Sentinel947 Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 I think CambridgeSkip gives us an indication of the future... It won't be bad.I believe there should be seperate organizations for Boys and Girls. They generally go to schools where they are together, and have plenty of other co-ed activities. Having a Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts gives each a place to develop and be themselves without the pressure to impress the opposite gender.That being said, I think the BSA's going in the directions of being co-ed, and that it'll be fine. ​​​ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattlePioneer Posted December 5, 2015 Author Share Posted December 5, 2015 I see that the military is now permitting women into any military specialty. In recent military episodes, women have suffered about 3% of the fatalities. I presume we will now see women recruits sent into infantry, armor and artillery units just as often as men, and we should expect women to be suffering 50% of the fatalities in the future. In recent decades, women have greatly benefitted from being excluded from combat arms. They have been assigned to military specialties that were usually far less arduous and risky than the combat specialties. Men contemplating enlistment could expect to be among those suffering 97% of the combat deaths, while women could expect to be assigned to specialties suffering 3% of the casualties. I hope that kind of blatant discrimination favoring women will be a thing of the past. But I doubt it. Now where is the demand that stand by laws for draft registration apply only to men be amended to add women? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted December 5, 2015 Share Posted December 5, 2015 Anything less than draft registration for all women who turn 18 years of age would be demaning and promoting the hypcrisy of a men's only obligation. Other countries around the world expect their women to be involved in their national security, why not the US? @@Charles le Martel well said, welcome to the forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jpstodwftexas Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 If I was " Boy Scouts of America" I would be Honored that families want ALL their Children involved in the Best youth Organization in the United States. If I was "Boy Scouts of America" I would welcome any youth wanting to be involved in the Boy Scouts of America and not other organizations in the midst of Declining Memberships If I was "Boy Scouts of America" I would welcome them instead of telling them to go elsewhere. If I was "Boy Scouts of America" I would be honored that Daughters inspire to follow in their Father's foot steps and Become an Eagle...Some Eagles don't have sons..Wonder How many 2,3 and 4th Generations have missed out continuing the Eagle tradition because they were born the wrong sex. Someone suggested joining the BSA just to take their Daughters camping....Why would anyone be interested in Volunteering in the BSA just to take their Daughters Camping when They can do that without helping BSA who are saying their Daughters are unworthy to be members but give BSA their Money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 If I was " Boy Scouts of America" I would be Honored that families want ALL their Children involved in the Best youth Organization in the United States. That of course is debatable, even here on the forum we struggle to get a consensus on the issue. If I was "Boy Scouts of America" I would welcome any youth wanting to be involved in the Boy Scouts of America and not other organizations in the midst of Declining Memberships Not all youth programs are in declining memberships. If I was "Boy Scouts of America" I would welcome them instead of telling them to go elsewhere. If someone wants piano lessons, they don't go out for the football team. If I was "Boy Scouts of America" I would be honored that Daughters inspire to follow in their Father's foot steps and Become an Eagle...Some Eagles don't have sons..Wonder How many 2,3 and 4th Generations have missed out continuing the Eagle tradition because they were born the wrong sex. One doesn't need to alter it's programming focus just to accommodate some family tradition. Just this last summer I took my daughter camping..... and my granddaughter. I didn't need the BSA to facilitate it either. I had an ASM with 4 boys. He was Eagle with 2 palms. None of his boys cared one iota about being an Eagle, but dad made sure they all were.... Lovely family tradition there. Someone suggested joining the BSA just to take their Daughters camping....Why would anyone be interested in Volunteering in the BSA just to take their Daughters Camping when They can do that without helping BSA who are saying their Daughters are unworthy to be members but give BSA their Money. My daughter is GSUSA Silver and my granddaughter will be joining American Heritage Girls when she's old enough according to my daughter. A small handful of people don't make a majority, but a small handful of whiney people get media coverage sufficient to turn a program into something it was never designed to be. In our narssasistic entitlement culture of today, everyone is entitled to be a Paper Eagle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merlyn_LeRoy Posted December 6, 2015 Share Posted December 6, 2015 So when will the Girl Scouts accept cisgendered males into their organization? They do. http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/20/living/girl-scouts-welcomes-transgender-girls-feat/ Why shouldn't we let in girls? We cannot discriminate based on any other reason. The BSA still discriminates on the basis of religion; the GSUSA doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJCubScouter Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 (edited) They do. http://www.cnn.com/2015/05/20/living/girl-scouts-welcomes-transgender-girls-feat/ They actually don't. That story was about transgended girls - i.e. someone who was born male but is now considered female. Eagle was talking about "cisgendered males." "Cisgendered" is a fairly recent term used by some, to mean someone who is NOT transgendered. I can understand the confusion because a lot of people have never heard the term "cisgendered." Just to add: I don't think the GSUSA's exclusion of boys is really relevant to the BSA's decision that Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts remain all-male. The BSA has to do what is right for the BSA. Edited December 7, 2015 by NJCubScouter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cambridgeskip Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 I think CambridgeSkip gives us an indication of the future... It won't be bad. I believe there should be seperate organizations for Boys and Girls. They generally go to schools where they are together, and have plenty of other co-ed activities. Having a Boy Scouts and Girl Scouts gives each a place to develop and be themselves without the pressure to impress the opposite gender. That being said, I think the BSA's going in the directions