qwazse

Our lake at camp had an imbalance of bullhead catfish. Scouts were instructed to leave any such fish that they caught on shore to die. This lasted for quite a few years.

False. It was recognized by a sash full of cloth medallions. http://www.scouting.org/filestore/advancement_news/2015_Mar-April.pdf page 12I know a lot of the time most of us can function not giving a rip about what other scouters think. This is not one of those times. If you're in favor of the revisions, odds are you got your way at the expense of 10 to 20 other scouters who saw things differently. Also, it's not leadership, it's leadership development... The method of scouting and the old Palm requirement ... why that is now nebulous when it never was before defeats me.

I really like your outlook, but those are supposedly criteria (in broad strokes) for an Arrowman.Also, you use "high adventure" and "camping nights. What of crews who don't make that a priority? Should they conform to a more outdoor oriented program? Okay, we're coming on your 20th post. Are you going to start calling yourselves "venturers"? Or are you (like one former crew president who I know and love) going to insist that BSA made a boneheaded move with their name recognition strategy, and insist on "venture scouts" inspite of any training to the contrary.

Welcome to the forums, and thanks in advance for all you do for the boys. Aside from laying out the troop's expectations for its SPL, I would not interfere. Pick a bad SPL, the other boys take up the slack. It's good training for when they get the position.

From a council or lodge perspective, it's free advertising. It's absolutely in their interest that those patches see the light of day.

Are you sure they said 2% of CREWs? Wouldn't that be venturers? I offer advancement to every generation of crew, but all but one ever earned an award. That puts us around 1 or 2% over more than a decade. @@Scourge, who would you want to be accepted into this society? Assuming that you'd get there yourself, what type of venturers would you like to be in your company? What would you like them to accomplish?

@@Fehler, I don't think these guys were making a moral equivalence. They were going over ways that scouts at age 11 and 12 develop courtesy and loyalty. Loyalty comes in to play here, because venturing females are exotic creatures among Boy Scouts. They can either be respected for what they bring to the scouting table, or they can be treated as outsiders invading their scouting turf. When the latter happens, there is a misplaced loyalty to some gang land vision of manhood. But this slices in the opposite direction as well. I've had girls who wanted to "style up" their image in their uniform (leave open more than one button on a green shirt, or tie it off in a mid-riff). It's a really tough sell convincing them that loyalty to the organization should triumph loyalty to some fashionista. Although @@Scourge, I'm sure, made no comprise with her uniform, others have. Norming both groups takes time.

NJ, absolutely yes! All of them and every Eagle to come, will spend more time as an adult with the award than as a youth. (If death intervenes, I'm not sure. I'd like to think then we can get by saying, "He was an Eagle Scout" without someone interrupting the eulogy.) If they are all in e same room for some NESA event, it seems silly to have to sort out whose palms mean what based on date earned.

@@Scourge, thanks for the boots-on-the-ground viewpoint. I am speaking as a guy who who was enamored with the Swedish scouts visiting Jambo way back when .... No, sexual harassment and thievery is not scout like. The handbook makes it very clear. As doss the 5th point of the law. But Boy Scouts don't often read these pages. And they apply the law to little old ladies, but not their peers. Obviously they know that their SM's would not approve of this behavior, so they aren't going to act up when anyone they should respect is watching. So, it's up to you and your fellow venturers and any noble scout in the vicinity to call them out on this at their first uncouth action or deed. "Scout, your troop number!" Would go a long way. You were all well within your rights complaining to the scout's SM, if you or your Jambo advisor could find him. You and your advisors should write a letter to your Scout Executive and the Chief Scout Executive. And this really isn't about defending you and your friends. It's about life skills. Both yours and the scouts who behaved badly. You need the skills to build a workplace where you can do the best job you can. So do those scouts.

The reason it seems unfair, is not because there is a wrong side of the line. It's because there is a line. Some lines are intuitive. (E.g., you can't go make last century's Eagles decipher EDGE before permitting them to wear their medal again.) This one is not. An Eagle Scout with all of his cards already knows the badges he earned and when he earned them ... there is no extra work involved in ordering the award. "These twenty six were before Eagle, those 5 were three months after, the next 5 were half a year after, etc.. Please ... pass the catch-up Palm." There is just no logical reason why the change needs to be there. But if it is, there is no logical reason (aside from brute ageism) why it should apply to some Eagles and not others.

Yes. Your scout may sew on the favorite of each to his field uniform. The other ones can be sewn on the back of his MB sash or a brag best. Tell him a stranger on the Internet said so.

They do. As a recent Eagle and troop SPL, I was invited to speak at one. Actually the original invite was to lead the opening and introduce a guest ... A pro football player. The pro couldn't make it so I was asked (I think the day before) if I could fill in the time. They were very gracious to a guy just cutting his teeth at public speaking. And I learned a lot that evening from conversations with men who shared their various interests and hobbies over cocktails and sodas.

Thanks for the report! It's like history repeating itself: http://scouter.com/index.php/topic/23697-national-youth-leadership-society/ A program that some adult asked for that no youth needs and very few want. Needless to say, I favor O/A being scouting's honor society. Period.

If everyone's on board with training, start-up should go quickly. One piece of advice. Pick a meeting night different an the ones of your adjacent troops.

