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mds3d

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mds3d last won the day on October 21 2017

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About mds3d

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  1. mds3d

    When beneficiary destroys Eagle Project

    The state says that they weren't deteriorating but becoming dangerously slippery from rain or fallen leaves. This is one of the issues with doing work for a government agency. If it had slowly needed repair, then someone might have thought to get in touch with the scouts to get it fixed. If someone thought it was a safety issue, then I imagine that order probably took less than 24hrs to issue. Someone said it was unsafe, a ranger went and determined it wasn't really necessary and a supervisor ordered it demolished. It wouldn't surprise me if someone actually slipped and got hurt. In contrast, there are other eagle projects in various TN state parks around me that pose no safety hazard that have long since needed repair.
  2. mds3d

    Guidance on Discipline

    Being a UC, I would say that this fits within our wheelhouse. The truth is, this isn't actually a legal matter yet. You have a scout who is accused of violating the law, but this isn't a police matter. No LEO would be able to act on the information here. This is primarily a mission issue. If this were brought to me, I would advise a meeting between the CC, COR, and SM and NO ONE ELSE. Primarily this kind of issue lies within the preference of the CO. Because, this is a potential legal matter and certainly a recruitment and relationship (and probably safety) matter this should be where the COR steps in to exert the opinion of the CO. This doesn't really have anything to do with the other members of the CC and will invite more debate than is necessary. This should be the decision of the CC and COR. If my opinion was asked - suspend the scout. Don't suspend him for any length of time, but tell the parents that their son is suspended until they have a legitimate action plan in place to correct these issues.
  3. mds3d

    OA election nights

    I think the spirit of the rule is to only count "summer camp" once otherwise most scouts would only need to camp 5 nights outside of camp. I would not count part of a long term camp as a short term camp unless this was truly a different event (not during the summer camp week at the summer camp). Over the last two years this scout has camped 4 times + NYLT + Summer Camp. That is not enough for the OA IMHO. I think you are eligible because you camp. OA is a recognition of those who spend time away from civilization, usually under the stars or a tent roof, and who do it honorably. I think the rule is enough to determine what counts. The rule could be written that you must have 1 - 5 night camp plus 10 nights of camping where you are out no more than 3 nights at a time. 4 night camps don't fit the rule anywhere. The rule is supposed to balance number of nights with number of trips without specifying exactly how you got there.
  4. Wow, Eagledad, I wish they would just make you in charge. Here is where I expect these things came from. Someone at national asked some scouts who stuck with the program (11 to 18) what made them stay. They got a large number of "the OA" answers. I think this is true of many Arrowmen. I also think that the rate of people sticking with the OA after Brotherhood is much higher than those who only ever complete the Ordeal. National must have concluded that getting scouts to brotherhood with help them stick with the OA longer, sticking with the OA will make them stay in the program longer. I am not sure of the logic as it seems to me that OA lodges are all so different. I hated our chapter because the chapter chief was the same guy for my first three years there. He was a bully that got in "trouble" for smoking at camp. I hung around just enough to complete my brotherhood though. I don't know if it really matters how much of an "honor society" the OA is. For reference, our lodge only had two weekends for ordeal, one spring and one fall. They also did the brotherhood ceremony during summer camp after the ice cream social/lodge meeting. If your lodge doesn't have ceremonies to match this requirement then it is your lodge that is going to have to change.
  5. If they forced it, I would be tempted to pick a three digit number not in use and put that on your uniform and only use the 4 digit one (starting with a 4) for official stuff. Essentially that is what everyone with a less than four digit number does, they just don't include leading zeros.
  6. mds3d

