Eagle94-A1

Yep, a patrol's day activities do not need adults. And yes if there is an adult, only 1 would be needed since there would not be "one-on-one" contact. Wife was concerned that she would need to stay home with me since son is having a patrol meeting at my house. Not needed since A) it's a patrol day activity ( meeting) and no adults are needed and B) there won't be any one-on-one contact anyway.

TAHAWK, There are so many problem with Common Core, that many school districts, and some states, are doing away with it. The math examples I've read are so out there, that folks with math and engineering degrees have issues with it. Read on about my history comments. Pack, I couldn't read the entire link as it was to painful and aggrevating. First and foremost, I hate group work in a school setting. Some folks in the group do all the work, while others sit in the background. Other times, directions and goals are given out, only to find out that folks go off on tangents that have no relation to the assignement. Yet everyone in the group gets the same grade for good or bad. As for the approach used, it is pure malarky. Nothing is ever done in a vacuum. In order to fully undserstand something, you have to know the events and context that led to the document. I also don't like the fact that from there appears to be little to no individual critical thinking, despite appearances to the contrary. A lot of group think. T2Eagle, Depending upon the students I had, I agree that it would be a challenge for them to realize that the answer is in the previous paragraph. I worked in one of the night school for working adults programs. Most of my students were older, and would have no problem as they had some critical thinkming skills via pre-1980s educational theories. I did have a few younger students, going to school in the late1990s, early 2000s. An aside. I was an education minor in the early to mid 1990s. One of my profs was a fiesty, retired HS principle. She was a mix of the mandatory educational theory, but more importantly real world practicality. She wasn't a fan of alot of the educational theories that have eventually evolved into Common Core. A lot of the predictions she made about the failure of these theories is coming to pass.

My thoughts. 1) have the PLs or buddies talk to the ones who missed. We had a few who did not like to camp, and they did drop. We have one who is highly allergic to peanuts and he has very protective parents. We have one whose mom said no camping in cold weather. And we got a few who can only camp when dad has custody. And we have one extremely bizarre situation where oldest brother can go only if ex-step dad is not camping, and younger half-brother can only camp when dad has custody. 2) Scheduling. I know growing up, my troop had to deal with 14 different school calendars. No joke, we had a public middle school calendar, public high school calendar, and 12 different private/parochial calendars to deal with. Scheduling was a night mare. 3) Parents. As someone already stated, parents may not be comfortable yet with troop's leaders. We have a sitation where Mom will not send the boy camping unless either his dad or I are camping.

Good grief, I am so glad I homeschool. As a one time historian, I can tell you that is not how I was taught to read and understand historical documents. Nor did I teach my college students that either. You needed to know the time, events, etc to understand the document.

For me, this is Learning for Life under a different name. Me personally, they need to get rid of the "Scouts" in STEM Scouts and there is no OUT inthe program, only classrooms and labs.

I have a hard enough time doing the commissioner UVTS inputs. SCOUTNET is a pain to use, and I have high speed internet. I live in a rural area, and I remember it taking 4+ hours to download the online YPT due to connectivity. So I know we have units not logging in their service. Heck we have units not doing internet advancement still.

Make sure you don't get the jac shirt wet. While wool will keep you warm when wet, it bleeds. One of my uniform shirts has pink spots from when I was in the rain with the jac shirt on.

I fi've heard of the program, but not details.

In the troop I'm talking about, all of the scouts save one are First Class through Life. They have one Tenderfoot. Also to go along with #5 above. 5A) All the youth positions are appointed by the SM. Reason being to give everyone a chance at a POR.

