John-in-KC

gwd, It's for the same reason the Venturing pants and shorts are too D%%% expensive: Supply Corporation thinks it can make it so. I know a Crew which chose neutral SmartWool socks as the crew sock for Classes A and B uniforms. I know another Crew which went to Cabelas and bought their grey shorts and cargo pants. From my experience, the SE seems to have (in practice, if not in policy) discretion on uniforms for camp staffers.

Toughest at the moment: Friendly. Just plain hard when the work cycle is 12 on, 12 off for a couple of weeks at a stretch. Toughest to explain: Courteous. There are days I think "please" is almost a lost word. More important? None. Absolutely co-equal. When you value any one over the others, you impose a risk of going too far. Some of the current difficulties in DC I attribute to taking Loyalty to an extreme, as an example. Ethics can be a two edged sword.

Price of gas has hit me as well. I'm a year away from sending the Eagle to college. Even in-state is $16K a year total package. It may also be that Gens X-Y-Z aren't as willing to give of time energy and effort for the sake of their kids as even we Boomers were... and we had shortfalls relative to our parents.

BTW, on the BSA "Scouting Terms and Style Guide" of the National website, there is no mention of the term "Sea Scouting Lifeguard."

OK, let's review the bidding: Second Class: Swimming requirements. First Class: Swimming requirements. S/L/E: Swimming MB as one of 3 in the Physical Activities Group. S/L/E: Lifesaving MB (Swimming MB a pre-req) in the Emergency Response Group. BSA Lifeguard: A program for youth and adults, ages 14 and above, to meet the mandates of G2SS, Section II, Aquatics, Requirement 1. From the technical definitions at the BSA Website, the BSA Lifeguard is: A three-year training designation awarded to Boy Scouts, Venturers, and adults who meet prescribed requirements in aquatics skills, Safe Swim Defense, Safety Afloat, first aid, and emergency action. See "BSA Aquatics Instructor." The curriculum for BSA Lifeguard is 34536A. HTH. John Once a BSA lifeguard, now out of currency.

THANKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 :) Wish they had an icon for the Happy Dance! YIS

Kevin, THAT'S MY POINT. THE BOY SCOUT RT GUIDE HAS THE SAME EDITORIAL AND PRODUCTION ISSUES AS THE CUB SCOUT GUIDE. So why is the Boy Scout RT Guide a bin item, and Supply Corporation charges for the Cub Scout RT Guide? Hmmmmmm???

Seems to me about $300 of that Philmont fee is actually time in Albuquerque...

SWS, I agree with you in point of fact. As I said elsewhere, for me, this is something not worth time, effort or resources to pursue. If Dluders wants to, that's his call... but I also know folks who own "rice bowls," and many of them would rather have the dissident in th house... where he can be watched closely.

Beavah, There are things worth my time, energy, resources and effort to help change. There are other things which are not worth my ... to change. I think my Council's imposed MB Counselor limit of 6MBs per Counselor is not worth changing. I think my Council's interfaces between the OA Lodge and its internal Honor Camping Society may well be worth changing. There will come a time when I expect to have the resources to attempt to influence that change. I do not think having concurrent membership between the Cubbing Program and the Boy Program is worth my time and resources to change. I do think, formally asking the question of the Cub Scout Division and the Boy Scout Division might be worth the effort. To those who would ask the question, I caution: Sometimes, questions are best left unasked. Let sleeping dogs lie.

This has now been said and cited several times before in this thread: The National Council Advancement Literatures says nothing about a limit on the number of merit badges a Counselor may choose to support. In fact, it says there is no limit, as ajmako pointed out. GIVEN THAT, Dluder's Council has chosen to override this limit. The only advice I can offer Dluders if he chooses to take on the task of changing this in his Council is this: Be prepared to surrender your Scoutmastership to serve on the District Advancement Committee or the Council Advancement Committee. From the Scoutmaster's Handbook, we understand being a Scoutmaster is time intensive. In fact, it's so time intensive it should be the only Scouting job held during the tenure! I suspect Dluder's will be invited to join one of the Advancement Committees. I suspect it will be on a "put your money where your mouth is" basis. I wish him well. As for me, I think I can live within my Council's imposed limit of six MBs per Counselor.

