fred8033

"In the field" ??? ... Most troops I know camp "mostly" at scout camps, state parks or something similar. Camps filled with support if truely needed. I'd agree that backwoods activities require a different level of support ... potentially. But even then, I've seen eight scouts and three adults do a long hiking trip multiple time. It really depends on the situation. I've camped with 30+ scouts multiple times with just one or two other leaders. It's not tha big of a deal. Yeah, two does feel thin at times. Having one or two extra is fine and nice so that you can play Hearts or able to p

Five years ago, we did a high adventure. Two adults. Eighteen scouts. The high adventure camp staff treated our troop like all stars for letting the scouts enjoy their own trip and minimizing the adults. ' I'd encourage every troop to consciously work to minimize the adults on the camp outs. It is a youth program.

Scout camps have a ranger on-site with a house usually within a mile and other troops are near by. Most state parks have 911 coverage, other campers and county sheriffs respond quickly. If you have scouts with special challenges, the situation changes. And then I'd really ask the question ... are you comfortable taking responsibility for that specific scout? At that point, I'm not sure any number of adults will help ... unless you require the parent to attend. In my 15 years of troop camping, we've camped with 30+ scouts and two adults about five or six times. It worked great.

Insane? Legal liability? We empower scouts with stoves, axes, knives, rifles, etc. We take them out into the wilderness (usually a state park or scout camp) with weather, animals, etc. If you want to avoid liability, don't volunteer anywhere. We do have G2SS to explicitly follow and parents sign waivers for each campout. Beyond that, I'm not sure having extra adults would really help with liability. Would it prevent incidents? Probably not. Would it help when incidents happen? Maybe. That's why 3 or 4 adults can be nice, but it's just not that critical.

Yeah, that's pretty normal. Though I support the BOR rule, I find hypocracy in the requirement that BOR can't have SM or ASMs. Often committee members interact with the scouts more than ASMs (who can't be on BORs). That seems wrong and breaks the idea that you want someone separate to judge program quality. "Ideally", scouts work with scouts. SM is the liason to the adults. ASMs support the SM. The SM/ASM side interacts with the scouts. ... committee members don't. I've seen way too many troops where ASM seems like an entry level spot that will eventually step up to a functi

This is not a live or die issue. Scouters can be flexible on this. BSA does clearly intend the Advancement Chair is a member of the committee. BSA then again, BSA also clearly intends the SM is the person who interacts with the scouts. ASMs support the SM. ... aka ... committee members don't work with the scouts. Yet, I continually see the committee members interacting with youth and pretending to be SM/ASMs. Perhaps, committee members should not camp with youth. Not attend troop meetings or PLCs. Not make announcements to scouts. Seriously, this would be good. It's the SM with h

Such weeks bring smiles for months / years.

I am strongly leaning in the same direction. This may be my opporunity to find somewhere else to spend my time. I was hoping to do far more than 20 years as a volunteer, but this September is 20 years since I brought my first son to his first meeting and bought him his orange Tiger t-shirt and hat. Perhaps, it's time to move on. I was glad to see many of the recent membership policy changes. But it has been 20 years of issues starting first with 1999 Dale vs BSA. Now yet another self-inflicted issue ... and this one very political.

The issue was the statement on facts. There are many "facts" out there. The question is which facts do you choose to emphasize and which do you ignore.

Value statements such as the above are usually not political. The daily application can be political. How it's taught especially now is usually very political ... especially now.

Very well said and I understand. It's why I'd like to see a separate adult leader requirements guide. Let's put the intent and legalese details in that document. I just want writing the scouts will really read.

I do agree with Barry on this. I'd like to see at minimum half the MBs for rank be electives. Let the scout explore and choose their path. Isn't that a key part of scouting? Further, I've never liked the huge overlap between MBs and rank. This is true with cooking, physical fitness, camping, first aid, communication. I'd rather see "rank" be about the core of being a scout. MBs be about the scout choosing to explore the world. "REQUIRING" MBs seems like a contradiction. Maybe some required as they don't fit in "RANK", but let's reduce the huge overlap. Just to repeat my

Proably best for me to back out of this discussion. My views and frustrations with this badge are well known. I just don't want to promote the badge. I agreed to get my sons into scouting to learn camping, outdoor activities and some amount of self-reliance. Glad it was a chance to build friendships. I was 100% ok with the citizenship and patriotism. Religious parts were fine and I'm glad they were there, but it was not a driving part. This badge crosses the line into politics. It's not for me or my time.