Few things would make me seriously consider dropping ties with BSA, mailing in my Eagle, and striking it from my resume, than BSA abandoning this practice.Of the program materials they provide, encounters with public servants is one of them. Teach boys how to handle off-color speech, that's on us.

Nice to know things haven't changed much since the 80s. I went to Jambo once and decided that I preferred rocks in the middle of nowhere alone or maybe with a buddy or two.

Lock picks don't wear a badge announcing their skill. (Not that I'd know for certain. ) Yeah, Son #1 and his posse were all scholar athletes. They didn't bother to earn Scholarship or Athletics.

I guess, because I rarely ever did structured fitness, I would not buy into this. But I could see myself helping guys who wanted to master some of these skills. But, this shows that BSA, by denying adults advancement, created a vacuum that someone else will try to fill.

Props to ship 100. Huzzah! Instead of JTE, I'd love to see an annual "best troop in the nation". In my fantasy world, the national award would start with a camp or HA base putting in your nomination on an annual basis. It could be for your troops conduct on weekend activities as well as long term activities. That creates the pool. Repeated annual nominations of your unit increases the probability of further review by an area or national team of scouts and scouters -- youth and adult commissioners, if you will. But then someone would complain that every troop should get a trophy. Now that I think of it. Summer camp used to have a "best campsite inspection" award. The prize itself amounted to a decorated tin can ... I can barely picture it. But, I was so proud when our troop earned it while I was SPL. Now it's just if your troop's site is spotless the first round of departure day inspections, you get to be first in the checkout line. Not the same feel.

Well, that's not placating anyone who wants BSA's key three to denounce the man. But, I don't look for palliatives from national. Anybody who does, I refer them to my rule #1 (don't ask for a rule). As far as I'm concerned this is between scouts and their SMs. I'm looking forward to hearing all about Jambo from the scout from our troop who's there. As the week continues, he'll have a lot more interesting stuff to go over. Hopefully it will make a positive impact on the troop (maybe even the crew) program. Part of that may or may not involve a letter or card from the troop to present or former POTUS's. His call, not mine. Other SM's and Advisors may act differently with their youth. Their call, not mine.

Praying for you all. You may want to look into the possibility of planting a tree on your CO's grounds in the lad's memory. That meant a lot to the mom when whe drove by the property. It meant a lot to me when Son #2 and his friends stood under it for a picture at his ECoH. Also, this advice from a mom at our CO: "Tell the boys to always remember the mother." Meaning, make plans to stop by the house on occasion, visit before you go off to or come back from college or war, drop of flowers. Just sit a spell and catch her up on your life. Make a commitment to do that now, so you will never forget this duty. Invite to CoH's, but understand if she declines.

As a WB crow, I will assure you that we have impeccable taste. Actually, whatever space boys may need, the one your daughter describes isn't it. The handbook makes clear that such behavior is conduct unbecoming of a scout. However, that section of the handbook is rarely read at Boy Scout meetings. In venturing, on the other hand, conduct toward the opposite sex is part of the program. We don't need to spend a lot of time on it, just enough that expectations are clear. The real problem: venturers do not feel like they are part of the program. They are not trained to expect more from these scouts. And they are often not welcomed cheerfully by scouters in camp. So, they don't feel free to take up the usual chilling phrase: "Scout, may I have a word with your SPL/SM?" (Yes, we teach all my scouts to say that. I also let them know that, when put upon, they may welcome the person to camp to discuss the issue with the SPL/SM.) Will that problem correct itself if the organization was fully co-ed at all levels? It's hard to say. I have only heard from international scouts outside of their troops. It sounds like the scouts they are with comport themselves with more courtesy. I suspect some training is involved to set the tone. I know my Italian scout simply would quote Baden Powell (back-translating from Italian) nearly verbatim when discussing how things like this were handled. But, she was very well read. I'm not sure if other scouts in her unit had the same sensibility. (I really need to talk to Mrs. Q about a visit, for investigative purposes. )

I never doubted ... stupid faith of mine. Merl, I saw a couple of posts elsewhere suggesting, in addition to asking concerned citizens to ceas contributions, that BSA should lose tax exempt status for effectively holding a partisan rally. Sounds frivolous to me.

I've asked myself the same thing.

I am no partisan. I will admit to being a bit of a hack. I see scouts at Jamborees as judges of history. If a Jamboree is successful, a scout sees something of the real character of public figures. Something they can use that as a baseline. Not necessarily of the person him/herself, but of how much time and effort one must spend listening to the full message from people and sifting through the good and the bad. Using that to decide who you want for your next leader ... you may make an effort to hear more from all parties. I think POTUS missed an opportunity: to lay out every area of concern facing the nation, and ways scouts can/are helping, to get beyond stumping for the next round of primaries and elections, and to recognize other erstwhile scouts among his political opponents. I think he did put forward: a vignette of his strategy for success (momentum, persistence), examples of cabinet members who were scouts and the challenges they currently face, his rather flawed personality. His presentation is more "intimate" than I'd like a scout to have, less than what they already get via post-modern media. As mentioned, that's good and bad. So, to quote this town's current football coach, it is what it is. But how should a concerned citizen respond? I think it is wrong to judge BSA for the behavior of a POTUS, but I am afraid that's what will happen. Democrat activists will be motivated to withdraw funds and bring suit against the organization, Republican activists will be motivated to "invest" in the organization and contribute towards any defense. This may give us smaller membership, but also ratified and polarized only making behavior at future Jambos worse.