Jump to content


  • Content Count

  • Joined

  • Last visited

  • Days Won


Posts posted by Treflienne

  1. 11 minutes ago, ParkMan said:

    they do require dry cleaning

    Even though they say they are machine washable?  Or only if you want to look dressed-for-court-of-honor sharp and not dressed for camping?

    I've machine-washed a fair amount of dry-clean-only wool,  generally sucessfully.   Cold water and line dry.

  2. I went to the local scout shop and was rather disappointed at the shirt choices.  The new Scouts BSA shirts were not in, and anyway appear (online) only to come in cotton-blend.   The polyester microfiber was very soft and drapey and felt (and looked) rather pajama-like.  I tend to like nylon hiking shirts, but BSA doesn't seem to make nylon shirts any more.  (Maybe I'll find one on ebay some day.)  But what about the poly/rayon/wool? (65% polyester, 25% rayon and 10% wool ) For those of you who have it, do you like the shirt?  Is this a practical blend for the outdoors?  (I know wool is often good, alone,  and polyester is generally fine, but I am unfamiliar with the rayon).  Is it quick drying?   How hot or cool of a shirt is this? Has it stood up well to machine-washing without much coddling?






    Declaration of Religious Principle

    The Boy Scouts of America maintains that no member can grow into the best kind of citizen without recognizing an obligation to God and, therefore, recognizes the religious element in the training of the member, but it is absolutely nonsectarian in its attitude toward that religious training. Its policy is that the home and organization or group with which a member is connected shall give definite attention to religious life. Only persons willing to subscribe to this Declaration of Religious Principle and to the Bylaws of the Boy Scouts of America shall be entitled to certificates of membership.


    In line with the "absolutely nonsectarian" part of the Declaration of Religious Principle,  the interpreter strip requirments could not mean "from scripture".

    Besides, the other steps are conversation, translation of a speech, writing a letter. Translating something written rounds this out nicely.

  4. 2 hours ago, Eagledad said:

    blending is inevitable for the majority of COs. It's simple matter of math.


    2 hours ago, qwazse said:

    I disagree with @Eagledad on the certainty of an "every troop will be co-ed" prognostication. Given what I've seen among venturers, I think we are more likely to have a Czech model where couple of troops in a district will be co-ed, and a couple will be of one sex or the other. They'll get together occasionally to compare notes and have fun, but when they go home, they'll reflect and be very happy with their configuration. This will be because, well, it's a big country, and sex integration will garner the most smiles in one part, and sex segregation will garner the most smiles in another part. 


    1 hour ago, Eagledad said:

     However, I like your Czech, prognostication, because it "feels" good (I guess there is some liberalism in all of us).:eek:  

    I hope you are right. 

    I do believe that the current approach allows for local areas to find what works for them.   And in my area, its looking like it may go the way of @qwazse's Czech model.

    In my single-high-school single-middle-school school district the N Boy Scout troops concluded that, due to numbers, it made sense only to have one Scouts BSA girls troop.   This troop is now linked to one of the Boy Scout troops,  leaving N-1 strictly-boy-only troops.

    As far as the linked pair of troops:  the boy troop and the girl troop have different troop numbers.  They meet at the same time in the same building, but the girls have a separate classroom reserved for them.    The plan starting out is joint opening ceremonies,  some joint meetings, some separate meetings.   Likely more separation as the girls troop gains in experience and size.

    Who has what they want?

    • Boys who want an all-boy troop and all-boy environment and the BSA program have several troops to choose from.
    • Boys and/or families who want the BSA program and the convenience of simultaneous meetings and don't mind some coed mixing.
    • Girls who want the BSA program and don't mind some coed mixing.
    • Girls who want a strictly all-girl troop and don't mind the GSUSA program.   (There is one of these troops in the school district, also.)

    Who in my school district doesn't have what they want?

    • Girls who want a strictly all-girl never-boys-around troop and want the BSA program (but I have not met any locally)
    • Boys who want the GSUSA program  (who might hypothetically exist, but I have never met one)

    I hope it will work out as happily in other areas.

    • Thanks 1

  5. How often do you hold a court of honor for the troop?

    Is it a big deal, with families invited, and taking a whole troop meeting?   Is it a smaller affair, simply part of the opening or closing ceremony of a regular troop meeting?

    If your troop has scouts wait till the COH to get their rank patches, how long of a wait is that?  a month?  six months?


  6. 15 minutes ago, Jeff1974 said:

    What I find troubling is the continued pushing from our council on this issue.

