MattR

Ironic that the socially conservative regions are leading in girls coming in while they're also leading with boys going out?

This is either just a bit of levity or a real paradox. Please pick the one that makes your day better.

No facts were harmed in this presentation. Only stunt facts were used and they are well cared for under the auspices of PETF (people for the ethical treatment of facts).

Welcome to the forum, @wallacesusan.

It took 4 months to schedule a smc? That's a problem. Well, that's the problem.

Should he back date it? I guess. Should you demand that? No, because the real issue is that the SM didn't see a need to fix a problem. Has your son talked to him about the time delay? Is there a reason given for the delay? Anyway, getting on the bad side of the SM is not suggested.

Welcome to the forum, @DJsMommy.

The charter org EIN number is the correct number to give them because legally your pack is part of the charter org. The pack has no articles of association. That's why the pack charters with the charter org. You may need to give the bank a copy of the charter that the pack had the charter org sign at the last recharter. Most likely that was last December. You'll get a new one when you recharter this December (not everyone recharters in December but most do). If nobody on your committee can find the old one then either wait till you get the next one or call the local council office, ask for your District Executive, and they should be able to help you out.

One other point, since you belong to the CO they might want to know about your bank account (they are legally responsible for what you do). Different scout units handle this differently. For my troop and CO they trust us and we just keep to ourselves. Some CO's want to have access to unit finances.

Hope all that helps!

Welcome to the forum, @roberthynesii

1 hour ago, BobWhiteVA said:

(various attempts to start a "high adventure patrol" have fizzled as they just went with the normal Troop program, and while older Scouts do mostly attend meetings, they don't really do much)

I think this is the real issue, only because I've been there before. They just went with the normal program and older scouts don't really do much strongly suggests to me that starting a crew won't solve the problem. The scouts of a crew should be able to lead the crew by themselves but it appears that these scouts can't. Otherwise they wouldn't have gone with the normal program and they would be helping out at meetings. So, one solution is to develop leadership in this age group. This might require the adults to learn some new things as well.

I think it's the start of a great project. However, I don't know the details. When we see a project that seems light on leadership (when someone says routine labor) we start asking for details. We also encourage the scout to go back to the recipient of the project and ask for more. Not just more work but how to make it better. In the case of the lego kits, let's say two kids are playing with their kit right next to each other. The kits will get all mixed up. What's a solution to that problem? Also, he has the instructions, but does he have electronic versions for when they get destroyed? Are the instruction appropriate for all of the children at this facility? For example, kids that are dyslexic would likely appreciate instructions in a bigger format. Are the kits in their original boxes, which will get destroyed, or will they be in small tubs? Where will the tubs be stored and how will the children know what they're building?

Any project can be made more complex by just scaling it up. 50 kits is nice, but go through your neighborhood and do a lego drive. You'll have 500 kits. Now what? Do this for 500 kits and you have a major project that is really cool.

The bottom line here is talk to someone that works with these children to figure out how to make this work for them.

I am surprised that the troop was one gate keeper on ideas. Scouts in my troop present to the committee and the committee helps dig in to understand, all with the goal of helping the scout come up with a good project. There is a lot of changing minds going on as we dig deeper.

28 minutes ago, ASMmom1976 said:

theres no doubt in my mind that my son who has ADHD and PTSD did not communicate all the talking points very well.  He sensed disapproval and negativity and got discouraged.

And he likely gave up, clammed up, and that was it. I'd suggest finding an adult that can coach him through this. These are the guys that usually get the mentor's pins.

9 hours ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

This weekend, they ignored the SM and caused so much trouble that the SM was close to cutting off his patch and giving it to them.

I'm confused. Why doesn't the SM just put a stop to it and tell these people they're no longer invited?

@Vanhall21, welcome.

1 hour ago, Vanhall21 said:

The den leader and his wife became leaders about a year before we started and they have taken over the den

Do you by any chance mean the cub master and/or committee chair? Or the previous den leader and his wife became cub master and committee chair? The term den leader doesn't make sense in this context. If these people are not the cub master/committee chair then that's who you should talk to about these people being a problem. If these people are the cub master and committee chair then that's a much messier situation. If you could clarify that would help us understand.

BTW, your husband is great for taking on being a den leader.

