Eagledad

"""Yes, the OA is a service organization. But there was a camaraderie in the work. Sometimes that "cheerful spirit, even the midst of irksome tasks and weighty responsibilities...." resulted in turning it to fun or even turning the task into a joke to make it more bearable. Sadly that is missing. When I was CA 10+ years ago. I suggested promoting the fun stuff as well as doing our own. We sent folks to fellowship and conclave. We had fun meetings and even did some special trips. Our work load didn't decrease, in fact we did a few extra community service projects. OA was getting back on track for a while in my neckof the woods. Eagle94-A1""" This isn't just OA, this is Patrol Method. I took this quote from the OA discussion, but Eagle94 is really hitting the idealism of the brothers in the patrol as well. The objective of the patrol is for the scouts Practice struggling, and come together with ideas so often that they can eventually read each others mind. They reach a place that being in the patrol isn't about scouting together, camping together, cooking together or even competing together, it's about being together. One poster commented that Arrowmen in his area didn't enjoy the program because it service wasn't fun. But that means they haven't come together as brothers. They were simply doing a task they were assigned. When the scouts start organizing activities to serve together, then the weighted task are easy, even fun. The 4 Steps of Team Development are Forming, Storming, Norming and Performing. The key step there is Storming because that is where the team members (Patrol Members) start to hold each other accountable for doing their part. It's called Storming because the members push back and forth until actions of humility bring balance. Humility is not a natural human action of young males because it exposes them to harm. Pride is their natural reaction because it's raises a barrier that protects them. The barrier also prevents the clay shaping bonding that forms a productive team. The members of a productive team develop a trust with the other members where they can let their guard down. Human instinct is to hold your weaknesses close to you. Once you build the trust with the other members of the team, a relationship builds where the members not only enjoy being with the team, but also liking themselves more as well. Team members use your best skills, and that feel pretty cool. So, how do we get the patrols to push to and through Storming part of the patrol method. Well, the more they struggle, they more they have to rely on the team the relieve the struggle. Competition is a really good method of applying stress into a team. But any struggle works. I found High Adventure Crews typically go through the Forming, Storming, Norming and Performing steps in just a few days because the trek is compact with struggles. Most High Adventures are both physically and mentally stressful through most of each day. There is very little relief until after the evening meal. Takes about 3 days to reach storming, then the rest of the trek to reach Performing. Crews are pretty bonded by the end of a trek. The natural leaders will stand out and the rest of the team does their part to support the goals and vision of the team. Most scouts of a crew never loose that bond even after they break up after the trek. I believe that preparing meals is the most stressful activity of a patrol on a normal monthly campout. Many troops like to make meals as easy as possible because there is so much stress. Pop Tarts for breakfast, sandwiches for lunch and canned spaghetti for dinner with the adults cooking Sunday breakfast as the scouts break camp. Instead, encourage the patrols cooks healthy hearty breakfasts, hot lunches and complex hot dinners. Not only should they cook Sunday breakfast, but prepare lunch as well. Why are troops in so much of a hurry Sunday? Building teams takes time, troops should be using as much time as they can get. I also encourage competition as much as possible. Inspections are a wonderful application of stress because they forces the scouts to keep a neat campsite. While two scouts are cooking, the rest of the team has the task of cleaning up the campsite. A tent mate may have to role up his partners sleeping bag because he is busy with KP. Time is the Scoutmasters best tool for creating stress. When a patrol has less than an hour to get up, cook, clean up and get camp ready for inspection, they will generally come to troop assembly late until the come together as a team. I love "Time". I used it a lot. To build a team, the adults must push a program that forces the members of the team to function together. But most important, the program should apply enough stress and struggle to force the team to hold each other accountable. Once the members start lowering their guard with humility and accepting accountability, then they start to bond through trust. I enjoy watching mature patrols because their is no limits to their goals and abilities. Like the mature OA team, mature patrols are naturally servant oriented because they outwardly act toward the rest of the troop they way the act toward each other. No wonder new young scouts are naturally attracted to them. These patrols not only make hard work look easy, they also make it look fun. It's hard for the adults at first to push a program that challenges scouts to the point of storming because they believe the hostile actions toward each other are bad behavior. Truth is the Scout Law guides how to behave in stressful situations. Adults want scouts to feel that stress often so they can learn how to control their actions. As the adults guide the scouts to use humility in their behavior, they will quickly cross the line to Norming. And then it gets fun from there. I know, but I was bored with all the other discussions. So, I started one on a subject that is fun for me. Not that they aren't good discussions, they are. I'm just adding a little variety. Hope you don't mind. Barry