    That's different than in our area.  For our troop, the push definitely came from a couple of girls in particular, who recruited friends to participate and parents to volunteer.  Then the local Boy Scout troops and Cub Scout packs stepped up to help,  inquiring of their families whether they knew any of any more interested girls.  Finally the girls worked out which Boy Scout troop to link with -- deciding between several very appealing offers. 

    In another nearby town, the push came from some high school girls who wanted a chance to do eagle.

    In this context, our council has seemed supportive but not pushy.

  7. 19 minutes ago, scotteg83 said:

    Now,  I have help started a Brand new troop with no start-up money besides dues.  The Scouts haven't planed their year or fundraising, so costs have to be kept at a minimum.

    If I remember right, you are talking about a new girls' troop?  Are you linked to an existing boys' troop?   Are they willing to let you use and resupply their "stock" of patches (to spare you the cost of extra pins) at least as you are getting started?

  8. 20 minutes ago, Ranman328 said:

    I said disciplinary regarding the revocation of a Membership


    20 minutes ago, Ranman328 said:

    Again  Show me where I said it!!! 


    On 1/29/2019 at 2:05 PM, Ranman328 said:

    Per the National Capital Area Council, which is my council, you must notify District and Council of any disciplinary actions taken by the troop to a scout.  Not sure what area you are from but this according to them has been BSA Policy for years.  If a Scout is a first time offender or is involved in a fight, I find it sad that a Troop would just suspend that scout without sitting him and his parents down for a discussion first.  Just my opinion.  

    Hi @Ranman328

    I bolded some things you said.  You may have meant "disciplinary regarding the revocation of a Membership".   But that qualifiying phrase did not appear in your prior post, in which you said "you must notify District and Council of any disciplinary actions taken by the troop to a scout."   I suspect it may have been an accidental omission, but it has been causing some confusion.

    • Upvote 2
    • Downvote 1

  9. 10 hours ago, mashmaster said:

     Is anyone else growing tired of the marketing and PR behind it

    I think we should view this as having been temporarily helpful for the sake of getting the new girls troops started.   You cannot start a troop unless you find five girls.   The general public already knows that Boys Scouts is a good program for boys.   They just needed the opportunity to realize it was for their girls too.  

    (In our new troop,  less than a quarter of the new female scouts have a brother already in Boy Scouts.  So that was a bunch of new families.)

  10. Hi @Jameson76

    Try to remember that "A scout is cheerful".  And I really think that there is a more positive view that can be taken that what is coming across in what you said:

    7 hours ago, Jameson76 said:

    Trying to ignore the whole "Scout Me In; Family Scouting is the BEST; the attitude that the last 109 years was subpar or somehow as the Boy Scouts did not allow girls; 

    Looking at this a different way:  People think that the last 109 years of the Boy Scouts was terrific.  They are excited that girls will now have this same opportunity.

    7 hours ago, Jameson76 said:

    as long as we're at it let's toss out the name Boy Scouts and become Scouts BSA.

    Looking at this a different way:  We want to both keep the name of the organization "Boy Scouts of America" and also make the new female scouts feel like they belong.  And anyway, even though we cannot call the girls who are Scouts "girl Scouts"  we can still call the boys who are Scouts "boy Scouts" or "boy scouts" which sound exactly like "Boy Scouts".  


    • Upvote 2

  11. @malraux, @qwazse , @MattR, @The Latin Scot   , 

    Thanks for the neckerchief idea.  It seems like a very good idea.   If the girls were going to be wearing the same neckerchief as the boys troop to which they are linked, then I think I would do that.   However, at least some of the girls think that they should pick their own custom neckerchief (a large, square neckerchief).   And they have not yet had a chance to design that yet.  (First official meeting next week after they officially become scouts tomorrow!)

    I think that I will give them the World Crest, and also their new Scouts BSA handbooks.   (Assuming the handbooks arrive in time.  They are not in yet at the local council store, but I have them on order from the national scout shop.)  Hopefully it will not be long till the local scout shop gets the shirts and the girls can go and try them out for size.

    I really appreciate your feedback.   It is really helpful for me to be able to sound y'all out on some of my possibly crazy ideas.                              


  12. On 1/30/2019 at 6:55 AM, ianwilkins said:

    Is there any requirement to do anything to earn that world crest?

    It is my understanding that it is worn by all youth and adult members of BSA, and there is no requirement for a scout to do anything to earn the right to wear it.  https://www.scouting.org/international/information-sheets/22-330/

    I have already read, here on scouter forum,  that in the past BSA did have requirements for wearing it.

