mdsummer45

This is Justin speaking: I wanted to personally thank EVERYONE on this forum for all the support and help throughout this entire process. I have learned a lot and I am proud to have earned the rank of Eagle Scout. It was a long road but it was completely worth it. I appreciate all of your comments and thank you to everyone who congratulated me. It means a lot to me. Take care, Justin

For those of you who Private messaged me stating that they hoped my younger son and myself have not seen animosity from the unit leaders I think the posting by OwINE488 gives you your answer. Both Justin and I continue to be demonized. MY Eagle award..how nice. That statement demonstrates his lack of knowledge as to what actually occurred over the past year. I guess OwINE488 believes that Nationals rules and regulations and policies and procedures are just "technicalities". Rather than trying to learn and grow and make improvements to the unit,it appears that OwINE488 believes this unit should just continue on it current path and put blame on anyone who dare challenge their manipulation of Nationals rules. "National struggled for month"..struggled?? In my conversations with National the word struggled was never used. I was told that the committee need additional information from the council and that does take additional time for the correspondence to go back and forth. Also my sons appeal was not the only appeal that National was reviewing. OwINE488..lets talk about this privately...you know who I am and while I think I know who you are I am not positive. The next time you see me reveal yourself to me and lets talk. Contrary to what you think I only have positive thoughts and wishes for this troop. After reading all of the documents and talking with Justin either in person or by phone, Justin was encouraged to appeal to National by other scouters in our district, in neighboring districts and in other councils outside of our state. So I guess in OwINE488 eyes they too manipulated the situation and therefore this is their Eagle Award ,too. Congratulations to all of you! This all really makes me sad.

eagle732 PM me with a good email address for you. I think we may have emailed this summer however I can not find your email address. Thanks

EAGLE732...sent you a PM

Just called National. Sons appeal is still at National.

It appears that National meets quarterly to review appeals. My sons appeal is in the process of being reviewed (fourth quarter appeal). This is what we have been told by a Council representative.

Still waiting to hear from National.

Eagle732--I sent you a PM. Let me know if you do not receive it

Nothing new to report. No final decision has been made. I promise to report back when this reaches its final conclusion and I really do not have a time line for that. I promise I will not leave you all hanging.

I did not have selective amnesia and I was listening to you...I was listening to you as people who were giving me their opinion from afar. I have cometo learn that every troop, district and council do things differently. I went by the words from my District person. In my postings I state BOR and not EBOR that is because those were the words that the district people used. I took their words at face value and did not reinterpret them to mean EBOR. The term EBOR was never said to me in my phone call from the DC and was never written in any emails from the DC to my son. One of our probems is that I am ignorant of how things wordk and the short hand speak of those with years of scouting experience. But ignorance is no excuse...right. Just like I was ignorant of the fact that he could change troop 6 mos before he aged out. I was ignorant.

It appears that when my son attempts to defend himself at the distrcit meeting(which we just found out from the council AC was my sons EBOR...I did not know that nor did my son), it is viewed like this...'Now you continue the argument, personalizing and demonizing those people who "deny you" the Eagle Award. By continuing this behavior, you only reinforce thier conclusion.' The person who chaired the District meeting was the District Chairman. And as I have mentioned before this SM hold 3 postions at the District level. The SM also contacted the DC before writing the letter to my son and told the DC his feelings about my son and asked for the DC input as to what the SM should do.(This is written in the SM presentation to the troop Committee) Is this possibly a conflict of interest? Advise the SM about what he should do and then Chair the appeal at the District level? Just a question.

The council letter came from the council advancement chairman and not the council SE. I have a call into the Council Director of Field Service(DFS) but have not heard back from him. I called him last Thursday and left a messaage requesting him to return my call. Since you have mentioned the role the Council SE plays in this appeal, I guess a call to that gentleman is in order.

Correction: My son attended Brownsea when he had just started 9th grade. It still was 4 years ago.

Fair question...I was present at the troop committee meeting and heard what was presented by the SM and my son. I was not present at the district meeting and he never had a meeting with the council. The only thing that I did not know about occurred when my son was probably in 8th grade and attended Brownsea. The SM stated that my son had a confrontation with another scout. My son said that he was in a group of other scouts and they were all saying stupid things to each other and when my son said something to one scout that scout picked up a stick and came after my son( my son does not even remember what was said) my son said he went running to another youth leader for protection. The SM did not witness at the actual incident (although present at Brownsea because he runs the thing) and therefore his account of the situation was based on what he was told and morphed it into more than it was. I question how bad the incident really was because neither my husband nor myself were ever contacted by the SM regarding the incident and my son continued to progress through the ranks with out issue. Remember this happened when my son was in 8th grade yet the SM held onto it and felt the need to bring it up 4+ yrs later. I can state for a fact (because I was present) portions of what was written in the TC letter and in the SM were not an accurate reflection what actually happened at the meeting. One of the big issues here is my sons attendance and participation at troop meeting and outings. This troop has an attendance policy and the troop uses attendance to evaluate scout spirit. It is posted on their website that "Each troop sets its own qualifications for an active scout" the document then list: Active = 75% of troop meeting , 50% of planned outdoor outings, must participate in a troop sponsored service project, while in POR must attend 75% of PLC meeting with an 100% response to SPL if not attending". My son was able to live up to those expectations until his junior yr in high school when he became extremely involved in school honor societies and service to the high school faculty and guidance office and community activities...ya know demonstrating the scout spirit in his everyday life. The only conversation my son ever had with the SM or with another other adult leader occurred when my sons attendance at meetings and outings declined during his junior year in high school. The only topic discuss was my sons attendance at meetings and outing.The next communication occurred when my son received the SM letter. And in this troop attendance=scout spirit.

Beavah, Generally speaking I don't think to highly of people jumping to conclusions and making assumptions without knowing all the facts. What makes you think that ljnrus did not have my permission? Apologies anyone? "So we're back to da issue that Mdsummer and all those to whom she has sent copies have only an incomplete set of facts from one aggrieved party in da dispute. No fair person would ever settle a case by listening to da hearsay testimony and evidence of only one side." What incomplete set of facts...what hearsay testimony and evidence... should I interpret that to mean you think that I have withheld information? Think what you want but it's not true. "No fair person would ever settle a case by listening to da hearsay testimony and evidence of only one side." yet isn't that what the council did when they made their decision and only had the information from the district? They may not have settled it but they made a decision based on evidence presented by only one party and made no attempt to get the other sides information. And you don't need to cite me the rules and regs I already know how you interpret them. "Mdsummer did share with me via PM the name of her council. I can say that it is not a council which has a reputation for being political or being an "old boys network" or any of that. Quite the opposite, it is a council which is very highly regarded in many scouting circles, both volunteer and professional. It is safe to say that da district and council folks are well trained and independent." And I am sure you will agree that that is only your opinion and not necessarily a fact. Beavah I do enjoy you :^)(This message has been edited by mdsummer45)(This message has been edited by mdsummer45)