acco40

Ufortunately, the bar for having a child is quite low. The bar for raising a child is quite high. All those who have chosen to adopt didn't necessarily chose not to have a child "biologically."

Scoutfish - do I detect a double standard with respect to the religious / reverent requirements for this case (the they're just kids argument) to the bile that seems to be emitted from so many to boys who don't measure up the Eagle Scout?

Mine is bigger than yours! Clinton Valley Council and the Detroit Area Council were merged into a new council on October 1, 2009 creating the Great Lakes Council. Truthfully, I have no clue on membership numbers.

As a hiring manager in the engineering field, we do not hire engineers anymore that do not have a degree. Earning a degree is not a job guarantee. However, it does show a prospective employer that the student was able to overcome at least one obstacle - getting a degree. Some are easy to obtain, others not so much. Granted, it is easier for some than others due to intelligence, drive, motivation, money, etc. I also know that what makes a good student does not always make a good employee. For example, working in teams is call cheating or plagurism in school and studiously working alone is called being uncooperative at work. (This message has been edited by acco40)

Maybe it's a matter of interpretation, but to me "the end justifies the means" leaves no grey area. Thus my opposition.

Beavah, I agree that taxing gasoline would help pay for the "real cost" but the problem is there is no guarantee or even lukewarm assurances that the revenues raised would be used to help alleviate those "costs." Reminds me of how the lottery was sold. Nevertheless, I propose the following (based on WWII rationing). Give single adults who pay taxes, a gasoline debit card which entitles them to buy up to 5 gal per week of gasoline at a limited or no tax rate. Give married adults slightly more (not double). Increase the federal taxes on gasoline tremendously to help pay alleviate our impending infrastructure collapse. This would influence behavior, raise revenue for a good cause and create jobs by creating an underground illegal market of debit card selling/fraud! In the early 1970's there was growing interest in what are termed, 'bottle bills', or legislation that places a minimum deposit on those non-returnable containers. A few states actually adopted these and you can see their abbreviations on many containers. - Packsaddle Not only states! When I was in school, the city of Columbia (home to the University of Missouri) enacted a bottle bill. The state did not have one. I think it was 5 a bottle/can. So you can see cheap college students driving a little farther to save 30 for a six pack with gasoline around 80/gal. Right now, Michigan has a 10 per bottle/can on carbonated drinks (beer/soda pop) but none for water, tea, sports drinks, etc. That will probably change soon.(This message has been edited by acco40)

Beavah and Eagledad - why do you fell it necessary to label something as liberal or conservative? It easier to make pejorative comments, I guess.

Why is everything based on political affiliation? Republican Peter King, chairmen of the Homeland Security Committe, stated that waterboarding proved pivotal to "smoking out" bin Laden. Democrat, Dianne Feinstein, chair of the Senate Intelligence Committee, stated that none of the intelligence that led the CIA to bin Laden's hideaway came as a result of harsh interrogation practices. The National Security Council stated that if they had "smoking gun" intelligence from waterboarding in 2003, the US would have taken out bin Laden in 2003. They stated that it took years of collection and analysis from many different sources to enable them to find bin Laden's compound. I'm not in the camp of the ends justify the means. I'm sure that brutal interrogation methods produced useful (and not useful - some will say anything to make pain stop) information but I agree with the current administration that condemns (at least publically) it's use. What if the CIA had found bin Laden's wife and children in the compound and not Osama himself? Is it justified to take one of bin Laden's children, point a gun to their head and demand information on bin Laden's whereabouts from his wife - regardless if the child was really going to be shot or not? paraphrased from: http://www.freep.com/article/20110505/COL04/105050496/Brian-Dickerson-Osama-bin-Laden-s-death-does-not-validate-torture (This message has been edited by acco40)

Is it only me or others that think it is weird that considering the times today, the first medal of honor recipients were awarded to those that hijacked the predominant mode of transportation of the day, deep in the enemy's country - bound for destruction. Where have we seen that scenario before?

Yes, as parents, it is our duty to show that our physical capabilities allow us to hit, move, belittle, shame and threaten those who give us displeasure. My problem as a Scoutmaster was that with many of the older Scouts, I did not have that physical advantage. So my solution was to recruit new SAs based on height, weight and muscle mass. In fact, if we do this correctly, we will serve as role models for the youth and if were smart, use non-aged based patrols so the 16-17 year old patrol leaders can use the same leadership skills we practice to keep their patrol mates functioning at peak efficiency. Okay, now to be serious, as Scouters with direct youth contact, one thing we need to emphasize is a safe environment. Only if immediate safety was a concern would I physically interfere with another Scout in a violent manner. If I had a "small creature" terrorist in my midst, I would simply state to that Scout that his behavior was not allowed. No big lecture, no immediate punishment but I set expectations and would state very clearly that the consequences for action A is consequence B. Something like - if you gratuitously kill small creatures you will be removed from an outing (or whatever) and then I would make sure that I follow through. Now, I can kill a mosquito but pelting a squirrel with a rock is not okay? I can put a worm on a hook and jab that hook through the "lips" of a fish but stomping on the head of a garter snake is not? It can be confusing to children (and adults) who seem to have arbitrary "rules" but nonetheless, the important lesson is that the Scouts are given expectations (reasonable ones hopefully) and they should strive to live up to them. I have had limited training in human behavior and not having empathy for other living creatures is one of the warning signs for anti-social behavior and a host of other mental illnesses.

Think of it this way - everything that the Scout has control over must be done before he is recognized as an adult.

I thought the vast majority of Scouters would already have this information but as a public service ... It is really difficult for either straight/gay or if you prefer hetero/homo-sexual males to have children. It is fairly easy for most straight/gay females to have children. I think most can figure that one out.

