SSScout

Or maybe Way Out West, or Saps at Sea. Or A Night at the Opera....

I favor broadening their horizons alittle. They'll see Up and the rest at home or in the theater. Be adventurous. Second Hand Lions is very good: adventure, love and loyalty, bad guys lose, good guys win and it's a boy who wants to be a Scout!. A Laurel and Hardy or Marx Brothers flick (Music Box or At the Circus). Introduce them to the classics, if you can get a good copy of Max Fleischer's "Gulliver's Travels" (1939!) there are nice restorations available, my Cubs loved it (now that was 12 years ago, in Video tape!). Bus ride with a movie. Captive audience...

Orthopaedic surgeons on helmet use: http://orthoinfo.aaos.org/topic.cfm?topic=a00425 Irish sport of "hurling" now requires helmets: http://www.brainandspinalcord.org/blog/2010/01/06/hurlers-required-to-wear-helmets-to-help-prevent-brain-injuries/ On the other hand, statistics tend to show that cycling is safer than walking. Do we wear walking helmets? http://blogs.ft.com/undercover/2008/07/should-we-cyclists-bother-to-wear-helmets/ Anyone seen "Sleeper" lately?

It is exciting, no doubt. And I have to agree there are better ways to spend our dues/donations/endowment. Safe camps? Rebuild camps? Preserve property? Just took title to 10,000 acres in WVA for a Jamboree/high adventure site. Must be lotsa naming rights therebouts, huh? "Coca Cola White Water Rapids". "Burger King Dining Hall". "First Alert Campfire Circle". "Viers Paving Memorial Driveway". "Kaiser Permanente Health Lodge". "Weyerhauser Nature Lodge". "Jinsu Axe Yard". Every time the Jamboree comes around, Car companies "donate" vehicles and then at the end, Jamboree sells them. Maybe Jamboree could GIVE them to deserving Councils or camps for staff use? Could National give local Councils low cost/no cost loans if the council is in financial straits to help fix things up? Course, now, if we could make that racer a Pioneering/Farm Mechanics/Chemistry/Composit Materials/Engineering/Automotive Maintenance/Metalwork/Traffic Safety/Truck Transportation Merit Badge project, that might make it worth while. Can an Offie be lashed to an oak frame and ... Where's Andy Granatelli when you need him?

Yeah, like the boy is going to want to do three ranks at once. CNY, Which type A parent is interested in this? Had a Cub in the Pack I commish. CM asks me (in October)if they could award this Cub his Wolf from the previous year, because his Den Leader had ceased being DL and did not get a chance to sign off on the boys requirements. The new DL (now Bear Den) said that the parents had approached him with this. The previous DL had signed off on the other boys' req's before the year was up, and had promised (so said) to sign off the Cub's req's before the turn of the school year, but didn't before he/she left. I said I saw no reason to penalize the Cub for an adults lapse. If the DL and parents (Akela) and CM were satisfied he had met the req's, award him the rank, postdated if you will. Then too, I guess that wasn't really "working" on a younger rank...

" Doesn't matter what happens to you . Therefore, I want the absolute worst thing to happen to you if you have an UNINTENTIONAL event. No need for padding or knee pads or helmets, they just impede your motion and don't allow the wind in your hair. Please go for the 4 diamond slope , cut close to the tree line, mogul, rad it, and generally raise your adreniline level. Don't worry. go fast." "I love you. Please train and practice and gradually increase the challenge you face so you can meet those challenges with skill and take pride in your accomplishments. Oh, just in case some UNINTENTIONAL event happens, wear the pads, the helmet, the knee pads 'cause ya never can tell when a loose patch of ice may come up, or some other fool cuts across your line, or a misplaced piece of lift tower appears closer to your cut than you thought.I know you don't need to worry about the PLANNED stuff. It's the UNPLANNED stuff we wear helmets for. Have fun."