Not a activity or basic learning. Camping and cooking are explicit core activities our scouts do continually. Exposing political views is not an activity or part of the core program. Further, D,E&I focuses on teaching views. Should we make the Scout Oath and Law a merit badge?

Agreed. Eagle is just not that important. Our scouts benefit from hiking, camping, service projects, etc. As much as I've helped a huge number of scouts earn Eagle, ... it's just not that important. I've wanted my sons to get Eagle not because it's a huge achievement or they will grow from it that much. I've wanted them to earn it because then they are stuck for the rest of their lives living up to that image of an Eagle scout.

So, thru work I've taken 30 years worth of annual training on non-discrimination. As part of interviewing and hiring, I've had to take additional training. Can I use all that 30 years worth of training and experience to be vetted? Or is it something more. ... sounds like vetting will be a form of discrimnation.

It's easy to be anti-trump. I'd say the guy is a putz, but that would be too generous. America is pro-inclusion from the heart of the Constitution. Absolutely agreed that we need to listen to all sides. My experience though is that these are such heated discussions that we can't openly discuss without breaking relationships. Isn't it the old adage to never discuss religion or politics at the dinner table? But we think it's the safe place in scouting to do that? Reverse discrimination. Identity politics. Failure of the drug war. Breakdown of the nuclear family

Well said .... I'd upvote your post, but I fear the last statement. Exactly how it should be. Keep leader politics out of scouting. Exactly how it should be. Activities over sit-down meetinsg or power-point merit badges. IMHO, there is little place in scouting for power-point and lectures. ... Perhaps we should adopt a rule from my work about daily status meetings. Applied to scouting, all scouting lectures / teaching should be done with everyone STANDING, huddled together. It encourages lecutres to be five minutes or less so that scouts can get back to being activ

Maybe not pencil whip, but they will add their views, opinions and twists on it. If I look at the mix of scout leaders that I know, they help all and are very equal minded people. BUT, they are old-fashioned and take more direct action. The more I think about this, perhaps BSA and I are headed in different directions. I'm 100% supportive of teaching scouts by example; using Scout Oath and Law as fundamental principles. Scouts learn a huge amount by having to sleep in a tent they setup and having to cook and clean their own meals. Outside activities are a great teaching mechanism. I'

Why would this badge have a different MBC vetting process? I really, really hope this is not an issue.

I just read and watched the YouTube video. Extremely well produced. Comments seemed to reflect real concern. It's interesting as the video mentioned fosturing open discussion. As a professional ... and because of my gender and race ... to protect my career and future ... the last thing I can do is participate in an open discussion on this topic. It's best for me to quietly listen. Any response or comment can quickly get out of control.

The scout should download the Eagle Project Workbook from scouting.org. Learn to save it to the computer, close the web browser and then open it. Get used to working with the workbook. READ IT COVER TO COVER. The Parent should also download the Eagle Project Workbook and read it cover to cover. The workbook as messages specifically written both for the scout and the parent. https://www.scouting.org/programs/scouts-bsa/advancement-and-awards/eagle-scout-workbook/ As for the best way to choose the project, it happens many different ways. The key is to keep the scout

Over the last week, I talked to a few scouts about it. I heard the same thin you said above. Those close to Eagle want to finish before the badge is required. Those further away treat it as another hoop to jump thru. Those already Eagle view it as a reflection of the time. None of them are thrilled at it, but see it as scouting reflecting the times and jumping on the bandwagon everyone else is jumping on. It's probably my big probem with the badge. The scout's aren't asking for it and they are already getting it elsewhere.

Agreed ... Today's generation is much less native and has seen way more. Old fashioned ceremonies do look hooky in today's eyes.

I agree. Historical art connects us with the past, good or bad. That's art. It triggers thoughts and feelings. Yes, some art and names do need to come down as there is little value and it's mostly inciteful. But then again, some should stay to trigger conversation and reflection. When I was a kid, I attended a summer camp that taught the German language and culture. Ladderhosen. Drinking songs. etc, etc. "Historically", it was not that long after 75 million died in WW2 and 20 million in WW1. Those camps still exist and are still attended. I'm surprised people don't complain ab