fred johnson

I understand what you are saying, but it's not about poor messaging or creating a program that won't be followed. The "linked troop" concept was created to dance a fine line alientating as few as possible. This "linked troop" concept is transitional and will fade out over the next 5 to 20 years, after the contention and stress over this huge change has gone away.

Fully agree. Well said.

Agreed. Not a huge thing. I thought I heard about 5th grade girls signing up for pack that are early adopters. Not sure what happened there.

Theoretically, a 4th grade girl could join a pack that is an early adopter right now. Then during the summer earn Arrow of Light and then be ready to cross over this fall, up to four months earlier than Feb 2019.

Interesting ... I'd still like to learn more about dates. I heard when cub scouts was rolled out there was nothing preventing 4th and 5th grade girls from joining cub scouts. As such, they need a troop to cross over before the deadline.

When is the election? You said you have a little over a month. Is that to the election or to an earlier date? IMHO, a voter guide is useful when it is weeks or a month or more before the election. As such, I would not want to use the election as the due date. IMHO, it should be weeks before as as due date. If I was approving your project, I'd be looking at Will you be successful? Will you have a good experience? Will you meet the expectations to "develop, plan and lead" a project? View your proposal as an agreement. Only put in as much as you need to clearly

If he did the work, yes. The requirements for Eagle are really not that huge. A gung-ho kid can knock them out if desired fairly quick. The key is we mentor youth through our interactions and guidance. But as for rank, that is a standard defined by BSA that is fairly clear. If the scout has done the project as approved in the proposal, it gets signed. If he has the other rank items complete, then can has earned a right to complete his Eagle rank. It might be worth a good discussion on what happened. Beyond that, it's his advancement, not ours.

Yes. As much as anyone else. You might not like his path, but yes he is and he has every right to use the rank name.

I'd be tempted to approach it from the other side. I'd tell him that Eagle means a lot to people because it means a lot to people. If you are chasing Eagle to fill out an application, then it probably doesn't mean much to you as an accomplishment in and of itself. I'd suggest to him to chase accomplishments that mean something to him. If this one doesn't, then he will be wasting his time and energy to earn something that is an empty accomplishment.

This is a totally different discussion that can go on a long long time. ... I think people should be able to choose, but I don't think parents and scouts know what to look for when shopping. From what I've seen there is a dynamic between what is a good troop and what looks good. Also, there is an issue of cities with many troops and a few grow to be mega troops and the others starve and look like pale images. It's unhealthy for a troop to be really large and to be starving for members. IMHO, the current troop shopping model does NOT work. ... but a different thread.

So so true. This is the same for why I cringe with certain phrases such as boy led. It's almost always not constructive and used more as a knock against others. IMHO, we should all stop saying who's boy led and who's not boy led. Be specific and identify behaviors and habits that help. Identify good practices.

I hate the term "boy led" because it's too often used as an absolute "We're Boy Led !!" and quickly followed with a slight or knock against other troops or other leaders. Using the term "Boy Led" seems to lower scouter debates to almost a base level at times. IMHO, this happens so much that I'd almost like to see the term gone. I love the term "boy led" because it's an idea, great for training and creating a quick image. But keep it to training and as an ideal It's an end-goal that is not achievable, but that we should continually strive for as mentors to our youth. It's in working

Great article. I've seen another recently that I thought was timely and good. https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/21/opinion/boys-violence-shootings-guns.html I think scouts is the perfect environment to address many of the challenges our scouts face. BSA is going co-ed, but that does not mean we have to dumb down or emasculate the program. IMHO, keep the challenge and keep the out door focus. Use that to define character through each individual's own crucible.