Me too. Often. Barry

I’m just trying to start a discussion of raising the bar, 1 in 10 is an acceptable ratio. Ordeal should weed them out even farther. Still, 28 nights is only 12 camp outs and one summer camp. Not that 30 nights isn’t enough to be an outdoors expert, but most troops don’t even encourage high adventure until 14. Is 12 Car Camping campouts and one summer camp the definition of expert outdoorsmen? I really believe exceptional maturity is the goal along with exceptional expertise of the 8 Methods. You can pick the age, but I believe 13 would be minimum. honestly, I don’t believe this cultural will allow elitism in the program other than Eagles. That is why OA became what it is. This is the generation of mediocrity. Barry

Double, maybe even triple the camping requirements and restrict the number of scouts elected to 1 for every 15 scouts in the troop. Barry

LOL, I truly feel your pain. There seems to be no end of redefinition of expression during these Political Correct times. What next, burn all the old books? But, to be fair, OA started out as a service organization. Well, service and camping organization. The early Arrowmen focus on service and outdoorsmenship They were the best of the best. Selection was more stringent, which is why most Arrowmen early days were looked up as the better Best) Scouts in the unit. I think if OA is to make some kind of comeback, the organization needs to go back to the higher standards of outdoorsmenship and selfless service. I'm not sure how they can go about in this toxic social media world, but even today, there are scouts, then there are the real scouts. OA needs to focus on selfless service (which are really outward actions of the Oath and Law), and expertise in outdoor activities. Those scouts will standout out as noble in the scouting movement. But, I think the change will have to come from within, National hasn't got a clue. Barry

Call the local scout office and ask them for the numbers to the units close to you. Ask them for the day and time of their meetings and go visit. You will likely run into friends. Barry

But they are very close. And the committee sits at the pleasure of the CO, not equal. Council does not like to upset COs because they would rather the COR be the bad guy with enforcement. Council will train and counsel COs, but they rarely wrestle with them. Barry

I'm holding little hope for common sense in our culture anymore. The local paper commentary congratulated the new girls joining the Boy Scouts. "Now the girls aren't treated like second class citizens". My first thought was what the GSUSA thought of the comment. Barry

Ok, I ask the wrong question. You think you were being kind? Sometimes you surprise me. Barry

Do you really believe that’s the same thing! Sheesh! Barry

Up until the 60s (Bill Hillcourt), the BSA had visionaries and founders who when they spoke, everybody listened. We don't have that today. There really is no accountability because there isn't a vision to relate with. Oh, the BSA has their Vision and Mission Statements that hold many of us accountable, but I would guess 2% of scouters could even get close to repeating the intent, much less the words of those goals. Scouters work outside the lines today because there is very little instruction to describe those lines. And if they find themselves in trouble, they dig in because they invested so much of themselves into the role. Humility is rare in this culture. Barry

And to be fair, most of what we get here is one side of the story. As well as our responses tend to be idealistic because we don't have all the story to be pragmatic. We had a troop of 250 scouts with a very Eagle Mill reputation. When I asked some of their scouts and parents why they joined that troop, it was because they really like the program. Is that really so bad? Not my style, but 250 families had no complaints. Barry

It depends a lot on the program. The adults camp is set around 100 yards away from the scouts. Or as out of sight as we can. The adults even reserve a separate campsite at summer camp. The distance prevents that father son camping question. Each have to go out of their way to see each other. Barry

Is there any other benefit to learning skills? What about the practice of setting the goal of learning a skill and developing a plan to to reach the goal? And what about the practice of communication to ask for help to learn, or to show the learned skill. Scouts who practice the traits of initiative, planning, and communication have more self confidence to push the boundaries of their comfort zone. They accel in many of their life decisions, not just advancement. As some here are describing of their own experience, consider the life skills a scout can develop through the practice of learning skills during their scouting experience. Barry