Exactly! One of the reasons they are losing scouts. From talking to scouts who have left; 1) Meetings feel like school. 2) For those who have the MB already, boredom, misbehavior, or playing basketball are the options. 3) Focus is soley on the "older" scouts: working MBs and getting Eagle. The new Scouts are not learning the basic T-2-1 skills. 4) Not enough camping and fun. 5) Adults doing the work (which is really sad since they sent 2 Scouts to NYLT who came back fired up and ready to go, only to have the SM and adults shut them down) One of their scouts transerred and got Eagle with the new troop. Guess what, unlike the Eagles in his old troop, he's staying around for 2 reasons. 1) He wants the Hornaday Award ( he's planning a project at this time) and 2) HE'S HAVING FUN WITH THE NEW TROOP (caps for emphasis, OK maybe a little shouting in joy )

Peri, Alas, the troop in question is getting the parents registered as MBCs and they are doing MBs as their only program. Most camp outs they do now are MB weekends. One scout that transferred to us said the campout with us in which the scouts did trailblazing and goofing off was the best camp out ever. I can't wait to see him on one of our water weekends. Now that we got 2 trailer hitch equipped vehicles, SM can bring sailboat, and the other driver can bring the canoes. edited: reminds me of a Cub Scout pack with the leaders doing all the work

Peri, Sorry about preaching to ya. The entire "meetings = MB sessions" idea is hitting me personally. As you know, one of the troops in my neck of the woods is doing just that. While the boys in the troop are advancing rapidly, the troop is losing Scouts left and right . Way it looks to me, troop won't be around in 5 years, if not sooner.

Peri, A lot of folks, when the phrase "merit badges sessions at meetings," or however you want to phrase it, think completeing the entire MB at the end of X number of meetings. The Troop Program Features, or as some old fogeys will slip in at times "Woods Wisdom," focuses on skills rather than completing the MB. Can a MB be earned with a little extra effort, yep. I know when we did canoeing back in May for the trip, we covered requirements 2-12 either at the lake in training, and/or on the trip iteself. For those who want the MB, requirements 1 and 13 remain. Again the idea is to focus on the skills and prep work needed on the monthly trip, not necessarily getting the MB.

BLW, One of the biggest differences between Cub Scouts and Boy Scouts is the program. Cub Scouts has advancement oriented meeting now , whereas Boy Scouts is not so much. While some MB requirements can be met during some meetings, that is not the objective. What happens is that the PLC picks 12 topics they want to do during the year. Sometimes info can be found here http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/34425.pdf, other times they make their own. I admit the only MB we ever taught was canoeing, and that was in preparation for a weekend canoe trip. Meetings were at the local lake. highlight of the month was the canore trip.

Not Girl Scouts, but with American Heritage Girls and now Frontier Girls. I know of a pack that had an AHG troop that did camp with them as alot of the Cubs also had sisters in AHG. With AHG no longer associating with BSA, that AHG troop became a Frontier Girls troop.

My thoughts: 1) While STEM does have a place in Scouting, "OUTING is three-fourths of ScOUTING." (William "Green Bar Bill" Hillcourt) if there is no "outing" it aint Scouting. 1a) Maybe the STEM push is for national to learn some math and get the quote correct in the BSHB;) 2) Folks at national need to remember the mistakes of the 1972 Improved Scouting Program that took the "OUTING out of ScOUTING." Because BSA took the emphasis off of the outdoors, membership dropped drastically. 2a) Could it be that all the Eagles from the 1970s that didn't go camping are a reason why troops only need 4 camp outs a year for JTE as well as the "one and done" mentality? 3) If national really wants to promote STEM, do away with some of the current height restrictions on pioneering projects, emphasis doign things correctly and safely, and have some fun.

