Kudu

JMHawkins writes: I think it's easier to instill the components of being an honorable man into boys while they're doing outdoor adventure stuff than it is doing classroom work. Outdoors, especially when it's a little hike away from the trailhead, forces a little more self-reliance on the patrols, and dishonorable behavior creates more obvious problems, more quickly. You think too much like Baden-Powell and Green Bar Bill. As soon as an outdoorsman explains how Scoutcraft and backwoods Patrols teach specific virtues, the Leadership Skills mind scans its library of office management books, discards that outdoor stuff as "old-fashioned," and substitutes an indoor route to the same values, "sitting side by side with adults of character." The book Working the Patrol Method is a perfect example of a treasure trove of Baden-Powell quotes sprinkled over indoor theory. If BSA stops making what people want, the government, through the Charter, can speed that reckoning up (by enforcing it against BSA) or slow it down (by enforcing it against BSA competitors) So if we declare war on our Scoutcraft Charter and two million (2,000,000) Boy Scouts leave the BSA, the government is going to notice? If you think that Congressional regulation is better than a free market, do NOT vote for Ron Paul Yours at 300 feet, Kudu (This message has been edited by Kudu)

Is this better? "Base Ball means to make ethical and moral choices from a moral Base: to play Ball as honorable men." (This message has been edited by Kudu)

You can -- and usually do -- argue in support of the First Class Journey, 300 feet between campsites...and we are...for preaching citizenship and obedience. Yes, that neatly sums it up.

Of course these topics are not all found in the T-2-1 requirements That's the point, isn't it? The 1916 standard for the First Class mastery of Scoutcraft was the First Class Journey: The ability to navigate a 14 mile camping trip through the backwoods without adult supervision. That, by the way, is why our Charter lists "courage" and "self-reliance" as the official virtues of the 1916 program. Now any boy can get "Eagle Scout" on his business resume without ever walking into the woods with a pack on his back. "Leadership skills" enthusiasts oppose testing the mastery of Scoutcraft (or the Patrol Method) against the standard of physical distance. If instead of Scoutcraft we had a monopoly on baseball, then "leadership skills" enthusiasts would say exactly the same thing about testing "First Week Skills" against physical distance between bases: "I would say we do a pretty good job of fulfilling our monopoly charter. Weapons like wooden clubs and horsehide projectiles have no practical use in the 21st century, but we still spend a week of baseball camp signing off pitching, throwing, catching, and bating, albeit in the safety of a shooting range (in accordance with the corporate guidelines of The Guide to Safe Baseball). And why should a boy ever be required to stand at home plate, hit a ball, and round the bases? That would be retesting!" Any boy should get "World Series" on his business resume without every walking to home plate with a bat on his shoulder. Yours at 300 feet, Kudu (This message has been edited by kudu)

Eamonn writes: "Scoutcraft is making things out of Scouts. The "things" you're making generally being... honorable men." This is my kind of thinking. My point exactly. If instead of Scoutcraft we had a monopoly on baseball, then "leadership" enthusiasts would do exactly the same thing: justify the dumbing down of physical skills by re-defining their trademarked generic words as metaphors for values: "Base Ball means keeping yourself morally 'on base' in your life. Learning to 'play ball' means acting as honorable men."

Eamonn wrotes: "I have tried looking up the word Scoutcraft and there really isn't a very clear meaning to be found." That is because you have your fingers jammed into your eyes and ears: "Please don't bother trying to re-direct me to a web site that tells me what Scouts did back in 1916." The definition of Scoutcraft is found in the first chapter of Handbook for Boys ("Scoutcraft"), used in 1916. Note the similarity between the wording in the first paragraph of that Handbook and the wording that appears in the law: "The aim of the Boy Scouts is to supplement the various existing educational agencies, and to promote the ability in boys to do things for themselves and others... Scoutcraft includes instruction in First Aid, Life Saving, Tracking, Signaling, Cycling, Nature Study, Seamanship, Campcraft, Woodcraft, Chivalry, Patriotism, and other subjects." "The requirements of the tenderfoot, second-class scout, and first-class scout, are as follows:" http://inquiry.net/advancement/tf-1st_require_1911.htm The reason that militant Cub Scout Dads and Wood Badge Course Directors think that the 1916 program is "dumb" is First Class requirement 4, which tests a Boy Scout's actual master of Scoutcraft with the First Class Journey. Yours at 300 feet, Kudu (This message has been edited by kudu)

We will be camping close to Crystal River this weekend, at McGregor Smith: http://www.swfwmd.state.fl.us/recreation/areas/flying_eagle-mcgregor_smith_reservation.html Because of the low rates ($269) in Crystal River for Scuba Diving Merit Badge/Open Water Certification, some Troops include that too when they come here to swim with the Manatees: http://inquiry.net/scuba_diving_merit_badge/index.htm

