time my own son advanced "on the guideline" was First Class to Star. With Scout Camp behind him, all the merit badges were in hand. All he needed was leadership and service time. I think my first question when I hear about advancement tenure is "What's the rush?" There's usually plenty of time(This message has been edited by John-in-kc)

The one element I've seen no one discuss to this point is the ethic of community service we try to instill in our youth. A fair bit of that is first by working on others Eagle Projects, and then developing and executing their own projects. We, as Scouting, would lose a fair bit of that, perhaps forever. I believe it matters that we serve beyond our immediate needs. Without service beyond self, our society descends fast and furious into the "bread and circuses" mentality which was part of the fall of ancient Rome. That's what I would see as a first order consequence of ending attaining the rank of Eagle Scout.

They can run reports that should be printable to file ... after all, FOS call lists are directly printed reports from ScoutNet. I know also they can save it out as PDF format ... and these days, you can copy/paste just about anything dumped in pdf. Of course, if your DE is a Luddite, or a komputer klutz, you're in trouble ;-)

If you think there is rhyme and reason over time to how BSA licensed the uniform to Hollywood producers ... May I introduce you to some Alabama wetlands I have for sale?

I could live with a patch for my sash. Don't change the bloody sash, though. One of the things I object to is that by the mere happenstance of birthdate, some Brother is going to, eventually, rub another Brothers nose in "I'm a Centennial Arrowman and You. Are. Not." Mark my words.

The dad is not registered with the troop, but is registered as a MB Counselor. I do intend to alert our District Advancement Chairman. Yes, do call the DAC. The DAC needs to reinforce the "no 1-on-1 contact" rule with the Districts' MB Counselors. If an incident happens in the future, then the DAC should conveniently omit MBC renewal from this man, or should go the full YP procedure of contacting the SE. There are some who would say that since this man is a registered Scouter (albeit with the District as a MBC), you need to report this to the SE and let him decide on YP issues. I think I'd have a quiet cup of coffee with your DE, without names, before you make that decision.

From a former youth member of the Order (as in over 32 years away from my voting days): OUR SASHES AIN'T BROKE. DONT FIX THEM!!!

1) Insure the trailer and its contents. I don't care if the Chartered Partner picks up the tab, or if the unit picks it up. Insure the trailer and its contents. 2) What Pack212Scouter said ... you can google an array of sources. Here's just one: http://www.universalboot.com/ (I have no interest in them, and cannot vouch for them ... it's an example only) 3) Up to a point, what the Judge said ... but also, if you're in an area of relatively high theft, think about indoor storage. Remember nothing is foolproof anymore. Your goal is to harden the target (your trailer) enough that it's not worth the effort to thieves.

My two cents: I think I'm a reasonable man. If you start the clock when the Scout asks the Advancement Coordinator for a Board of Review for advancement, then I believe it reasonable for the Coordinator to say "Bill, I'll let you know next week if I have a quorum. Meet me during pre-meeting and if I do, I'll give you a time and a place. Are all your other requirements done? Good, may I borrow your Scout handbook this week?" The ball is now in the Advancement Coordinator's court. He/she goes out and asks the CC if he wants to sit in (imnsho opinion, the CC should routinely sit in on BORs ... it's that feedback to the program thing), then he asks other members of the Committee. When a quorum is had, and a time is set, the Coordinator visits the Scout at +1 week and tells him something like "Next week, 7PM, here, ahead of the meeting." Now, both sides are being courteous of each others' time, helpful in making advancement happen, and friendly in teaching the Scout about managing appointments. Three months? I wanted to use old Army invective when I heard that. Mark, I think this is one where you ask the SM, to carry your water ... directly to the COR. Adults do have responsibilities in a Scout unit ... to implement the Adult Association Method among other things. This is an area where the COR can give directive in nature guidance to the Committee As I said, my thoughts...