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zuzy

Eagle board of review?

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Even adults need to prepare for interviews and reviews in their lifetime. I'm not condemning prepping, but I do believe there is way to much focus in this discussion on prepping scouts to protect them. Of course there are a few bad examples of adults out of line, but they aren't the norm. The message in this discussion should be that the troop program should be sufficient preparation for an EBOR. How does the SM know if the program is sufficient? By the comments of scouts in the other rank BORs.

 

Barry

 

We prep because we don't control who the Council sends. If I could honestly state that an Eagle BOR was just the next step up from the Life BOR, then I would not see the need to prep. Due to experience, however, there are situations in the Eagle BOR that do not come up in our Troop BOR.

 

I would rather spend my time prepping a boy for a potential ambush, then fight the politics at the Council level. 

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We prep because we don't control who the Council sends. If I could honestly state that an Eagle BOR was just the next step up from the Life BOR, then I would not see the need to prep. Due to experience, however, there are situations in the Eagle BOR that do not come up in our Troop BOR.

 

I would rather spend my time prepping a boy for a potential ambush, then fight the politics at the Council level. 

How do you prep for the unknown? What ambush? Has one of your scouts failed an EBOR? 

 

You may have a good reason to prep for a specific situation, but as I said, I think the message to all scouter is that a quality program is the preparation for evaluating a scout's progress in the program. 

 

And politics? If nobody expresses concern about improper behavior at any level, how can it ever get changed? I always saw results by the Council and District when I submitted concerns. 

 

Barry

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On the topic of "ambush questions"...  if your district/council has a tendency to behave like this (on occasion) and you're aware of the types of "gotcha" questions they ask, why not take advantage of that and slip a few of those situations into the Scouts Life and Star BORs ?

 

I'm not suggesting that you intentionally ambush your younger scouts... rather, introduce the concept by asking them how they'd respond to, or feel about, a line of questioning that impunes their knowledge, experience, or capability, and then discuss how to deal with it calmly without having an emotional meltdown.  

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If the boy is in control of his EBOR the odds of getting ambush questions diminishes.  Ever have a candidate read the passages in the Scout Handbook to the panel members to show where they were wrong in their assumptions?  I have.  That tone of confidence in the first 2-3 minutes of the EBOR set the tone for the rest of the review.

 

I have also seen where the one-two word answers by the boy has initiated a conversation by the panel on whether or not the boy really wanted to be in scouting at all if he isn't anymore excited about it than one or two words answers.  Ambush question?  No, but one that got the boy justifiably squirming in his seat.

 

It works both ways and the choice is always in the hands of the boys to control.

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In reading this topic, I can't help but think of how, as a lawyer, we prepare people to have their depositions taken.  A deposition is where the other side gets to ask questions and the witness has to answer those question.  Our preparation goes through what to expect (the introduction the other side uses, what we can object to, the fact that is is being recorded) and how to answer questions (Rule #1 - tell the truth).  We also walk them through a "mock" deposition which is designed to be more difficult than the actual deposition will be.

 

At an Eagle SM conference, we explain to them that the EBOR is just like the BoRs they have done before except that our CO Rep and someone from District will be there.  We explain that the role the person from District takes varies from an observer who asks a couple of questions to someone who tries to run the EBOR.  We explain the order of things (parents, SM, scout) and explain that like the other BORs it isn't a test and it is highly unlikely they will have any problems because we believe they are truly an Eagle Scout.  We then ask a lot of questions as part of the Eagle SM conference -- far more questions than will be asked at the EBOR.  The questions are designed to have them reflect on what they have done to make it to Eagle, what they will do in the future as an Eagle and what it means to be an Eagle.  At the end, we tell them that the questions will be similar and that if they answer them they way they did in the Eagle SM conference they will be fine.

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The sad part of the whole issue for us is that the EBOR panel they will be addressing is a total unknown.  We know what SHOULD be going on, but without any of our personnel in the room except the optional SM, it's an unknown for the boys.  Sounds like other councils have an easier setup for the boys.  It's always nice to have a familiar face or two in the crowd.

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I happen to like the unit BOR with District Guest method.  It allows the Scout to choose the place.  I happen to believe EBORs should be rather memorable.

 

It allows me to choose his board, as a CC.  I've been able to create some rather character filled boards for youth.  Some great conversations happened.

 

I won't say our troop did it best.  We did it.  My two cents.

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Yah, @@John-in-KC has a good thought there, eh?

 

I like EBORs in the field.  There's just somethin' nice about an EBOR around a campfire.   Changes the tone of the conversation for everyone.

 

B

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Yah, @@John-in-KC has a good thought there, eh?

 

I like EBORs in the field.  There's just somethin' nice about an EBOR around a campfire.   Changes the tone of the conversation for everyone.

 

B

 

I love this as well - would make a great memory - would need to get the District folks involved for us though.

 

I have done about half of my Eagle SMCs on campouts or the trail. 

 

When I was a Scout they did a mass Eagle BOR night. Must have been 10+ people in the room when I came in and they started asking their questions after I had delivered the Oath, Law, etc.

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Not an EBOR, but some standard BORs I've done in the field. Long story short, one unit was having problems getting enough adults from the troop to sit. Did 2 BORs at the camporee around the fire with folks from the district committee. SM was getting frustrated with the committee, or lack thereof, and took care of his Scouts.

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Not an EBOR, but some standard BORs I've done in the field. Long story short, one unit was having problems getting enough adults from the troop to sit. Did 2 BORs at the camporee around the fire with folks from the district committee. SM was getting frustrated with the committee, or lack thereof, and took care of his Scouts.

We do this all the time. We find adults standing around and do a BOR. I guess that is why I don't understand Scoutmasters being concerned with strangers on EBORs. Our scouts likely sat with several strangers on all their BORs.

 

Barry

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Being a new troop with untrained adult MC'S we have been doing COH'S at camporees so our adults can observe and learn from experienced scouters. They tend to be at the campfire a natural place to be.

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Some folks who sat in on the boards who thought it was a final exam for a military rank. Not accepting the scout's answers on what he wanted to do with his life as 'worthy of an eagle'. Threatening to turn down the scout because he muffed the outdoor code. 

 

I wanted to revive this thread, particularly this part highlighted.

 

I just heard from a new district advancement rep that he wants all Eagles to have the Outdoor Code memorized. I cannot recall anywhere, besides the Outdoor Ethics (Action/Awareness) Award where memorizing the code was "required". I get testing a candidate on the Oath, Law, Slogan, Motto. However, the Outdoor Code was never a rank requirements, so testing them on that should be informational at best.

 

Thoughts? Comments?

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When the scout has SMC does the troop do a board of review for the rank BEFORE the actual Eagle board of review.

 

In the scout book, there is a spot that needs to be checked off for SMC and the a board of review below needs to be checked off.

The BOR for Eagle is the EBOR.  

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