Older scouts have a great opportunity to make their own fun and create their own program. I like Qwazse's ideas. But in addition ... When the camp offer's a challenge ... like create a camp fire skit ... or troop to earn the most points ... XXXX ... go whole hog on it. In focusing on the best skit or most points or ... you will be creating a great experience for yourself and others. ... BUT DO IT WITH FUN AND A SMILE ON YOUR FACE !!!! And if you don't win, who cares. It was doing the stuff and obsessing on how to win that you create fun for each other. Take a nap. It's a

I fully agree. Drop any of the describe and discuss stuff. The passive requirements add the "boring" and introduce advancement abuse. Plus, they were bored to tears when it was lecture, etc. The discuss and describe should happen naturally while the MBC works with or talks with the scout about how the omelet was cooked or why the soup needed chicken bullion stock. My sons enjoyed, learned from and wanted to do more. They enjoyed the "active" merit badges. Canoe trips. Camping. Photographing. Wood working. Golfing. IMHO, boys (and girls) scream to do things. To get

Well done MBs and advancement is very meaningful to the scouts. The challenge is every scout is not interested in every MB needed for advancement. IMHO, the advancement program should be changed to something that is meaningful and interesting to the scouts. Keep the challenge and growth factors. Maybe the SM and scout should work together to create a more personalized advancement itinerary. Maybe each time a rank is complete, the SM and scout could work to find a reasonable path for advancement to the next rank. I think the problem would be implementing a program that is fair

Yes. In scoutbook, the forums contain the info and the documentation. It is far from an ideal, practical or good situation. But it is what it is. You can search and find stuff. A TRICK you should know about ... Some commentators in the forum have an icon for "ScoutBook user Advisory Council.". If you click that patch, it takes you to this set of four page ... where all the documentation exists. https://www.scoutbook.com/mobile/forums/using-scoutbook/86040/suac-scoutbook-faq-and-resources-table-of-contents/

BSA recently addressed situations like this. First of all, I assume the issue is in the "proposal" as the plan is not approved. BSA wrote Nov-Dec 2017 Advancement News an article about "Jumping The Gun". https://filestore.scouting.org/filestore/advancement_news/2017_Nov-Dec.pdf A few key statements... Proposal approval is to be a "benefit" to the scout to avoid later issues. It is not meant as a legalistic hoop to jump through. Completing project without prior approval is counter to project requirements. BSA also wrote ... "However, if circumstances are

How about redesigning venturing into a young adult program? Overlap it with college ages. Overlap it with college service fraternities. Put certain boundaries on it (no drinking, etc). It's about service and adventure. I often think about this as we had multiple scouts age out and become 18-20. They hang around in a pseudo fashion. They just don't have the time and commitment to become a fully trained and committed ASM, but they are not really a youth either. It would be nice to have a program to serve them. And, I'd be okay calling it Scouting Young Adults. Gotta check the acr

I agree. It has to happen. But it's also interesting how the CC is often treated as absent and then critical again. Most CO's just have no clue what their units are doing day by day or year by year. For example, I think most COs would be less concerned about including girls and more concerned on whether you are conducting safe camping trips and meaningful events and if you represent the CO well. But if they really don't ask those questions, I'm not sure you will get useful input from the CO on including girls. If anything, you could be asking for more trouble than it's worth.

I tend to agree. But at the same time, it is explicitly intended and stated that scouts are given wide latitude in what type of project is acceptable. We don't to put too many limits on the scout or the country will be buried under the weight of a million picnic tables. From what I've seen, the projects that do have trouble at their eagle board of review are as above. The scout heavily depends on one person or an external resource or essentially gives up control of their project. Perhaps that should be an evaluation criteria? Will the scout be in control of his own project?

A few random comments Inch thick workbook - there is no need for a thick workbook. That is why the workbook was re-designed in 2011. The redesign was to move the focus from paperwork to execution. From paperwork to doing. These days you just don't need an inch thick workbook. In fact, it's a sign of heavy handed troops. Or of families that had older sons that did eagle projects before the 2011 redesign. It's 100% okay to do pre-work. The scout has the option to do lots of work or just a little The requirement is to plan, develop and lead a project. As long as he shows lea

Your view is not the same as mine. I won't argue BSA is perfect, but BSA had a tracking system in place for decades before the public acknowledged or knew about abuse. BSA staff worked to document and track / record. It wasn't perfect, but from what I've seen it was far ahead of what was being done in schools and communities at the same time. If anything, it's BSA's own keeping documents that caused trouble. It would have been better served if it shredded the documents after a 20 years.

Absolutely. Reality trumps rules ... ewww ... somehow I just don't feel right these days using the verb "trump".

Not den. Rank. During recharter you make sure everyone is in the correct rank. BSA has no idea who's in which den.