    New Sex Abuse Charges

    All the information we have about 2017 is that "an incident" occurred. No one but the involved people, the BSA, and the investigators know exactly what that incident was. We have no idea if it was something to be reported or not. This is the problem with the news cycle related to criminal cases. Except in the most sensational of cases, we will never hear what happened to these people. The news will not report if they are found innocent, because that doesn't get clicks and sell ads. Yes, some of them seem pretty cut and dry, but others are all accusation at this point. It is bad, but if I were the BSA, I would start throwing people under the bus at some point. Units, camp directors, and chartered organizations would all make good scape goats. I am unsure if that would just scare away more volunteers or scare some into actually paying attention to YPT.
  7. I am not really trying to challenge, just curious. Why do you want it to cease being a flag? Then you are destroying the flag by cutting and only burning two pieces of cloth. I find the traditions very interesting. Without a specific prescribed ceremony different ones have been created with different meanings and logic. We were taught that the flag was burned as one piece because it remains a symbol of unity until its retirement. We were taught to fold the flag in half then drop the stripes on the fire, then fold the flag over onto the fire so the canton remained up (because it stays up even during retirement). Fires were always started without accelerants and made of local materials only because retirement is done by the land which the flag represented. (Our OA ceremony fires were always started without match or lighter).
  8. mds3d

    New Sex Abuse Charges

    ^ My notes in bold above. We cannot prevent every bad person from joining scouts if that person has not shown how he is bad yet. You posted 7 articles. 4 were definitely unrelated to scouting, 1 might have been unrelated (no information). The last two are hard to judge what would have been done to prevent it. None display any improper actions by any part of the BSA.
  9. mds3d

    New Sex Abuse Charges

    Zero cases where guidelines were followed is the goal. Making that number actually zero is solely in the hands of frontline volunteers and parents that need to make sure that guidelines are NEVER violated.
  10. mds3d

    New Sex Abuse Charges

    Because people don't follow their training. They think that YPT is overkill, or they think it isn't worth the trouble, or they think it can't happen to them, or there is a malicious actor in place. If training is followed, then most cases of abuse are physically impossible. I have to ask though, why anyone would think the BSA is liable for those 5 cases. The perpetrator should be charged and jailed if convicted (if they are found innocent then the case didn't really count, did it). The unit and CO should responsible for any negligence in following YPT. National should only be liable if their was a hole in the policies or training or if they registered a known high risk leader (a registered offender for example).
  11. mds3d

    New Sex Abuse Charges

    I miss understood the letter. I still have a really hard time with "creditable claims." I know that this a sensitive issue, but I assume that while the BSA thought the claims were creditable, the legal system did not? Why aren't we seeing a new wave of personal accusations against the actual perpetrators? It seems clear, unlike the movements against politicians and celebrities, there is no money to be had from bringing up the name of an old scoutmaster.
  12. Thanks, it helps to have context. Seems like the problem was less about it being a bad method and more about it being the one prescribed method. I have no problem with the BSA focusing on a singular method of skill teaching since you could spend a masters degree worth of time discussing all of the methods and when they are most useful. I do a lot of skill teaching at work and teaching others to teach skills. I essentially teach the EDGE method because it is more easily applicable than "see one, do one, teach one." That is what we were taught in school but there is often no one else to teach and teach back is awkward and stupid when it isn't and exercise.
  13. mds3d

    New Sex Abuse Charges

    I have no nice words for this conversation anymore. This seems to be more and more about people looking for monetary compensation for a thing that happened a long time ago. The story that opens this article is from 58 years ago and as far as I can tell was never reported to National. That scoutmaster may very well be dead now and organizational policies have drastically changed. Why would this man even be entitled to restitution from the BSA. Why is he not suing the church which was responsible for appointing the scoutmaster? Why does no one ever explain that the Chartered Organizations are the ones responsible for the original appointment. These articles just need to stop until there is actual evidence. As far as I can tell, there is no evidence that anyone reported for abuse was reinstated as a leader. People claim there is but never with evidence. Also does no one want to talk about the rate at which these cases occurred? It is always a raw number without thinking about how many boys have been scouts since 1944.
  14. Holy Zombie Thread, Batman! I love having a full size (square) necker. Anything else and I would rather go without. I cant find the original parent thread, anyone want to summarize why EDGE was so bad?
  15. Why is cutting the canton part of the minimum? As far as I am aware there is no prescribed method other than the fire part. We never did it that way but were taught to fold the flag on to the fire whole.
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