of being co-ed, and that it'll be fine. ​​​ Will BSA go that way? Looking in it would surprise me if it happened in the foreseeable. There has been enough going on in the last couple of years that I could see your national HQ pausing to lick their wounds before trying anything else controversial. If it does happen will it be ok? Probably. Reading through all these threads they echo more or less word for word what was said here before TSA went fully coed. I haven't seen a single differing argument on either side. When TSA did go coed (albeit it happened in stages) it was all perfectly ok. There was only one incident where one group refused to take girls. National HQ dismissed their leader team en mass and that was the end of that! It was a one off incident though. So yes I suspect it would be fine. Whether BSA choses to go that way is up to you chaps though. What is more curious is this. The first groups went coed in 1991. All new groups were coed from 2003 and all groups were coed from 2007. The proportion of girls has been steady at around 20% for some years now. So a minority but a significant proportion none the less. Despite all that time and the significant number of girl members a huge number of none members are still surprised to find that girls can be scouts. It still seems to be part of the national consciousness that scouts is for boys and guides is for girls. In time I'm sure that will change but for now it's a message that hasn't got across. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rick_in_CA Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Okay, a long post for my introductory contribution. I notice these attacks are one-way only: against anything for men and boys, Christian, traditional, or reverent. I've been an activist my entire adult life beginning as an undergraduate at Penn State. You never, ever, ever see the reverse. Normal poeple have no disire to force themselves on another and can't imagine it. It is the stock in trade of the so-called liberal. Allow me to elaborate. Then your experience is rather different from mine. While I have experience my share of "wacko liberals" in my time, I have also experience plenty of nastiness the "other way". In fact, I find your statement basically ridiculous and ignorant. No one on the right is "attacking" anyone on the left? We have various "Christian" groups demanding the death of gays, the deportation of all Muslims, the disenfranchisement of non-Christians, etc. There are plenty of right-wing wackos out there attacking anyone that disagrees with them. Unfortunately being an offensive, aggressive, hateful idiot is not a liberal or conservative thing. It's a human thing that people of all stripes can fall victim too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted December 7, 2015 Share Posted December 7, 2015 Just about every stone I turn over I can find a wide variety of creepy crawly things..... Compost is great for the garden..... Turned over a pile once and found a rattle snake. I still like compost for the garden..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghjim Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Devil's Advocate here, but we had rules of membership before. They were tossed away because we've "progressed" as a society as to not discriminate on any basis....supposedly. So how can the organization justify discriminating against girls when: 1) They let in women, 2) they have girls in crews now, and 3) we are supposed to be eliminating barriers. Slippery slope the BSA has created. Had the ultra-conservatives on the executive board not steered the BSA off into a new direction in the 1980s we wouldn't be in this position. I agree the BSA is in a tight spot. I am in favor of forming girls troops but I can see the other side of the argument. Jim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScoutingRadio Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 So when will the Girl Scouts accept cisgendered males into their organization? Seriously though, if the parents wanted the same activities for thei daughters', then why not voltunteer to be a leader and take them camping? Its a topic we are discussing also on Scouting Radio about the Californian Girl Scouts wanting to join the BSA. Taking the above from Eagle94 - I believe the Californian Girls find the GSA programme boring and out dated. I believe the USA may be the only country in the World without co-ed Scouting. Listeners have been commenting all week from around the world, some calling the Girl Scout programme old, out dated and even sexist in its approach of Girl Scouts baking cookies while boys do the adventure. Both Associations are failing to grow in membership numbers. So I'm throwing out 3 scenarios 1) Is it time the BSA adopted Girls to the programme. If not why not? 2) Is it time the GSA and BSA merged to become Scouts America? 3) If neither of the above what would you change to make the Girl Scout programme more attractive to Girls? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stosh Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 Its a topic we are discussing also on Scouting Radio about the Californian Girl Scouts wanting to join the BSA. Taking the above from Eagle94 - I believe the Californian Girls find the GSA programme boring and out dated. I believe the USA may be the only country in the World without co-ed Scouting. Listeners have been commenting all week from around the world, some calling the Girl Scout programme old, out dated and even sexist in its approach of Girl Scouts baking cookies while boys do the adventure. Both Associations are failing to grow in membership numbers. So I'm throwing out 3 scenarios 1) Is it time the BSA adopted Girls to the programme. If not why not? 2) Is it time the GSA and BSA merged to become Scouts America? 3) If neither of the above what would you change to make the Girl Scout programme more attractive to Girls? 1) They have to a certain extent. They've been on that slippery slope for some time now. 2) I believe BSA and GSUSA have an agreement not to. 3) Start listening to the kids to see what they want and quit running a "program" that adults think the kids want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gumbymaster Posted December 8, 2015 Share Posted December 8, 2015 (edited) 3) Start listening to the kids to see what they want and quit running a "program" that adults think the kids want. Be careful what you ask for @@Stosh, I would not be surprised if more than a few Boy Scouts would love to have the Girls join the troop and be on their events and activities with them ... even if it was for the 'wrong' reasons. Edited December 8, 2015 by gumbymaster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattlePioneer Posted December 8, 2015 Author Share Posted December 8, 2015 Our district will be conducting a "1st Aid Oree" during a Tuesday night in April. It will be organized by our BSA district, but Girl Scout groups will be welcome to participate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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