I wrote: "The Congressional Charter defines (by statute) those 'exciting challenges' to be 'Scoutcraft'." Eamonn writes: "Seems to me that in one breath you and I are in agreement and then you have a change of heart and want to see things in a different light." No. I never agreed with your central premise: "It's OK for adults to ignore the law, because boys just want to have fun." The fact that you can read my rebuke and think that I agreed with you, points to ambiguity, the process by which The Methods of Scouting are used to destroy Scouting: Descriptive Ambiguity: "By definition, Scoutcraft (as defined by the 1916 program) is our brand of exciting challenges for boys." Proscriptive Ambiguity: "By definition, Scoutcraft is anything a BSA millionaire promotes as exciting challenges for boys (EDGE, soccer, and sitting in front of a computer)." "Maybe we need to look at what is meant by the word Scoutcraft?" The 1916 Program (elements removed from current program are marked in red): http://inquiry.net/advancement/tf-1st_require_1911.htm (This message has been edited by kudu)

Us bashing each other over the head and quoting things that long dead English Lords might or might not have said might be fun for us adults. Of course, Eamonn, that is your job. As Course Director your duty is to kick the Scoutcraft out of Baden-Powell's Scoutcraft course, and by your example here teach adults to hold the law in contempt: The law that defines Scoutcraft not as a mere "Method" of Scouting, but as its Purpose. Yours at 300 feet, Kudu (This message has been edited by kudu)

CA_Scouter writes: I tried to arrange one kinda like Beav indicates (only Life Scout and above), but the Committee went bonkers and emailed the District Camping Chair and I was told in no uncertain terms that we could not do so. I can understand a helicopter Troop Committee objecting even to the new Centennial Patrol Method Lite, but your District Camping Chair forbids day hikes? What kind of Committee people objected? What is the background or your District Camping Chair? Yours at 300 feet, Kudu

"For the most part Lads join to have fun and take on new and exciting challenges. They leave when they don't have fun and they become bored. " The Congressional Charter defines (by statute) those "exciting challenges" to be "Scoutcraft." The distaste with which most red-blooded American "lads" now view Boy Scouts is a perfect barometer of our "leadership skills" mission to break that law. Yours at 300 feet, Kudu

Oh, and an app that E-mails us when we are mentioned in a thread to which we are not subscribed

qwazse, That's what health & safety committees with Den Leaders trained to "understand" the Patrol Method are for

A Scout is OBEDIENT. A Scout obeys the laws of his community and country. If he thinks a statute is unfair, he calculates the likelihood it will be enforced should he disobey it.

"The leadership skills our young people learn while hiking, camping, and being stewards to the outdoors are lessons that last for a lifetime." Indeed, our CSE should be praised for promoting the BSA's four Disneyland destinations. If only his use of the term "leadership skills" signalled a reversal of its meaning since 1972: Taking away Green Bar Bill's "Intensive Training in the Green Bar Patrol" designed to teach Patrol Leaders how to organize their own hiking and camping without constant adult "association" (if only within the context of a Troop's "weekend overnight trip to a local camp"). Yours at 300 feet, Kudu "Camping is not necessarily a big thing with them, as a matter of fact in some cases it is not big at all." http://inquiry.net/leadership/sitting_side_by_side_with_adults.htm

Our only mission should be the "Three Purposes of Scouting," as set by statute in our Congressional Charter: The purposes of the corporation are to promote, through organization, and cooperation with other agencies: 1) The ability of boys to do things for themselves and others, 2) To train them in Scoutcraft, and 3) To teach them patriotism, courage, self-reliance, and kindred virtues, using the methods that were in common use by boy scouts on June 15, 1916. Yours at 300 feet, Kudu http://kudu.net

"we hope to win our first camporee in a few months." Would you please list the Camporee competitions for which you wish to prepare? Some Camporees are based on advancement skills which are best prepared for by playing Scoutcraft games: http://inquiry.net/outdoor/games/mackenzie/index.htm http://inquiry.net/outdoor/games/smith/index.htm

"a teenager posting a typical Vegas comedy routine on Facebook." Does that mean Beavah found the file? I Googled interracial comedy, but none of the YouTube results I saw were edgy enough to paste on a teenager's Facebook

I'd make him address the Troop on the subject of "Social Media and the Use of Privacy Controls in the Age of Adversarial Scout Law."

"The SM nailed this one on the head." Except for the "deep apology" thing. I wonder what the Scout's Facebook privacy settings are? Crossramwedge, what is the file name on YouTube?