@Momleader, I suspect you can safely ignore this. Here's another DE story just to amuse you. I'm the district camping chair. We made reservations for our winter campout and have, since the 70's, always looked for the coldest, snowiest place we could find. Yesterday our DE said our reservation was cancelled and we had to do it at the council camp, where it has never been. I made a few phone calls today. Turns out the council is broke, has not paid last year's bill, and is just trying to stiff these people, the neighboring council. We're going to ignore the DE and have all troops write checks to a 3rd party that we can trust to make the payments. There are several companies that won't do business with our council anymore.  If anyone in the council complains we'll open up the books, so to speak. 

As I said, just ignore them. You're providing a great program for your pack. Keep up the good work. 

I think the fitness standard should be for one to do their best. And the only way to do that is to do something one enjoys.

For some reason I do not like anything with reps. I would much rather go for a bike ride or a hike. For those that like doing reps, I'm jealous.

8 minutes ago, qwazse said:

Welcome to the forums!

Thank you, @qwazse. Actually, I've been lurking for some time and just decided to help out.

10 hours ago, TEP said:

My son was not able to complete his Swimming Merit Badge at summer camp.

Are there any recommendations on how to get Swimming merit badge outside of a summer camp?

 

@TEP, welcome to the forum.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned is that your son should have or get what's called a blue card (and it's blue!) that has a record of what your son did complete at summer camp. When he gives that to the next counselor that counselor will continue marking requirements as done. He should have received one from summer camp but many camps don't fill these out. In that case he'll need to go to his scoutmaster to get it. And while he's there he can ask about finding the next counselor.

The intent of the merit badges is that the scout does the bulk of finding and contacting the counselors. The best thing you can do is help him learn the process and encourage him to do it. And making phone calls to someone a scout doesn't know is really hard, but a great skill for them to learn.

Good luck!

That always sucks when you can't go out happy. However, it's much better to go out discouraged rather than burning bridges and absolutely angry. Enjoy the break. You'll find other things to help with.

8 minutes ago, qwazse said:

"I have my keys here. (To drive the wayward scout home that hour, if desired.)" 

I've used that exact same phrase. I've even told my SPL it was his decision on whether I drove a scout home. Nobody took me up on it but everyone knew who made the decisions after that. But when I was a new SM I wouldn't have done that. It took some time to be comfortable being the disciplinarian. This is a hard situation to deal with and a rude one for a new SM. I understand what you're saying, asking about where this problem came from, but for a new SM I can also see it being read wrong.

Unfortunately, I've also noticed that setting the bar to some scouts has the added caveat "when adults are around." There's a certain Machiavellian mindset for some scouts that the scout oath and law just doesn't penetrate. When someone is teasing a kid to the point of crying then that's a red flag. One scout told me that an older scout told him that swearing was okay when adults weren't around. In another thread I mentioned the scouts that had to be disqualified for cheating at the camporee. Two of them have been a thorn since they joined the troop (and one of them was the source of the adult dependent swearing). I'd like to believe that the adults and I kept them in check but I suspect it's just a game for them. None of the other older scouts have anything to do with them and what that usually means is these other scouts have enough confidence in their own character that it's just simpler to stay away.

But back to this situation. My assumption is that the SPL is the real problem and the rest of the PLC are watching and learning. There might be another one or two that provide an echo. I don't know the history of the SPL. It could be he saw someone at school do this and he's just trying it out or he's been a turd in the troop for a long time and he plays by his own rules.

Another question I'd ask is how often do scouts deal with behavior problems? That has always been a problem in my troop. Nobody wants to rock the boat and there's no doubt that's the source of the "only when the adults are around" caveat. I would really like to know how to develop that. Given the peer pressure these scouts are suffering at this age I don't know how to encourage the scouts to stand up to problems like this.

3 hours ago, qwazse said:

I'm sorry, it could be I misread. Were you not ASM for two years? And did you not see bullying incidents at that time? How did you handle them? Might your PLC be falling in line with the SPL because they were imitating the adults they knew?

It seems to me you're making some assumptions. It could also be that this is a first incident of this magnitude. The PLC is just 12-13 years old. It could be that the previous SM was the only one that would be the disciplinarian. It certainly was when I was SM. Nobody else wanted to be the bad guy. So when I left guess what happened. "The new guy won't mind."

Welcome to the forum @Bside. Sorry it has to be under such circumstances.

