Eagledad

I have to agree about changing up your meetings a little. Some troops wear troop t-shirts in the summer. Different meeting places is a great idea. Keep the troop meeting to prep for the campouts. AND, plan fun campouts. Lets all throw out a few theme ideas. Triathlon campout where the troop has to pull up stakes in the morning and bike, hike and canoe to another campsite several miles away. Think about the training for meetings like preparing the bikes and taking a few small bike trips. Or, canoing at a local lake to practice strokes and loading gear. A troop night camporee. G

>>Let me just say that this is "wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong..." Any Scout, at any time, can ask the Scoutmaster (directly) for a Scoutmaster Conference - for rank, or any other purpose. A Scout Troop is not a corporate office, where the "lower ranks" have to go through a chain of command to speak with the "guy at the top" (which, BTW, in a Scout Troop isn't an adult - it's the SPL).

>>Well, I disagree

Great Post Gunny. A unit learns a lot about performance accountability when they have retarded or handicap scouts in the unit. How to apply equal accountability with unequal abilities quickly challenges adults with equal expectations of all scouts. Scouting is about growth and each boy grows differently. Scouts should be mentored as individuals. Barry

>> Well eagledad, back in November you seemed to be arguing against relative morality as just being whoever has the biggest stick, while absolute, unchangable "religious" morality was the way to go...

>>When something that should be an absolute morality becomes a situational morality, that is the point where society loses its moral compass.

>>Of course we executed those guys for war crimes when they did it. Its when our officials attempt to justify this immoral behavior is when I think we've lost our moral compass.

>>"Stosh, I see your point in that its hard to teach servant leadership to scouts who don't care. But that is not a good reason to throw your hands up and not teach it at all." And where did I indicate that?>Ever notice that if the PL doesn't call his patrol, the adult will cover and make the calls at the last minute? This is call enabling, not teaching.

>>I do agree that we have lost our moral compass. We torture our war prisoners and think nothing of it.

>>do think if left to the scouts to select their patrols most would be similar in age and interests. It seems adult leaders when deciding who should be in patrols that tend to mix the ages. When I chose my friends as a boy they tended to be about my age and did things I liked to do. Adults tend to try and make patrols "look even", and that is not what patrols are about.

I agree as a society we are loosing the moral compass. I think we have been for a long time. Until the 1940s, many if not most families had a bible laying around because it was an easy common book to own. Most folks before that time actually learn to read using the bible. It didn't mater is you beleived in God or not, you learned a moral direction based from one main source. That gave society as a whole a basic moral direction that most everyone agreed. We don't have that common source today for moral guidence. There is not one basic direction that society as a whole can point and say that is

>>I still cannot tell if you support that process or not. Your troop has unwritten guidlines, which pretty much means you have none. The BSA has written guidelines that are inter-related with other elements of the program. Which do you suggest for gwd to do?

>>Personally, I look forward to that week away from the world. A week to get away from ringing cell phones, clacking keyboards, and the glare of computer screens and watch the glare of the sun coming up. I look forward to a week of listening to bird songs in the morning and sounds of boys having a good time during the day, the lapping of water in the creeks, streams and lakes, and the ever-present tree frogs at night.

>>I think what we have here is a failure to communicate.I am more than happy to explain how and why we I have done things in relationship to the scouting program. But you should be courteous enough to ask what it is I do, and ask what I think, rather than consistently "tell" me. Because you constantly misprepresent me, and that is a very unfair way to discuss a topic?>"As far as the topic of THIS thread goes. Do you agree that according to the BSA program...The PLC determines the qualifications for being an SPL and that the youth elect him, and the SPL slects all other youth leders

>>For one thing I do not see where the BSA program supports "waiting for the scout to be ready to lead". They have 7.5 years to learn and practice leadership skills and the sooner they start the more they will learn. We start teaching leadership skills when they come to their first meeting. They don't realize that is what is happening, but that doesn't stop them from starting the trek.

>>"However, it does reference one important issue that may make a difference. This author states that servant leadership won't work when tasks need to be done. The author is incorrect. He treats Servant Leadership as a method equlivalent to directing, coaching, persuading and delegating, When if fact Servant Leadership is a phiosophy (appraoach) within which the styles of leadership (directing, coaching, persuading and delegating) are used.

>>My experiences do not support that view. I have seen and experienced a number of troop programs that went from adult run or chaos where no one lead, into a boy run troop and using the Patrol Method in about 18 months.

>>And how is this really a boy-led program when it is nothing more than the boys learning what it takes to follow the SM's directives?

>>Of course a good servant leader is a follower. As I mentioned in the patrol-method model I presented earlier, each group is part of other focus groups. The patrol members are the main focus. The PL works to meet the needs of the members, but at the same time the troop-staff of boys are working to meet the needs of the PL's, and the adults are working to meet the needs of the troop-staff.

>>It never ceases to amaze me that just when I begin to despair over something happening in our Troop, something comes along to revive my spirits.

>>This is why troops who routinely inject New Scouts into Experienced Patrols commonly complain about not being able to get the patrol method to work well. It's not that the patrol method doesn't work, it is that the leaders do not realize that every time the patrol make-up is altered it will diminish the ability of patrol for a period of time.

>>TLT should not be a long lecture from the Scoutmaster. It should be an oppportunity to get the boys talking and thinking about how youth leadership works in a troop and what role the adults play in it.

>>I would strongly disagree with Beavah that the leadership skills a scout learns cannot be applied outside of scouting. In fact I think horse hockey would be putting it mildly.

Burnout is the number one cause of scouts leaving the BSA. Do what you have to do to maintain program quality. We told all parents that Den leaders would not assist in any other activity. Some did because they enjoyed doing it, but we gave them the out if they needed it. Also, most of the new adult leaders come from these voluntiers. So the more you can pull in, the better chances of them joining the staff.

>>I like the idea of having the parents reach in instead, maybe give the boys/parents the option of letting the boy do it if he wants,