Run your Fall open house a couple of weeks before Cub recruitment night in September, and be sure and get the names and phone numbers of all the youth who visited. Make sure the list is divided up into age groups. Call the parents and explain that you are building the dens and you are just verifying they are still interested. If yes (and most are), ask the parent if they would be interested in being one of the den leaders. Make sure you use plural leaders so they don't feel singled out as THE leader. Its a couple hours of calling, but in most cases we had all our dens built and ready to go before Cub recruitment night. If you get enough new leaders, you might even be able to get District to send a trainer for a private Den Leader training session before they do their official district training. You will be rocking and rolling right out of the box. Barry

Yep, so are our opinions of not focusing on advancing so much. One other thing, our opinions are for all troops, not just one gender. Seems to make a difference I wasn't expecting. Barry

Does your post even make sense? Are all the girls 15 years old? Are there no 11 year olds? Inexperienced leaders shouldn't be forcing advancement so fast. Experienced leaders shouldn't be focused on advancing so fast. All you are talking about is advancing. Why? I admit I haven't led girls, but I can't imagine they joined the BSA only to advance. Surely one of them wants to sleep in a tent and hike up a trail. Surely. Adventure, adventure, adventure. Barry

Boys leave a fun adventurous troop because they aren't advancing? I have never seen that. I know of a lot of scouts who took two years to earn 2nd class, but that was because advancement was the least fun part of their scouting experience. I think you have the right objective of a program letting the scout choose his path of advancing, but the example you are using is not common. Something is missing. We coach adults to build a fun program where any scout can advance "at his pace", whatever that pace is. And quite frankly, that is a difficult program to build because it requires a unit that can attend to a scouts request for learning and showing off new skills 365 days a year. It also requires an adult staff that isn't concerned that some scouts are much slower than others. I'm curious to learn more about this troop. Barry

Ah, we must be talking about your troop. We think differently. Advancement is toward the last subject I discuss with the adults of new units. Advancement starts adults off in an accountability frame of mind. New scouts want to learn how to set up a tent and start a fire. Can they fish at the lake? What is this KP stuff? Adventure, adventure, adventure. Barry

Because even in the best units, all scouts advancing together at the same pace that fast implies a fast track advancement program. Scouts are individuals with individual desires and motivations. I've yet to see a program where pushing scouts through advancement is the best way to keep them interested. Adventure, adventure, adventure. Sadly, many adults seem to believe that happiness comes through advancement. Those are the units without older scouts. Barry

I don't know, when a unit works this hard for advancement, maybe the pencil whipping question is appropriate. It's not a big deal, but I certainly would ask if I were UC just to make sure the adults understand the big picture of fun and adventure. This unit could be led by experienced adults who know how to blow past this part, or inexperienced adults who are trying to rush forward. How much experience do these adults have? Barry

I would be curious to learn how much experience the adults have. Aim and Methods are generally learned skills. Barry

A really good thought provoking post Navybone, thanks. As a mentor, I strive to get the scouts to look at the basic principles of the scouting values. In one sentence, what do the Scout Oath, Scout Law, "do a good turn daily", and so forth have in common. What is the cornerstone principle for the actions of the scouting values? My style of mentoring is guide the scout to answer his questions, because the process of self conclusions is the profound motivation to change a habit. It's one thing to be obedient because the adults says so, it's different when the scout determines it is the right thing to do. I want the scout to answer to himself why he acted the way he did. As I stated before, I'm skeptical of a 10 year old making a protest of this nature. Acting out of step of the herd exposes one to danger, which is why the behavior is not instinctive at this age. Barry

The only time our scouts are required to wear the uniform is during travel. We learned 50 to 75 teenagers running around at road stops can make people pretty nervous. The uniform connects scouts to adults. Ironically, we also found the folks at stops act a little better when surrounded by scouts in uniform. That still amazes me. Barry

From my life experiences, you are the rare exception. Barry