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Eagle94-A1

Going Too Far: Online Outdoor Orientation

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Apparently the Great Rivers Council has decided to do online outdoor training that covers BALOO, WeLOT ( which is now combined with BALOO) and ItOLS. This is too far.

 

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Unless National Training Chair gives a blessing to, i don't see how in the world this can count.  We're waiting to hear if the OA is going to give some flex on virtual ceremonies, as we are already getting asked about that... I just roll my eyes on why we would/should ever take an optional program and rip it to shreds rather than wait 2-3 months to hold weekend events.

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1 hour ago, HashTagScouts said:

Unless National Training Chair gives a blessing to, i don't see how in the world this can count.  We're waiting to hear if the OA is going to give some flex on virtual ceremonies, as we are already getting asked about that... I just roll my eyes on why we would/should ever take an optional program and rip it to shreds rather than wait 2-3 months to hold weekend events.

Here's the deal, National has already stated online outdoor training is not allowed, yet A) they are jumping into it and B) People are ecstatic about it.

 

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48 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

Here's the deal, National has already stated online outdoor training is not allowed, yet A) they are jumping into it and B) People are ecstatic about it.

 

How come they suggest you do the online portion of BALOO prior to doing the practical portion? 

Outdoor Skills Training Courses

These courses are designed to help Scouters with skills related to the BSA’s outdoor program.

Cub Scouts IconBasic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation (BALOO)

This one-and-a-half day course is designed as an introduction to the Cub Scout outdoor program for leaders interested in adding a camping component to their Pack activities. BALOO training consists of an online pre-requisite component in addition to an overnight hands on practical. BSA’s Cub Scout level camping policies will be taught along with the discovery of the necessary tools to help units carry our a successful camping experience. Completion of this course is mandatory for a MINIMUM OF ONE adult on a Pack overnighter.

This course should not be taught with IOLS. As part of a two-part blended learning format, the on-line modules are the first step to become BALOO trained. The on-line training modules contain introductory and basic information that will be built upon during the practical training that is completed during an in-person, council instructed course. The on-line component must be completed prior to the practical component and the course facilitator should check this before allowing enrollment into this part of the course. The in-person syllabus is facilitated by the council training committee and the syllabus must be followed to include the overnight portion of the training. Otherwise the training code will not be awarded.

 

Been a while since I was the training person and in cub scouts so I have not re upped my BALOO training.

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9 hours ago, HashTagScouts said:

  We're waiting to hear if the OA is going to give some flex on virtual ceremonies, as we are already getting asked about that...

Aw heavens no...they've already extended the candidacy window from 1 to 2 years (which, given the circumstances seems reasonable) ; surely by then there will be opportunities for in-person.

 

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8 hours ago, Jackdaws said:

How come they suggest you do the online portion of BALOO prior to doing the practical portion? 

Outdoor Skills Training Courses

These courses are designed to help Scouters with skills related to the BSA’s outdoor program.

Cub Scouts IconBasic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation (BALOO)

This one-and-a-half day course is designed as an introduction to the Cub Scout outdoor program for leaders interested in adding a camping component to their Pack activities. BALOO training consists of an online pre-requisite component in addition to an overnight hands on practical. BSA’s Cub Scout level camping policies will be taught along with the discovery of the necessary tools to help units carry our a successful camping experience. Completion of this course is mandatory for a MINIMUM OF ONE adult on a Pack overnighter.

This course should not be taught with IOLS. As part of a two-part blended learning format, the on-line modules are the first step to become BALOO trained. The on-line training modules contain introductory and basic information that will be built upon during the practical training that is completed during an in-person, council instructed course. The on-line component must be completed prior to the practical component and the course facilitator should check this before allowing enrollment into this part of the course. The in-person syllabus is facilitated by the council training committee and the syllabus must be followed to include the overnight portion of the training. Otherwise the training code will not be awarded.

 

Been a while since I was the training person and in cub scouts so I have not re upped my BALOO training.

I have not taught the new BALOO course yet; the one I was suppose to help teach was cancelled due to the pandemic.  As stated above, to cut down on time in the field, some of the stuff that use to be done at camp, is now done online. Hopefully it is the planning and paperwork aspect.

 

But the council I cited is doing BOTH ( emphasis) BALOO ( which now includes WeLOT) and ItOLS, which  national does not want us combining, into a completely online course, which national has prohibited. Further If I understand the council correctly, you get certified for BALOO and ItOLS in 6 hours?!?!?!?!?

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10 hours ago, Jackdaws said:

How come they suggest you do the online portion of BALOO prior to doing the practical portion? 

Outdoor Skills Training Courses

These courses are designed to help Scouters with skills related to the BSA’s outdoor program.

