John-in-KC

Lisa, I'm going to beg to differ with Oak Tree. My camp offers Weather MB in the Ecology Lodge. If you look at requirement 8, this merit badge has things you cannot do at camp, to wit: - (extract 8a) Keep a daily weather log for 1 week using information from this instrument as well as from other sources such as local radio and television stations or NOAA Weather Radio. - (extract 8b) Visit a National Weather Service office or talk with a local radio or television weathercaster, private meteorologist, local agricultural Extension service office, or university meteorology instructor. To meet either of these requirements demands outside work. The Scout, and his parent, have two choices: a) Do the work so the MB can be completed at camp. b) Don't do the work and get a partial. I'd look at the SPL and the appropriate PLs, along with the Troop Scribe, to be the ones responsible for monitoring advancement from the time Scouts sign up until they roll out the parking lot for camp. Of course, that means the Scribe has to be with you when you work with Scout to develop their lists, or you/he have to exchange some email, depending on how your Troop tracks signups. My thoughts. Others will differ. That's ok.

At the Council level, Scouting IS a business. Granted, it's supposed to be a non-profit business, but it is a business. As such, when the Council drafts its budget, the reasonable and prudent man would anticipate revenues. He would anticipate those revenues based on a thorough understanding of business rules and practices. He would not anticipate revenues that are based on flawed and faulty assumptions. The Council "user fee" was based on a flawed and faulty assumption; it's PROHIBITED by National. I'm a COR. I expect my council to act judiciously and prudently in the stewardship of its accounts. As I have said several times before in this thread, if I were in this Council, I would be working to gather enough other CORs to force a business meeting, a vote of No Confidence in the current Executive Board, and demanding a forensic audit. Something is rotten in Monmouth County, New Jersey. I'd certainly want a detailed line audit of FOS Family and FOS business receipts, as well as Popcorn receipts.

One cool thing was Mom was my Den Mother :) Dad was active as Troop Treasurer when I moved up to the Troop. Best part of it all is they're both still around as my son works his Eagle project and, after 3 years of J-staffing district Cub Day Camp, he's been hired for the Ecology Lodge in Camp Piercing Arrow, H Roe Bartle Scout Reservation

Text graphics here didn't work IF THIS IS THE WALL BEHIND THE ALTAR then US flag ................. other flags ....here ..........................here For the march into the Sanctuary, from left to right: escort Scout other flag 1 other flag 2 National Color escort Scout Many aisles are too narrow to support 5 abreast ... use a point man escort, then US Color, then other flags, then a trail escort in single file(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

I was a Cub Scout from my 8th birthday to the Pack meeting before my 11th birthday... that was 1964 to fall of 1967. Bobcat was a pin. Wolf, Bear and Lion were ranks. Webelos didn't mean "we'll be loyal Scouts" ... it meant Wolf, Bear, Lion, Scout. I have my last uniform shirt (Pack 194, Reseda, CA) ... and I'm darned glad I do The Webelos Program, to include the Webelos Den, rolled out as I was going through to Scouting. That would be spring and summer of 1967. So much of remembered history. Of course, back then BSA Supply Corporation did not sell new neckerchiefs every elevation. Ditto hats. I had my yellow neckerchief all the way from Cubs to Boy Scouts.

From the article OGE posted: "In fact, Frank Davidson, chairman of the Camping Committee, said at that meeting that the council has already budgeted for the $390,000 it expects to receive if each of the county's 7,937 Boy Scouts pay the $52 fee." Anticipating money not yet in the bank, are we? That's the same logic that has this Council borrowing for the basic bills!!!! If I was a COR in this council, or a Chartered Partner Executive Officer, I'd sure want to see the results of the previous years' Friends of Scouting campaign. I reiterate my comments earlier: It's time and past time for a forensic audit of this Council. Something isn't right...