Wanted to add a few things as I was under time restraints. 1) Had to practically beg them to invite Webelos to camp with them 3 years ago. Thankfully one of the ASMs had a son in my den and they finally did get invited. But then I had to do it again last year, trying to get another den invited to camp with them. Another troop invited those Webelos because the CO's troop waited until a week before the event to invite them to join them. 2) I mentioned how they invited my son's den to a meeting a month before they were to cross over. My son and I didn't go as my mother-in-law was in the hospital. But from two fo the Webelos who did attend, they stated they felt a lot of pressure to join them. This past year, they didn't even invite Webelos to a meeting. 3) Pack leadership tried to coordinate Scout Sunday with them and never get response. 4) My son realized he didn't want to join that troop after his camp out with them as a Webelos I. But I told him not to discuss it with anyone, and encouraged him do any activities with the troop if invited despite knowing he would not be going there. I didn't want his entire den following him to another troop. His best friend joined the troop with him, and the rest joined the CO's troop. It was only after they joined the troop and began getting frustrated that I talked to them and their parents about visiting. Out of the 5 that went to that troop, 2 transferred to use, 2 quit, and the ASM's son is the only one left. 5) Because they do nothing with the pack, nor go to RTs, last year's Webelos leader met both the SM and ASM of my troop at RT. His Webelos were invited to camp with us, visited one of our meetings. Yep they joined us except for 1. He had friends in another troop. 6) So far this year, they have done nothing with the Webelos. And those parents and leaders who are hearing about the lack of camping, not participating in district events, etc are concerned. One reason why the CM actuallly went out of his way to meet and visit the troop. He sees we are not perfect, but knows what our plans are and has and a relationship is developing. 7) I've seen this since I was a Webelos, if a troop doesn't have a relationship with its pack, then you cannot expect them to automatically join you. You gotta nurture a relationship

BLW, I feel for you. I'm a Cub Scout leader with one CO, and a Boy Scout leader with a different CO. I talk about the troops activities, and have invited Webelos to one of my troop's events. I know of at least 2 Webelos who will be crossing over to us next year. My question is this, what has your CO's troop done with your pack? I feel bad for the CO as they do support Scouting. I do not want to see their troop die. Heck I helped train the original Boy Scout leaders, worked with their scouts, and it was because of the troop that I brought my oldest to the pack to visit first. But the change in SMs has taken its toll on the troop. Scouts are leaving left and right. They go on few camp outs, and mostly merit badge weekends at camp. Their meetings are MB classes or basketball in the gym. It seems ad if the new leadership is only concerned with boys getting Eagle. It seems as if they view anything non-Eagle related as a waste of time. Scouting for Food was suppose to be a joint venture with the pack, and they didn't participate. They have not invited Webelos to camp with them in 2 years, and have not invited them to visit in a year. We've asked for Den Chiefs, and only got them when another troop said they would give us some. Then the ones we got were as bad, if not worse, than the Cubs. One DL told one DC not to come back. It is a very frustrating situation for me, one that I admit I need to let go of. But it is very hard to see something you put effort into fall apart.

You got all kinds of advice from us, but what does your son want? If your son wants to stick it out, and fight to keep the troop alive, then by all means go for it. Is it hard? yep. Is it worth it? Maybe. If your son wants to move, then do it. I was in a similar situation in. Son made the decision, and I've been happy ever since.

2Cub, If they were camping, and stated they were not coming to camporee, I would not have a problem. But this is the troop that said they were coming, picked events to run, and then decided not to attend without letting anyone running the event know that they were not coming and to find someone else to run their event. They also have cancelled one camp out, which was council camporee, less than 24 hours before it started. The 2 folks who transferred into my troop both cited the lack of camping as one of reasons for leaving. Now in regards to training, I agree with you. I even made a comment similar to yours. But the guy running it said that is how the book wrote the rule. 4 out of 4 did pass the challenge.

In regards to uniforms and service projects, don't get me wrong as I am pro uniform. BUT some service projects the uniform is not appropriate wear. Best example I can give was the reforestation project one of my friends did. It was in a swamp.

As Qwazse said, have your troop's leaders pick his brain.

I am so sorry for the loss.

This has happened to us, and we've done it to others. We've lost Scouts to a nearby troop for several reasons: friends in the troop, they are more active, and they meet on a better night for the scouts in question. We have also gained Scouts fo similar reasons, we are more active than their current troop, they have friends in the troop, etc. My troop leadership's stance is that we don't care where they go as long as they are happy. Our concern is when they drop out of Scouting altogether.

SP, I hate to say it, but we have done that. The SM, before he became SM, was invited to be on the district advancement committee. Attended only one meeting, and never showed up again. Explanation was he got promoted at work, and no longer had the time. Asked others and they said they don't have the time or want the job. It's almost as if all they focus on is getting their sons to Eagle.