Cub Scouts IconBasic Adult Leader Outdoor Orientation (BALOO)

This one-and-a-half day course is designed as an introduction to the Cub Scout outdoor program for leaders interested in adding a camping component to their Pack activities. BALOO training consists of an online pre-requisite component in addition to an overnight hands on practical. BSA’s Cub Scout level camping policies will be taught along with the discovery of the necessary tools to help units carry our a successful camping experience. Completion of this course is mandatory for a MINIMUM OF ONE adult on a Pack overnighter.

This course should not be taught with IOLS. As part of a two-part blended learning format, the on-line modules are the first step to become BALOO trained. The on-line training modules contain introductory and basic information that will be built upon during the practical training that is completed during an in-person, council instructed course. The on-line component must be completed prior to the practical component and the course facilitator should check this before allowing enrollment into this part of the course. The in-person syllabus is facilitated by the council training committee and the syllabus must be followed to include the overnight portion of the training. Otherwise the training code will not be awarded.

 

Been a while since I was the training person and in cub scouts so I have not re upped my BALOO training.

My "home" council offered Baloo credit for taking a slightly modified IOLS for at least fifteen years.  The modification consists of adding thee sessions to cover Baloo topics otherwise not covered, or covered well enough, in OLS.  The troop scouters usually voluntarily took those sessions too.  This credit for training did not mean that Baloo was not offered as well.  

Under our latest SE, training has been greatly deemphasized, forcing Scouters to obtain basic and "other" training in neighboring councils.  Those council's training teams are very welcoming of more "business."  Those councils are also doing better in all the metrics so loved by BSA as well as doing better in offering Scouting to youth.

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I am a part of the GRC, if this is truly prohibited by national could you give me a source that says so? Not saying I don’t believe you, or that I even agree with this training being given online. I ask them about this and here is the answer I was given:

 

BFC1FA7B-9502-407C-BDC1-F149B0F92984.jpeg

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so now we are pencil-whipping scouters with training. makes sense. 😢

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On 4/17/2020 at 12:13 PM, Eagle94-A1 said:

Apparently the Great Rivers Council has decided to do online outdoor training that covers BALOO, WeLOT ( which is now combined with BALOO) and ItOLS. This is too far.

 

Looks like the Brady Bunch...Wood Badge Edition 😀

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Posted (edited)

How to build a fire pitch a tent, cook over an open fire, use woods tools, take a nature walk - indoors.  Truly an awful "idea" - to insult the concept of an idea.  💣

Edited by TAHAWK
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4 hours ago, jpb6583 said:

I am a part of the GRC, if this is truly prohibited by national could you give me a source that says so? Not saying I don’t believe you, or that I even agree with this training being given online. I ask them about this and here is the answer I was given:

 

BFC1FA7B-9502-407C-BDC1-F149B0F92984.jpeg

With all due respect, either the person responding has not read the posts on Facebook that link to national's prohibition to online outdoor training, is ignoring the posts with the link, or is not following the first point of the Scout law.  Give me a day to find the document. 

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Posted (edited)

INTERESTING. The updated COVID-19 FAQ removed the prohibition on online BALOO and IOLS, but kept the prohibition on online WFA. I wonder why they kept the physical WFA class, bunt allow online outdoor training classes?

 

I also found it interesting that the post on Boy Scout Volunteers Facebok page also is not longer able to be found.

 

EDITED: looks like I am going to have to print out BSA publications again. 

Edited by Eagle94-A1

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@Eagle94-A1

I read the FAQ, twice, and found nothing about adult leader training except the WFA stuff. Can you post a link to where you found the info for BALOO/IOLS?

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Posted (edited)
4 hours ago, jpb6583 said:

@Eagle94-A1

I read the FAQ, twice, and found nothing about adult leader training except the WFA stuff. Can you post a link to where you found the info for BALOO/IOLS?

As I stated, it was in the original Late March/early April COVID-19 FAQ. When this training was first posted on the Boy Scout Volunteers Facebook Group, many people provided links and screen captures of the prohibition. Further your council was addressed in some of those posts that National did not allow.

But as you noted, the Updated 4-13-2020 COVID-19 FAQ no longer lists that prohibition. Further the original post on the Boy Scout Volunteers Facebook Group, as well as all the commentary, links and screen captures of the prohibition have been removed. In fact in the quick online search I have done, no prohibition can now be found.

So I guess the National Training Committee now approves of online outdoor training.

 

An aside, why do I feel National BSA is turning into 1984's Ministry of Truth. First ignoring the Eagle Palm survey they did. Then stating dodgeball has never been an approved activity, when it was a recommended game in Scoutmaster and troop planning resources from as early as 1929 up until the prohibition was enacted, (and yes National was asked repeatedly to remove the incorrect FAQ response, even after showing the it was indeed an approved game USING A SCREEN CAPTURE FROM SCOUTING.ORG WEBSITE, [emphasis). Now the online outdoor training.

Edited by Eagle94-A1

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