I took my wood badge in the next Council north. Do not get me wrong, the friendships I have from my own Council are deep. That said, other folks have different experiences and different perspectives. My Scouting network is broader, the resources I have are greater, and the friendships I've made are worth it! I'd actually advocate going out-of-Council for WB. YIS, John A Good Old Owl Too C-40-05

In August, our District RT has an "ice cream social" night. We don't conduct business, we get together and have an evening of fellowship. November, we do a Scouters Chili Cookoff. It's a fun thing, but two years running my crockpot has gone home empty. We do have a "crackerbarrel corner." A couple of our staffers sell mini-tacos, hot dogs, pizza slices. We have some folks who come straight from work to RT, and it helps them keep going into the night. We sell at cost. The money has been in place for a while that this takes care of itself. Finally, we brew coffee and cocoa in the cold months, and lemonade in the warm. HTH.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

Something smells here ... rotten. If I was a COR in the Monmouth Area Council, I'd be on the phone to the Council President, demanding a forensic audit. Depending on the results of that audit, I might well call for a general business meeting of the Council, with the agenda being a motion for a vote of No Confidence in the Executive Board and the Scout Executive. A Council Executive Board isn't a bunch of children playing with plastic blocks. If it's anything like my council's board, there are businessmen from all aspects of life on it. They ALL have one requirement in their day jobs: Make the money needed to open the doors tomorrow. Where were they in all this? The article Fred Goodwin posted noted "Lee Marconi, who took over as the council's executive director Oct. 1, said several building projects at Scout camps were underfunded because some anticipated financial backing didn't materialize. He also said the council relied too heavily on borrowing to pay the bills. That fiscal mismanagement has proved costly." Who authorized turning a single shovel of dirt before the funding was locked in? Who authorized borrowing to pay the basic bills? I'd be recommending to my IH: "Let's look at other area Councils for the next charter." As far as the "user fee" goes, I'd be telling the Council President I'll consider paying it when I see the Executive Board opening their personal checkbooks to the tune of $252,000. Malfeasance? Misfeasance? Non-feasance? It's time to let the forensic accountants come in. This Council needs a clean bill of management health, and it won't get it with a $52 a kid over-fee.

Lisa, Here's another site, though it doesn't quite cover what you asked: http://www.woodbadge.org/index.htm I think the rules on the WB neckerchief and beads are in the Uniform Guide. John A Good Old Owl too (Got another ticket item set up last weekend)

Fishsqueezer, From my perspective, much of the course CONTENT you've probably had either as an undergrad or grad student. Leadership psychology hasn't changed much in the past 25 years. OTOH, what cajuncody and Lisabob said about the NETWORKING is spot on!!! You will see several different perspectives about Scouting from your patrol mates, and you will meet lifelong friends when you join your patrol. Equally, what Fred Goodwin said about the service woodbadgers do to complete the course is absolutely spot on. I don't think many of us will brag ... we just want a better Scouting program for the youth we serve, and we're stepping up to the plate to commit to that concept across the years to come. Trust me, the course is worth your time.

Unlike the Beavers, who seemed to enjoy Narnia simply because their critters are major characters, I enjoyed it for the message CS Lewis put into it!!! OTOH, Any OWL knows that the Harry Potter movies were specially produced for us OWLs.... John A Good Old Owl Too C-40-05 (ducking and running)

I've used it as an ACM, as a Cub CC, and as a CM/CC in a boy scout troop. I know a Scout camp reservation staff that uses it whenever the PD uses the dreaded A word. Announcements, Announcements, Announce....ments! What a horrible way to die, What a horrible way to die, Being bored to tears by a grown-up leader, What a horrible way to die. We skipped the 2d verse in Cubbing, but use it in the Troop. Have you ever seen a Windbag, a Windbag, a Windbag? Have you ever seen a Windbag, oh there's one right there... He blows this way and that way and that way and this way, Oh, Have you ever seen a Windbag, oh, he's up right now. Words of wisdom, words of wisdom, coming now, coming now... Boring words of wisdom, boring words of wisdom, Time to sleep, time to sleep. Keeping it simple, making it fun, leaving the public service messages to some other forum than a Pack meeting helps! John A Good Old Owl Too...