"it's not a rule, it's only a guideline". No, it's a rule, now. If we didn't love you, it wouldn't be a rule. We learn and get better as we get older. Barney Oldfield didn't use seatbelts when auto racing was invented, but he invented the rear view mirror to increase his chances of surviving AND winning. Bet Jacky Ickx and Jimmy Stewart and all the Gordons and Eckharts are glad to wear helmets and seatbelts now. Same with helmets in ALL sports. It's not wimpy, it's smart. It's an advantage. You might like the feel of the wind in your hair, but you'd like the feel of asphalt in your scalp less, hence helmets for biking; both motor and pedal. http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/03/19/ski.safety/index.html Hit your head once, you never have to do it again. It took a long time to see the advantage of the helmet. High iron workers, football players, Delta Force, deep sea divers, motocross, skateboarder. My son rode his bike across the street to a neighbors house. Riding back he slipped, the bike went one way, he went the other. He walked back home the 300 yards, met me in our driveway(I was washing the car and had not seen what happened) and asked me where had he been? We were at the emergency room for about three hours while he was diagnosed with a "possible" concussion (nothing showed on the scans). He is a believer now if he wasn't before, and will ALWAYS wear the helmet ANY time he is on the bike. Next months Troop ski trip? Helmets are on his mind...and around it! "you only need it once...which once?"

Bike helmets are still a good idea for snowsports, even if you are not an "Xtreme" boarder. If the Bike helmet was properly fitted to begin with, take out some of the sizing pads, and wear a wool watch cap. Don't forget the goggles. Wear it square on the head, not on the back, in a "cool" manner. Snug up that chin strap. I would tell them the same thing I tell my son when he is bike riding; "You only need the helmet once. Which once is it going to be?" And then we remind each other of the demonstration we watched of a melon being only dropped from 5 feet up, onto a dirt floor (not concrete!), and then thinking about adding some velocity to it, and snagging a rock "just by accident".

I'll not waste the space with the whole poem, but, Lonescout, I recommend to you a bit about "Tommy Atkins" by Rudyard Kipling: http://www.web-books.com/Classics/Poetry/Anthology/Kipling/Tommy.htm The homeless are not only one type of person. Each are made needy by their own history, and only that history can be blamed for that person's trouble and particular need. Safety issues can be met, Scouts can learn from example and lesson. The church can follow it's ministry. I see no real conflict. Communicate your concerns, solve the problems. Serve both the youth and the troubled adult.

Maryland has no fewer than 6 BSA Councils delineated within its convining boundaries. Pg.32... *sigh*(This message has been edited by SSScout)

"...Aw, Red, why would a mother try to starve her own son..."

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Sorry, multiple posts for some reason...(This message has been edited by SSScout)(This message has been edited by SSScout)

Before Mr. Kelty bent his aluminum tubing, the senior scouts came back from Philmont touting the virtues of the war surplus M4 plywood pack board, and then everybody in the Troop had to have one. Sunny's Surplus couldn't find enough. Eastern seaboard Troops went up into the Appalachians, firm in the knowledge there would be enough downed, dead American Chestnut to cook over blue hot coals. No more. I had a 2 quart aluminum Scout canteen. It fell over a cliff (another time) and when I recovered it, it was badly dented. Back home, I filled it about 2/3 full, put it in the freezer, and a couple of hours later heard a loud "TUNK", went and fetched it out. All the dents were gone! It served me and my camping sons until one let it roll off a table into the road where it was run over by a car. No more canteen.

A worthy addition to the library shelf that also holds "Murphy's Law and it's Corollaries".

1)If the label/box states that it is a "three person tent", consider carefully the dimensions of the floor, and diagram if offered. Where you gonna put your pack? Three usually means two in the real world. 2) If a "rain fly" tent, Always see the tent set up before you buy, either in the store or a friends copy. Look and see how far down the rain fly really comes. Does it at least come close to the reinforced bottom? Are the zippers covered against the rain? I've seen some tents that were great so long as the rain came straight down, but give it even a little horizontal vector and regret sets in. Ventilation? you can always peel back the rain fly. 3)Personal preference: Tough reinforced waterproof built in floor that wraps up the sides about a foot (so called bathtub floor), or just tough nylon on floor (use your own groundcloth "footprint"). Both have advantages: BT is total protection UNTIL you have a leak, then the water can't get out! Ordinary nylon is fine if set up allows rain to run down walls and UNDER the GC. Either way, does the rainfly come down far enough? Will the bottom seam CATCH water rather than shed? 4) Read the fine print. What part of the fabric is really water proof or merely nylon tricot? And then, even the close sewn fabric and properly arranged seams (overlapped so as not to CATCH water) need to be properly sealed. If the tent is "factory sealed", you will pay extra, and even then... 5) Plan on buying some spray fabric waterproofing and/or seam sealer. Talk to someone you trust or a knowledgeable store person about this. Set the tent up on a sunny day and work over the whole thing from the inside and then the out with the seam sealer. Be methodical and obsessive. Don't miss any seam, the rain will find the lacking-of-sealer areas. If you run out, go buy more. From the outside, spray water proofer on the rain fly and lower fabric areas generously. Let it dry. Spray again. I am told the silicone spray also provides some UV ray protection, hence the tent will last longer. I bought a relatively cheap (oh, I'm sorry, inexpensive) Texsport 3-person tent and after $25 of seam sealer and silicone spray, am very happy with it. It is tall enough for my 6'2" self to kneel up in it, and Scoutson and I are not overly crowded. It is abit heavy for distance hiking (Scoutson shared an REI 2 person on Philmont trek), but serves well in other venues. It has withstood storms and rain and snow over the last three years with only one splintered pole section, which was fixed with a kit. The last campout I went on with the Troop (october), I laid out a 10' by 20' tarp, staked down about 4 1/2' of the twenty, curled it back over itself with four poles I cut about 4' tall, so I had an open tube. Room for backpack and gear, open to the scenery to the side. Slept well. Please note: When son becomes BS, you will no longer need a "three person" tent. Let son join Troop, and gain from older Scouts experience therein. Any other lil' Scouts coming along?(This message has been edited by SSScout)