    • Thanks 1

  13. Can you wear the world crest without wearing a uniform?

    Why do I ask?  Because the girls' uniforms are not yet in at our local scout shop.  And our girls will be registered as of two days from now.  And they (or at least one of them) wants to be able to show her membership in the WOSM even though she won't yet have a uniform.  (I think she envisions temporarily attaching it with a safety pin to her ordinary clothing.)

  14. 37 minutes ago, Saltface said:

    @qwazse Do you have more details or a source for his reasoning?

    Also, from the foreword, written by Robert Baden Powell, in Scouting for Girls, the 1920 Girl Scout handbook.



    . . . I afterwards took to training boys in that way, but I had not been long at it before the girls came along and offered to do the very thing I had hoped for, they wanted to take up Scouting also.

    They did not merely want to be the imitators of the boys; they wanted a line of their own.

    So I gave them a smart blue uniform and the name of "Guides" and my sister wrote an outline of the scheme.  The name Guide appealed to the British girls because the pick of our frontier force in India is the Corps of Guides. . . .



    • Thanks 2

  15. 36 minutes ago, Saltface said:

    @qwazse Do you have more details or a source for his reasoning?

    Marguerite de Beaument (who was one of the original Girl Scouts who showed up at the Crystal Palace rally) wrote a biography of Baden-Powell  (The Wolf That Never Sleeps, 1944),  intended to be read by the girl guides, in which she wrote: (p. 45-46)



    B.-P. was now called the 'Chief Scout', and the 'Chief' we will now call him to the end of this story.  He was, of course, present at this rally and suddenly caught sight of the Girl Scouts.  He went up to them at once, smiled at them and said: "Who are you, and what are you doing here?"  I, as the patrol leader, stepped forward and saluted: "Please, Sir," I said, just a little frightened and shy, "we are the Wolf Patrol of the Girls Scouts, and we want to do Scouting like the boys."   . . .

    After that things began to happen.  A little while later I went to see the Chief at his house in London.  He sat in a large armchair and talked of the days when he was soldiering in India.  He told me that he was racking his brain for a name for the Girl Scouts: "The youngsters who are girls and want to do Scouting" was the way he put it.  He told me of the famous regiment of Guides, of which you have already heard.  Then he turned to me and said: "These men were called the Guides, and that is what I am going to call you.  Do you think you can live up to it and stick to their traditions?":



    • Thanks 4

  16. @qwazse  I know that.   And as I have said previously,  it would be brand suicide for GSUSA to go with "Guides".  There is very little recognition of the term in the U.S.  Our little Brownies are always surprised to hear that elsewhere in the world girl scouts are called "girl guides".

    But the made-up name I used in this post was "Girlscout",  echoing Girlguiding's running together of the two words.

  17. The UK has "The Scout Association" (WOSM) and "Girlguiding" (WAGGGS).   

    Perhaps we in the US are on our way to a situation in which a Scout and a Girlscout are as distinct as an Apple and a Pineapple.   (Especially since some GSUSA councils are advising their people to always put the word "girl" in front of the word "scout".)

  18. @John-in-KC

    This is morphing in the direction of a discussion of new leaders for linked troops.

    How about a Forum or Subforum devoted to Linked Troops?

    3 days till we start.    I expect that we will all be learning as we go along,  and being able to pool experiences here will be helpful --- and it will be even more helpful if it is easy for people to find the posts relevant to linked troops by having a Forum or Subform for them.



    • Upvote 1

  19. 1 hour ago, Eagledad said:

    You might be right. Statistically, a 2nd unit that splits from a very successful first unit is rarely as successful, while the first continues it's success. The risk of failure was so high for the 2nd unit that our district chairman only considered a split as a last resort. Which made council angry.

    With a boys unit splitting off from a boys unit --- new youth have to choose between the units.   With a girls unit linking to a boys unit,  it is clear which unit each new youth should join.  That might help.


    1 hour ago, Eagledad said:

    I know in theory linked troops are a sound idea to get the girls side up, but that hasn't been proven successful in reality. So, the two teachable adults might be required for the 2nd troop. 


    Nobody yet knows how this is going to work out.    We have the idea, locally, that the girls troop may be quite heavily supported by the boys troop initially,  but start doing more and more stuff independent of the boys as the girls troop (girls and adults) gain experience.  

  20. 7 minutes ago, shortridge said:

    Fingers crossed, but I have very little confidence that that will happen with any speed. The delays of this new uniform do not inspire confidence.

    It may be time to see just how poor a fit the boy-cut quick-dry shirts are on the girls.   Only a few days now till they are registerd scouts.

  • Create New...