As I read mbscoutmom's post, one thought came to mind: We've all heard "Every Scout deserves a trained leader." I submit: "Every Scout deserves an assistant leader trained and ready to step up to full leadership." We live in a mobile society. People can and are relocated from their jobs on short notice. Sadly, bad things can and do happen to good people. Those bad things can be as transient as having to provide elder care for their own parents, or as permanent as ... death. Being "one man deep on the depth chart" in any given area risks confusion should the primary leave the picture for any reason. The backup doesn't have to be "another new person," although with some jobs it should be, so there is ongoing renewal of leaders. It simply should be "another person," who is willing to learn and be ready "just in case." Returning to Lisa's initial post, if the Scouter in question is suitable and a contributor/supporter, then by all means let him or her step up to the plate. Too much fun is never enough

To GreenEagle.... From my districts' experience, following trainings work very well in the roundtable environment: - New Leader Essentials Common Core (the stuff that all of us take across the 3 programs). - Youth protection for Cub Scouting and Boy Scouting (Venturing has a different and specialized package for YP). - Merit Badge Counselor training. Again, from experience, position specific training does not work so well at RT. - The biggest reason for this is you need SPECIALISTS ... the guy who handles SM fundamentals may not be the gal who handles Troop Committee Challenge, who may not be the gal who handles Cub Pack Leadership, who may not be the guy who handles Tiger Cub Leader. - A secondary reason is competition for space and time. Yes, your commish is planning breakouts for these trainings, but most of the trainings I've been to take 2 to 2 1/2 hours for a session. Additionally, Roundtable has specific purpose in the adult support program: - It introduces the theme for the program 2 months out, giving first line leaders good ideas. - It allows informal cross-fertilization amongst experienced and newer program leaders. - In our District, it allows unit-serving leaders one stop shopping for any support the District can provide. Each District operating committee, the Commissioner's service, and the professionals are on hand to support that leader in the unit. Just some thoughts. SOME position specific trainings may work at RT: I recently took COR training. The other side of that coin was a small group of experienced Scouters, so we could blast through some of the information, and dig in where needed. Let us know how well position specific training at RT works out. YIS.

Congratulations Chipmunk! John An Owl, working his ticket...

Ohadam, First, welcome to the forums. Second, eligibility requirements for the Order are NOT 2% of the youth population. They are: - First Class Scout - 15 Days and Nights of Camping -- 7 days/nights of which at a long term camp. - Shows Scout spirit in his Troop and outside lives (serves cheefully) - Is elected by his peers. It is the honor camping society of the Boy Scouts of America, but the honor is based on peer interaction, not on a set percentage. If your unit elects all eligible youth to enter, great! If not, I've found youth to be pretty good evaluators of their peers. The Order provides extensive leadership, artistic and creative talent opportunities ... far beyond what almost ANY Troop can provide. Hands on leadership, interaction beyond the local patrol and troop, and adult association with folks up to the Council camping committee and the Scout Executive all come with the Order. Look at the Order as another retention enhancement, particularly for older youth who have "been there and done that" in the Troop long enough.

Brothers in Cheerful Service, Those of us here at ScoutNet have seen the announcement about the new national OA software back last month. The youth leaders of my Lodge are making preparations for the transition. The membership advisors have gathered a small team of computer literate youth and adults to pull data from ScoutNet, preparing to validate and update Lodge records. We've encountered some interesting challenges, and I want to share them with you, so you can Be Prepared!!!: 1) The first data dump the professionals can give us seems only to pull dues-paid Arrowmen in the current or previous year. While that should give you a 90%+ cut, it won't catch all the folks wearing flaps from years gone by. 2) Data entry is not of the highest quality. We have, literally, dozens of members who had their Ordeal on a certain date. Only one problem: That date is months away from ANY Ordeal our lodge conducts. 3) For transfers into the area (as opposed to folks who grew up in the local council and lodge), data entry is spotty. Many known Arrowmen do not any of their critical dates entered. Our solution was to send out a note on our various district list-servs, with a data call from units: Have OATRs bring to chapter meetings a data dump from Troopmaster (or whatever unit software they use), or a hand-built list if the unit is still on hardcopy records. Put the responsibility back on the youth, where it properly belongs. I hope this helps you. In Cheerful Service, John