FS one of my favorite songs... I guess it also depends on where you got your training... I always said that I had the very best license Kmart had on sale. :-) "blue light special" AND remember Bob the Tomato..."It's for the kids"

Well, I haven't saw fit to participate in this thread yet, but I do have a perspective. My father was 32rd degree in the Scottish Rite, and Boumi Temple member,and I joined the Demolay (jr. Mason club) for two years at my dads invitation. I have to say that all clubs that use "secret" stuff to lend an air of importance to it's purpose can be held similar to Masonic ritual. What's more important is the promises made and kept. The Masonic organizations are religious in tone and activity and can become a religion, superceding the originaL faith of the adherent, if they should follow it to it's logical end. Many faiths are not sympathetic to or comfortable with Freemasonry and rightfully so in my opinion. But that said, the Masons do good public work, secret ritual and regalia not withstanding. OA is certainly not a religion, but it's native American symbolism based ritual is meant to remind the member of the importance of faith (whichever), loyalty (brotherhood) and service to others. I chose not to be supportive of a secret organization that my loved ones would not be permitted to participate in or observe. I know I became uncomfortable with some of the Demolay ritual and symbolism, even at my young and tender age, and so did not continue. That much I remember, details of my discomfort are not so clear. On my father's death, our favorite Methodist church allowed a Masonic ceremony during his memorial service. His Lions club spoke, I spoke, and the Masons spoke, top hats, aprons, capes and all. They invited me to consider joining my father's lodge, but I had to say no, due to the secrecy and religious overtones I knew of. I said I thought that being a Quaker AND being a Mason would not be possible. I remember they insisted that the two could be reconciled, but I demurred. I see no such conflict with BSA and the OA (so far!). YiS

Anybody know if there is an appropriate Guinness Book category? Waiting music theme from "Jeopardy" dumdedumdum dumdedummmm, dumdedumdumDUM, dedededede, dumdedumdum dumdedum, DUM, dedede, dum, dum, dum, (bum bum).

Waaaay back when I worked as a bus driver, I would "occassionally" meet with a passenger who was convinced that I was the "worst driver this side of the Potomac" or some such and they would delight in telling me so. Since I knew I had some of the best training available, had been asked to help train other drivers, had VERY few accidents in the preceeding years, and even had a few complimentary letters in my work file, I felt comfortable in responding "I'm sorry you feel that way". I would then turn back to my steering wheel and drive on... If it seemed appropriate, I would agree with them and suggest that for their own safety, the next time perhaps they should consider waiting for the next bus. On one occassion, when the malcontent passenger (thankfully not the same person every time) presented herself, another passenger told her to "shut the --- up, sit down and enjoy the ride!" In that case, she did. I remember smiling and... driving on. One time, after a passenger had 'told me off', I noticed that each time I approached her stop, she would step back from the stop and motion me to pass on. Three weeks later (!), she boarded my bus, said nothing as she paid her fare, and rode all the way into the terminal. When she disembarked, she apologized to me for yelling at me before. She rode my bus and smiled at me every time she boarded after that. And I smiled back. If I had taken those opinions of my driving skill "personally", it would not have been a pleasent job, my attitude would have made it very unpleasent. It was my attitude that changed the situation. I considered their opinions (about a second!), and then went on. Thin skins are promblematical, but better to try to be good at what you do, be willing to accept some "feedback" that is given in good spirits and work to include folks in what needs to be done. There will always be folks that think they can drive the bus better than you, just make sure you have the training, easy on the brakes, tell them where you're going, and maybe sing alittle as you go.

