dan

Scouts are specifically prohibited from having most electronics. I would be fun to see that list! NO really I would not find holes in it! Or is the policy worded just like that. Leaving the decision of what most is to each individual, as they see fit. So that each counselor or camp person can say, that is a most electrical thingie give it to me?

Would it be possible to stop beating a dead horse? Uh no, it is what we do best! My sons troop also had a no electronics policy except for flashlights. So I started confiscating watches. Boy did that tee some people off. I also took the SPLs alarm clock away from him, he said that he needed it to make sure he got up in the morning to get the troop up, I told him he should have brought a wind up model, so he would not be violating the great troop policy. The troop no longer has a no electronics policy, I am not quite sure why?

I am good at assumptions.

What is you retention rate? If they are not working on advancements at meetings, what are they doing? Do a search on attendance and you can find a few thread just like the patrol size thread.

Cost of Uniforms- Our SE says the shirt could be sold for $15 if the BSA bought them overseas What the heck kind of shirt would that be? I am assuming from this post that the SE believes a scout shirt is a uniform. Did I assume correctly

acco40 I do not believe that is part of the NYLT course. But now I have to go double check! edit I believe that is an option that some council do. This was discussed at the course advisor's meeting.(This message has been edited by dan)

Hunt You lost your case in your first sentence when you said. everybody hates the official pants. This is not a true statement.

I will agree that some 12 to 13 years old could go to NYLT or JLTC and get a lot out of it. The problem is that not all are ready for it, and apparently the Scoutmasters do not know that they are not ready for it, or do not care. Last Year I spent on average 2 hours a day for the first half of the course, dealing with home sickness, this was after the SPL had tried everything he could with the scouts. We have a unwritten rule, that we will only send a scout home as a last resort. A home sick scout ruins the training for the entire patrol. Last year we had 3 homesick scouts and 2 that did not want to be there. The letter says that the SM picks the scouts and that they should have a least one year of long term camping. Talking to the homesick scouts over the last 3 years, one thing has been said by almost all of them. Yes, they went to summer camp, but there Dad or Mom where with them either as a SM or ASM.

I thought you had seen the information mailed to the Scoutmasters, from your posts over on google. Only running 2 troops this year. Not because of AC power, had this covered.

antichrist reread the original message, it was a scout asking, on how he could become SPL and be good at it.

Show me a troop that is not uniform and I bet that they bend other methods.

ps56k Did you notice that the "council" is also reducing the number of participants this year?

There are so many other questions than is the troop a Eagle Mill or not. It goes so much deeper than does the troop work on Merit Badges for most of the meeting or most meetings. But if they did I would look for another troop. My question to the troop would be do you follow the AIMS and Methods of the BSA? Ideals Are the scouts being scoutlike at meetings? Patrols Do patrols choice its members? Is the PL in charge of his patrol? Does every patrol member have a position of responsibility? Cheer master, Grub Master, etc.? Outdoor Programs Do you go camping once a month? Do you have High Adventure tripS every year? Do you do service projects? How often? Advancement FCFY? Retention rate, after 1st year? 2nd? 3rd? 4th? Personal Growth Are the scouts responsible for his Position of Responsibility? Are they coached and given help? Leadership Development Is the troop boy run? Are they coached and given help? Does the PLC create an agenda for meetings and campouts? Does the scouts vote for the SPL? Does the SPL pick his team? Uniform ?Do I dare go here? Well certainly! If the leaders and most scouts are not in FULL uniform, most likely the troop is willing to ignore the method of uniform, they will have no problem changing other methods.

johndaigler look in the mirror. now why do I think I will have to explain that to you also?

Why are so many thin skinned on this forum? You do not have the right to never be offended.

WOW, I find this unbelievable! We have many troops that tweak the Boy Scout program, to fit their ideas of Boy Scouts. But the leaders of a Venture Crew cannot come up with a good program without someone telling them what to do? I find it amusing when I see a scout troop that starts a Venture Crew. And than wonder why the scouts do not have time to do things with the crew and troop. They are suppose to be in the Troop and the Crew plus have a personnel life outside of scouts. They are trying to take the busiest youth and splitting them in to many directions.

OGE The question about the man of Steele was in reference to the man who received the award Maj. Richard G. Steele. Not our esteemed member from Alabama, ASM1.

I would not say that NYLT is modeled after WB for the 21st century. The course is still a Month is the life of a troop. Utilizing the 12 leadership skills. The leadership skills are the same but the way they are presented are different. So far I have been very impressed with it. This Saturday we have out 1st meeting with the entire staff. The SPLs will be explaining the difference and what is still the same to the staff. I am looking forward to how the youth staff accepts the new syllabus. The BSA have said that this year Councils can run the the old JLTC course or the new NYLT course. Next Year all Councils will run the new NYLT course. From what I was told, they are trying to get all Councils to use the same course, trying to phase out the old Brownsea course that some council still run. I have been told that some of the skills being taught will be brought over into Wood Badge next year.

I am the twit that started that thread. After discussing what I thought where short comings, I see that I was looking for more out of the course than what it really is. But I thought it was a good discussion. In fact driving home form work, I had what I thought was a great idea for the course, by the time I got a chance to reply, the posters had made such a good case on why the course is like it is, I never even had a chance to put my foot or keyboard in this case in my mouth again.

EagleInKY I am surprised that you would follow that a memo that cannot be found anywhere within the BSA. I say this memo is as good as the terms Class Alphabet soup uniform terms. But I still maintain that camo pants are looked on the same way as blue jeans. But take this as you may, this is from the Rules and Regs, but it is a "few" years old. "BSA Rules and Regulations, Article X, Section 4, Clause 4. Prohibition of Alteration or Imitation: a). No alteration of, or additions to, the official uniforms, as described in the official publications, or the rules and regulations covering the wearing of the uniform and the proper combinations thereof on official occasions, may be authorized by any Scouting official or local Council or any local executive board or committee, except the National Executive Board after consideration by the Program Group Committee. b) Imitation of United States Army, Navy, Marine Corps or Air Force uniforms is prohibited, in accordance with the provisions of Act of Congress, approved June 3, 1916." Know we can discuss if hunter camo is a imitation of the armed forces.

So EagleINKY What are you saying? I have seen the supposed document. Why do you suppose it was only a memo, if it really was a BSA memo. I am not convinced to this day that it was really from a BSA executive. Why do you suppose it never made it into the rules and regs? Maybe old Roy did write it, but it is still only a memo from an ex executive, I put about as much weight to that as I do any rules I hear that are not within the BSA documentation.

The BSA has not outlawed camo. Camo is as much of the uniform as blue jeans or dockers or orange shorts.

The 11th edition says Scouts may wear troop or camp T shirts with the scouts pants or shorts. But what does MAY mean? What is a "T" shirt? But remember it is only a method. And the last one on the list of methods.

Can someone please tell me how you have your children share the same philosophy as me! Subliminal messages? Play recorded messages in their rooms while they are sleeping? I have a son that is more conservative than I, and a liberal daughter. You should hear these 2 debate!

Vicki You may want to check out this thread. http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=74205 Has anyone here purchased a hat from him yet?