OK, now I'm getting a different signal, and a different request for information. Let's look for a moment at a BSA Fact Sheet. It's Bin Item 02-501F, and was last printed in 2006: "Boy Scouting. A year-round program for boys 11 through 17 designed to achieve the aims of Scouting through a vigorous outdoor program and peer group leadership with the counsel of an adult Scoutmaster. (Boys also may become Boy Scouts if they have earned the Cub Scouting Arrow of Light Award and are at least 10 years old or have completed the fifth grade and are at least 10 years old.)" The following is my opinion: Once a boy migrates from Cubs to Boys, his Cub advancement is DONE. He should work on the Boy Scouting advancement system, using the eight methods of Scouting. I suspect someone else here can back up my opinion with BSA policy. That said, my then-bride and I held our son back a year at Kindergarten. We wanted the added maturity and socialization it would bring. This appears to be an increasingly common choice. Son joined Cubbing at an age and grade appropriate level, and stayed with his class group up the line. He earned his Arrow of Light on time, and has since continued through Boy Scouting into Venturing. He's done quite well for himself: He will staff his second season at one of our Council camps, earned his Eagle with multiple palms, gone to Philmont, in short, had FUN. There is nothing that says you have to follow the dictum to get to AOL. I will say that AOL is one of the few awards a youth carries into his life as a Scouter. If he's ready to move up, get him engaged on finishing up Webelos badge, get the AOL, and move him across. BTW, offer that opportunity to other Cubs near his age. Nothing in the world says "February or else", or "school year end or else." Back in the day, I turned 11 in October and joined my Troop in January. That was 1967/8

Is there a central place in your district where young people from several high schools are pretty much equadistant? Unless you have BIG high schools, I'm not sure you'll get a crew from one pool of kids. You're the DC. Send out an interest survey to the HSs. Find out if there are youth interested in cycling. If there are, maybe the secret is not the competitive events (use those as superactivities), but the basic road workouts all cyclists need to have great lower and upper body strength. Cardiovascular and strength conditioning is common to all cycling, as is field maintenance and repair. I think you've got a good idea, but step back and look at it from a 100,000 foot view.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

This is where you make contact with one of several people. The first person you should contact would be your Unit Commissioner. One of the reasons he/she volunteers in Scouting is to help units, including rumor control. If he/she and the Commissioner Service cannot help, the District Membership Chairman should be another resource. It's his job to manage the overall recruitment campaign in the district, so he/she should know the rules. The third person is your friendly DE. He should know what changes the Professional Service is pushing down from the Council office. As for this particular rumor, it sounds just like a ... rumor. While there can be concurrent enrollment in Boy Scouting and Venturing for young men, they are members of two distinct units under two charters.

Beavah, We did that... They're called the Combatant Commanders... You do not know how many doctrinal manuals for the Services have pub numbers for all 4 on the cover anymore. I've served in AF HQ that had more Marine, Navy, and Army folk than actual zoomies. The military mantra these days is operate in a COMBINED (internationally) JOINT (inter-DOD) INTERAGENCY (inter-USG) INTERGOVERNMENTAL (across national and provincial/state lines) MODEL. John

TheScout, At the time of writing, yes, you are correct, the Constitution sanctioned slavery. That detail was fixed by the 13th Amendment: Amendment XIII Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction. Section 2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation. Since your post, by omitting this, implied the original articles were still in force, I am compelled to point out the error.

Stosh, Unless you are busting personal integrity of yourself and your Crew Members, there is no way a 12 year old can be a Venturer. The threshold for joining is 14 with 8th grade complete!