Very pretty. Bet we'll see an article in SCOUTER or BLife. No neckers? All bolo ties?

K: Thank you for bringing this up. I know it will be a source of discussion at R/Ts and Committee meetings. I would also go with what is in the HB. That is what the boy will see and that is what will have the widest reach. The scouter.org listing , taken all together (all three sentences) "implies" discussing four different points in each rank, but that is NOT very definite to my mind, it is only "implied". No where does it say 'discuss the way you live any four specific points of the Scout Law, giving specific examples for each'... and then asking the Scout to do the same thing for four different points ... and then four more different points. That would require the SM and/or the Scout keep score thru the years of TF, SC, and FC. nAnd THAT would be tough. I favor asking the Scout to discuss how he abides by the Scout Law, give me four specific examples and the four SLPoints that apply. If he does four "Helpfuls", that's good; maybe in the SM conference the Scout can be drawn out to see other ways he follows the SL he isn't even aware of. This would certainly not 'add to or subtract from' the requirements, only add to the Scout's growth. (This message has been edited by SSScout)

Eamonn, always with a discussion starter. I agree with 2cubdad and BadenP. There are three basic types of CO's in my experience: ** the CO of convenience: gimme the charter to sign, have fun see you next year g'bye. We had a local hospital like that, and a local hardware store.(HW store owner loves Scouting). ** the CO that needs the Scout model for it's own purposes: LDS and some other Faiths, and other organizations. ** the CO that WANTS Scouting to flourish and will do almost anything organizationally to promote it: the church pastor was an Eagle/SM/Philmont Ranger, etc. The VFW post or Am. Legion sees Scouting as a mission to American youth. We had a group of parents at a local elementary school get together and organize a Cub Pack (15 kids!) without the benefit of a CO, and THEN start the search for a CO! They had everything but a Pack flag (DE gave them a "provisional" Pack number). We could not find a local org to take that role. Many were the organizations that said, " gee we love Scouting, but..." (we don't have the money,the space, afraid of the responsibility, don't know that much about it, don't want to take on anything we can't participate in 'cause of time constraints, etc. ) and ultimately, if there isn't some love of Scouting somewhere in the CO, it ain't gonna work. This lonesome Pack eventually got an Am. Leg. some distance away to be their "CO of Convenience". They meet in the school's MP room.

In this discussion, I wish to remind folks that we have two seperate items here: The awarding of the Eagle award and the celebration of the event. My memories of past (way past) Eagle CoHs are just that: A Court of Honor to make note of the accomplishment and make the formal presentation of the badge, medal and certificate. In the Troop of my youth, we would have the candle lit CoH, as usual, for the "lower ranks" and then the SM and ASMs would come forward, invite the new Eagle forward, make his charge, ask him to renew his Scout Promise and presented him his award. Sometimes, if someone remembered to ask, there would be the letter of congratulation from the Senator or Governor or President, but often not. The close of the CoH/Troop Meeting would include the SM Minute, something about trails traveled or dust on the boot or new hills to climb or such. THEN we'd settle in to the fried chicken or cake. The Troop made the award, the family and friends made the party. Nowadays, the CoH is often part and parcel with the celebration, which I think is a shame. It loses the Scout part of it, in my opinion. The Troop awards the rank, the Scout earns it, the family and friends and Scout celebrate it. One of the best Eagle presentations I have witnessed was done on a camp trip. The nascent Eagle was the youngest of three brothers, the others also Eagles. I was not around when the first two received theirs. The younger asked to receive his on a camp out at his granddad's farm (a favorite Troop spot). Family folk were escorted to the spot and lawn chairs set up for all the witnesses. Tables, clothes, placards, candles and other regalia for a normal CoH, only under a crisp fall sky. The SM, who is not known for his SM Minutes, outdid himself, I thought. After, campfire fare: hotdogs, bratwurst and beans and salad. After the families retired, the Scouts stayed up late around the campfire. What more do you need?

And don't attend your local Renaisance Festival, you will be blinded by the farb. In the spirit of the season, hohohohoh