Two years ago, our day camp was $45 for the week. Things my day camp directors and PDs did to get the cost down: 1) We buy bulk craft materials and assemble craft activity kits ourselves. 2) We buy bulk plywood, and set up a "cutting factory" to make our wood project kits. Likewise, we buy construction size (50lb) boxes of screws and nails. 3) Seek donations of materials. We fill our first aid activity stocks by having Scouter docs hit up the pharaceutical reps for all kinds of stuff. We wash our food purchases for the cooking activity through a local restaurant, who provides us goods at their costs. 4) Our council competitively awards its annual T-shirt contract for all programs. Amazing when you start talking about 10s of thousands of T-shirts, how fast the cost comes down (even though an individual day camp run may only be 500 to 1000). Hope all this helps.

Beavers, overly enthusiastic.... They forget about the 7 other patrols between them and the Staff Ya gotta wait for the Buffalo and the Antelope before you can do the staff gig.

I could make a case that you should report the Cubmaster and his wife to your SE on a youth protection violation. Following is from G2SS: "The Boy Scouts of America takes great pride in the quality of our adult leadership. Being a leader in the BSA is a privilege, not a right. The quality of the program and the safety of our youth members call for high-quality adult leaders. We work closely with our chartered organizations to help recruit the best possible leaders for their units. "Proper preparation for high-adventure activities. Activities with elements of risk should never be undertaken without proper preparation, equipment, clothing, supervision, and safety measures." (Again, boldface is mandatory) Proper preparation and supervision means following SSD/SA. Your CM isn't. You're a beaded Wood Badger. You know what he's doing is wrong. Give him feedback one on one. If he fails to listen, talk with your fellow patrol members, TG, and WB SM. I'll bet they'll tell you to consider reporting this couple to your SE.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

Congratulations to your son!! Once again, an old adage comes true: If you don't think children know what is going on, think again. They do connect the dots. The measure of your Troop Committee is how well they use their listening skills and take precise, targeted feedback (it's a gift!) to heart.

Content deleted as duplicated. If a mod sees this post, go ahead and kill it.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

Lisa'Bob, you're soon going to be our Cub Guru!!! That's the best description of the concept of Cub day camp I've ever heard: "I'd take the rank books, pull some fun things out of the requirements and/or arrow point electives, maybe pick out a couple of fun beltloops, and start thinking of daycamp kind of like one big den meeting." From my experience... FIRST AID compass/orienteering course. We made posters of basic Cub 1st Aid tasks, under plastic. Put them on signs, and surveyed in the course (accurate directions and distance). Some of the stations had materials for a hands-on 1st aid task. Whole course was not more than a 1/2 mile, and could be done pretty easily in a program hour. CUB GRUB always goes over well. Do things Cubs can easily do, and some things parents can do for Cubs: - Camp (hobo) stew. - Biscuits on a stick (mix in baggies) (coat in cinnamon sugar after baking). - Foil dinners. - S'mores. - For the adults, show how to make dutch oven cobblers. 2 ovens feed 40 kids/leaders. Wood Craft: We use a 5 year rotation: Bench/stool, toolbox, windvane are the 3 that come off my head. BBs and Archery are so popular we schedule kids through them twice in a week. Water baloon tosses always go over well on hot summer days. Rope making and knot tying.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

Safe Swim Defense and Safety Afloat apply even when the parent accompanies the Cub. From G2SS: "For Cub Scouts: Canoeing, rowboating, and rafting for Cub Scouts (including Webelos Scouts) is to be limited to council/district events on flat water ponds or controlled lake areas free of powerboats and sailboats. Prior to recreational canoeing, Cub Scouts are to be instructed in basic handling skills and safety practices." This is boldface in the guide, and thus is MANDATORY. The Cubmaster is completely outside BSA policy. Any accident will come back to haunt him personally. Encourage him to cease and desist immediately. Consider contacting your SE.