I would not have the SPL talk in front of the troop. In fact, I'm not sure I'd start with a list of punishments. The real issue is whether the scouts understand they did something (many things) wrong and not just that they got caught. For any scout that just thinks he got caught I'd fire him. But I would give him a chance to figure that out.

I'd start with sitting down with all the scouts that were there except for the one scout that took the brunt of the bad character. I'd start by reviewing exactly what happened in as much detail as possible. They'd likely really feel the pain as an adult asked them why a scout rubbed his crotch on the boy's neck. Once that was all out we'd talk about each point of the scout law and ask them how what they did represents that. Then I'd ask them if they think they need to make things right. If, and I really would hope this doesn't happen, they said it was all in good fun, I'd fire the lot of them. If, however, they show some remorse, I'd ask them how they're going to make it right. Then I'd keep my mouth shut and listen. Maybe I'd encourage them to think more and talk about it. Anyway, let them come up with a plan. If you think it's a bit light then sure, add some time or whatever. It would be great if they volunteer to talk to the rest of the troop but I wouldn't make them. Public punishment is frowned on and your making them do that is really nothing more than punishment.  @Jameson76's idea is also an option.

The fact that these scouts think they're above it all is a red flag to me. One other thing to think about is that some of the scouts were likely just following along. As guilty as they are for not standing up to the SPL, they might see what they did as wrong.

I grew up with an external frame pack. Bought an internal when they first came out. Bought a second one  years later. Finally went back to an external pack. I like the external packs better. The internal frame packs are mostly a duffel bag with nice straps. The result, looking down, is a round cross section. An external pack is more rectangular. On the whole the center of mass is closer to my back and much less tiresome to carry all day. They're also easier to pack. There are more pockets so everything has it's place. A bear canister they can take up the entire inside of an internal pack. I can lash it to my frame, under the pack.

I'm not saying they're perfect but I wish there were more companies making them. They are cheaper than internal packs. I also think both styles are starting to merge. As the frames get a bit more sturdy on the internals then some of the issues I have with them might go away. A carbon fiber frame that was built for my back would be the ticket.

I have a shirt with no position patch. If people have to look at my uniform to see what I do then they can just as easily ask me. Usually I'm right there.

I took WB. It was neither great nor a complete waste. More like a disappointment after all the hype. In hindsight I'd say WB is about how to implement a vision. If you know where you want to be then WB provides tools to get there. That's fine but it's not really specific to scouting. Plenty of people have said they've seen this material elsewhere.

The two weekend training I'd rather see is the vision of running a pack, troop, or crew, and how to solve the typical problems you run into.

If the trainers were seeing how their training was helping units then they'd be much less likely to see WB as the goal. Training should never be a goal, the goal should be people that successfully use the training. If WB was much better than anything else then there would be feedback on how units were doing better.

JTE is supposed to be that feedback. Originally the metrics used in JTE were going to get harder as units got better. I haven't really seen that so I assume that units are not generally getting better. The bottom line is good units are figuring it out on their own.

Nope. It's my understanding that expiration doesn't mean unhealthy for anything the food bank will accept.

Welcome to the forum, @danw.

12 hours ago, packsaddle said:

SSScout, I'm curious about that Hebrew National hot dog commercial. Is it online anywhere?

Google "Hebrew National hot dog commercial" The punch line is "We answer to a higher authority" than the FDA

I'm a push mower parent. Not nearly as loud or obnoxious as a lawnmower parent and I can also cut the lawn at 7am on a Sunday and not bother the neighbors.

@scotteg83, you have an opportunity to start fresh and not fight old baggage and old/wrong perceptions. This has nothing to do with girls. So first of all, this could be a lot of fun. I think the challenge is coming up with a small, tight, easily understood list of guidelines that everyone, scouts and adults, will respect. That will make the communication and training of all these new scouts and adults much simpler. Ideas these guidelines might cover, in no particular order:

The separation of what the adults and scouts are responsible for. What the adults should and should not do. Same for scouts.

How problems are solved.

The process for defining/changing the calendar. Types and rough amounts of events? Challenging, fun, silly, advancement, service, fundraising ...

The process for handling failure, both for the adults and scouts. (and what failure is, how to identify, review in general)

The aim of scouting, in much clearer words than the BSA's (it better include fun)

How you handle the situation where adults want to step in and scouts want to step back.

How you handle the situation where the older scouts just don't want to do anything challenging.