Don't forget the original PLT (Patrol Leader Training) syllabus, Green Bar Bill's "Intensive Training in the Green Bar Patrol" http://inquiry.net/patrol/green_bar/index.htm And the Patrol Leader Training Course at Gilwell (England): http://inquiry.net/patrol/gilwell/index.htm

Scoutfish writes: people are still joining up from cub scouts to crossing over to Boy Scouts The fact Boy Scout recruitment is limited to Cub Scout survivors should tell you something about the appeal of our monopoly product, Scoutfish. The numbers could be much higher. 28% of non-Scouting sixth-grade boys will register with the BSA if you describe it like the Scoutcraft Adventure program of 1916. http://inquiry.net/adult/recruiting.htm Scoutfish writes: If BSA was really that horrible, the membership numbers would be ZERO. We need a Free Market Merit Badge In a government imposed monopoly the only choice is between: A) Inferior Product or B) Nothing. When the BSA declared war on Scoutcraft in 1972, two million Boy Scouts left the BSA. In a free market two of their choices would have been: A) BSA Program: (Schoolwork + Office Success Formulas + Non-required "The Fun Stuff" Scoutcraft). or B) Baden-Powell Program: (100% "The Fun Stuff" Scoutcraft). Yours in the 300 foot Tea Party Kudu "Free Markets, Free Minds"

The fed is not going to step in to enforce the statue-defined mission... nor should we wish for federal involvement in such a thing. Maybe we can get the Tea Party to spearhead the repeal of socialized Scouting: The fed's imposition on all Americans of one monopoly Scout corporation in exchange for the statute-defined preservation of Scoutcraft. Let the free market decide if Scoutcraft is defined by the First Class Journey or the EDGE method. Yours at 300 feet, Kudu http://inquiry.net/advancement/1st_class_requirements.htm

"No offense Cross, but if you weren't asked by the SM to run interference you had no business talking to the DE" I'm with Crossramwedge on that. Except for the coerced apology, it sounds like both he and the SM understand that this about Boy Scout led vs. parent led. I once saw a DE (an Eagle Scout) help control-freak parents dumb a boy-led Scout Troop down to the Cub Scout level behind the Eagle Scout SM's back. If the DE is talking to the parents, I'd want to hear firsthand what he is saying. Crossramwedge, would you please answer my question about the file? Is this just something from the Internet for which the SPL provided a link on Facebook? If so, what is the original file name or URL? Yours at 300 feet, Kudu (This message has been edited by kudu)

As it turns out, he decided that he really doesn't want to leave the Troop and his friends, even if it means giving up on Eagle. He's a great kid and I'm humbled that he thought to ask my advice earlier this month. Back before POR advancement requirements were invented, his bearing was called the Spirit of Scouting: The natural result of the influence of competent Scoutcraft and the "Real" Patrol Method on a boy's character. If this Life Scout is a Natural Leader, then he probably has already been acting like an Assistant Scoutmaster. Just as active as some of the adult leaders. If not JASM, then a good SPL will be able to suggest how a Natural Leader has already been informally acting as a Troop Guide, Instructor, Webmaster, or what-ever. So the "December 12th deadline" has NOT passed, except in the minds of Game of Life enthusiasts. That's how the Patrol Method worked before office management began to cast its cold shadow on Scouting in 1965. Before then, leadership was like the Scout Spirit requirement, something that a Natural Leader was doing all along without an official "appointment" date. You know, like advancement is supposed happen naturally with regular camping. Is that so hard to understand? If so, do you have official Scout Spirit dates? The date on which you (as a leadership expert) tell each Boy Scout that he needs only live the Scout Law for six months so that it "counts" toward his next rank? To avoid this Playskool Democracy crises in the future, simply eliminate regular Troop-wide elections and get rid of the ASPLs (except to Peter Principle an incompetent PL). In other words, return to Green Bar Bill's Patrol Method: 1) Talk to each Natural Leader separately and ask him to run for, or stay on as Patrol Leader (or SPL, if you have one). 2) If a Patrol needs a new Patrol Leader for some reason, then only that Patrol needs to "hold an election" (and only after the Scoutmaster meets with that Patrol individually to talk about what makes a good Patrol Leader). 3) In the "Real" Patrol Method, the SPL is appointed by the Patrol Leaders. If you must elect a new SPL (or have one at all), then do so separately from Patrol elections and POR appointments. 4) During every Scoutmaster Conference with a Scout First Class and above (who is NOT a Natural Leader), walk the Scout over to the SPL and work out a POR before the SM Conference concludes (or appoint him as a JASM yourself). Easy Peasy. Yours at 300 feet, Kudu