Eamonn, Remember: Advancement isn't a method in Venturing. Recognition is, and recognition can come from in-unit as well as external factors. Right now my son is far more excited about: - Putting together a couple of skits for the staff to use at Scout Camp this summer... - Getting his HS letter in band - Going with his stepdad to barbershop regional competition ... than he could ever be about the Venturing Bronze level. Take a moment, and see what the youth like to do. You may find instead of Ranger, there's a greater need for the Quest award or the athletics Bronze... YIS/YIV John

Have you asked your PLC to get on the internet and do some research? Things I've seen my PLC do: Have a "campfire" COH, where all was formal, but done at a fire ring. Opening was led by members of the Tribal Council in the Tribe of Mic-o-Say. Ask respected elder Scouters to visit and talk with the Scouts... When a Scout earned his religous award and purple square knot, invite an Eagle Scout elder for the candidate's church to present the award. Waaay back when, we had a potluck dinner COH. Ask your PLC for ideas, then help your SPL take those to the Committee. After all, the Committee is functionally charged with making COH's happen.

E, Just to make sure all understand: I agree that every Scout should do Jamboree, NOAC, or Philmont (or a combination) during his Scouting career. I'm just questioning SSSCout's comment, based on what happened in our neck of the woods. I cannot speak to the cost differential other than we are a full days + ride away from VA.

Every Scout and Scouter should read this. If it's not a bear, it'll be a skunk or a possum. True Story: One of our now-Eagles, who was a 3d year Star Scout at LT camp, had a snack before bed and didn't clean his face. About 2AM, he had some friends on top of his chest. Fortunately, this young man is an outdoorsman to begin with, and he was actually smiling while it happened. Sheesh.

I spun this off from the Jamboree thread in Issues and Politics... SSScout wrote in part: "The Scout Participants are selected by a competitive method. Not everybody who applies can attend." HUH? We had problems filling our last Council contingent of Scouts for Jamboree. $1500 per kid is not an easy number for any Scout or parent to swallow. Scouting competes with a host of other activities for the time and funds of the young man and his family. Expecting a Scout to earn his way to Scout Camp is one thing. Making the Jambo fees is another. I'd be interested in hearing what other Councils charge their contingents.

I've spun off a separate thread http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=155917 Cost of Jamboree Attendance instead of hijacking this one...(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

There is only one way for a unit to stop using MB mills: It has to stop using all of them. Otherwise, the SM and CC will be exposing themselves to a rightful charge of hypocrisy: - Going to the US Strategic Air Museum on I-80 in Omaha and staying there overnight gets you Aviation MB. - Going to the USS New Jersey (Scouting Magazine, Jan/Feb 07, p 37)... they advertise new Scout MB programs. - Going to Patriots Point (USS Yorktown), on their website advertises Aviation and Oceanography MBs. Google on museum scout "merit badge" programs... there are 34,600 hits. (American Textile History Museum - Scout Services, Houston Gulf Coast Railroad Museum, Wisconsin Maritime Museum Overnight Program). Only one activity on the first page of the hit list (Children's Museum of West Hartford, CT) indicated they would not do the sign-offs for their Scout overnight programs. I'm not saying a unit cannot go to these opportunities, but I am saying you will have to sell your PLCs to reject the MB offers. To my way of thinking, the SM and the Committee are then obligated to locate a local MB Counselor who will make him/herself available to leverage the opportunity. Of course, whether the boys take up the cudgel of getting their blue card and doing the MB with the Counselor is their responsibility. Further, the SM and CC need to front-end educate their parents, because I guarantee you Troop XXX across town is still going to do this. (Gee, this sounds like gwd-scouters problem in the Webelo III thread). Of course, this also means the SM and CC need to have a hard think about where and why the Troop is going to Scout Camp. In my Council, at our 10 day operation, Scouts have the potential to earn up to 8 MBs a year. All this can be done, but the CC and SM need a buy-in from the IH down to the PLC. If we really believe that our Troops are Boy-Led, then the PLC is the body who have to want to stop using the mills to get quickie advancement.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

Mr JBlake47, May I recommend that during your tenure as President, you ask your 1st VP to serve as the Executive Officer vice yourself? If there is a conflict in scheduling of facilities, or a conflict of policy, you are then free to fully advocate the Scouting position. If you choose your current path, the downside risk for you is either your charges in the unit or your members in your CO can decide you were favoring the other organization. Additionally, we keep saying this over and over: The position of Program Officer (CM, SM, ADV) has such important relationship to the growth and development of the youth that the incumbent shouldn't have another Scouting position! YIS