The National Day of Prayer chairmen makes it a decidedly National Day of Christian Prayer. Remember when our President was running for office all the internet postings about how he was going to get rid of or not endorse this event? NOW, THEREFORE, I, BARACK OBAMA, President of the United States of America, do hereby proclaim May 5, 2011, as a National Day of Prayer. I invite all citizens of our Nation, as their own faith or conscience directs them, to join me in giving thanks for the many blessings we enjoy, and I ask all people of faith to join me in asking God for guidance, mercy, and protection for our Nation. IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I have hereunto set my hand this twenty-ninth day of April, in the year of our Lord two thousand eleven, and of the Independence of the United States of America the two hundred and thirty-fifth. BARACK OBAMA

Seriously? I thought the Joker went to a plastic surgeon and turned his life around. My favorite movie quote of all time? Dupea: I'd like a plain omelette, no potatoes, tomatoes instead, a cup of coffee, and wheat toast. Waitress: No substitutions. Dupea: What do you mean? You don't have any tomatoes? Waitress: Only what's on the menu. You can have a number two - a plain omelette. It comes with cottage fries and rolls. Dupea: Yeah, I know what it comes with. But it's not what I want. Waitress: Well, I'll come back when you make up your mind. Dupea: Wait a minute. I have made up my mind. I'd like a plain omelette, no potatoes on the plate, a cup of coffee, and a side order of wheat toast. Waitress: I'm sorry, we don't have any side orders of toast...an English muffin or a coffee roll. Dupea: What do you mean you don't make side orders of toast? You make sandwiches, don't you? Waitress: Would you like to talk to the manager? Dupea: ...You've got bread and a toaster of some kind? Waitress: I don't make the rules. Dupea: OK, I'll make it as easy for you as I can. I'd like an omelette, plain, and a chicken salad sandwich on wheat toast, no mayonnaise, no butter, no lettuce. And a cup of coffee. Waitress: A number two, chicken sal san, hold the butter, the lettuce and the mayonnaise. And a cup of coffee. Anything else? Dupea: Yeah. Now all you have to do is hold the chicken, bring me the toast, give me a check for the chicken salad sandwich, and you haven't broken any rules. Waitress: You want me to hold the chicken, huh? Dupea: I want you to hold it between your knees. Waitress: Do you see that sign, sir? Yes, you'll all have to leave. I'm not taking any more of your smartness and sarcasm. Dupea: You see this sign? [He sweeps all the water glasses and menus off the table]

And be sure to be Cheerful when buying that $4.20/gal gasoline for your SUV for transporting your troop trailer!

I don't give a damn about some stinking lowlife terrorist life. If killing 100 of them saves one servicemans life then so friggin be it. If what you call torture saves lives then good. Go join the bleeding hearts somewhere else. That's the problem in a nutshell. Civilians who try to judge servicemen who have not had their experience and servicemen who still have the "at war" mentality due to their experiences. I would urge everyone to watch Restrepo, a National Geographic award winning documentary about the death of Pfc. Juan Restrepo. Look at what the platoon leader faced in trying to identify "bad guys" from locals. Not an easy task. So ndlscout, should we torture every Afghani local we find because some percentage will provide useful information that will save our soldier and marine lives? Why do you think the Bush administration utilized Gitmo and labelled those they brought there as "enemy combatants" and for the "worst" took them to foreign soil in Europe or who knows where to apply their special interrogation techniques? For myself, yes, I just fall into the following category - Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom! You weep for Santiago and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives! You don't want the truth, because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall! You need me on that wall! We use words like "honor", "code", "loyalty". We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline! I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it! I would rather you just said "Thank you," and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you are entitled to!

I tried to push on our committee the "high dues / low camping fee" idea. It didn't go over well. I formulated a "ghost patrol" - a patrol of troop youth members whose attendance fell below a certain level. Yes, when one does not show up, it hurts the patrol, planning, etc. so I was in favor of lumping them together. But it may also be a barometer of how they view the experience. Something to discuss with the CC and COR.

The Oath asks that we do our duty to God. The Scout Law asks that we are reverent. To be reverent is to revere. Now, some feel on may revere someones excrement, Satan, Santa, God, god, Gods, or the girl next door and comply with the 12th point. Others feel one has to be reverent in a spiritual sense (for most, the revere or worship God). To earn the Scout badge, one has to understand and agree to live by the Scout Oath and Law. If I were this Scout's Scoutmaster, I would ask him what the Scout Law is, question him in such a way that I could understand his understanding of the Law and then simply ask him is he agree to live by (his) interpretation of the Scout Law and Oath. If he says yes, fine. If he says no, tell him the implications.

Educating the boys, while not wrong, is putting the responsibility in the wrong place. Mandating YPT to adults does not necessarily prevent these things but doesn't hurt either. The best thing I think we can communicate to the youth is to let them know they have the freedom to inform a trusted adult if anything goes on that they are uncomfortable with. In a situation like this, it could easily happen that there were no outward signs of abuse to recognize. Once, I went to a Scout's house to council him on a merit badge. Only after the first ten minutes or so did I realize that no one else was home except for me, the Scout and his dog. I continued but did tell him in friendly manner, that any subsequent meetings at his home would require either a sibling or preferably a parent to be home too. On another occasion, a winter campout, I had a Scout - alone in his tent, request that I come into the tent to help him put his pants on! He couldn't snap/zip up his snow pants over his thermal underwear. First I asked another Scout to help - and they couldn't accomplish the task. So next, I asked him to go to the front of the tent (visible to all), I stood outside and making sure I had at least two SAs as "witnesses" I "corrected" the problem. The things a Scoutmaster has to do! (This message has been edited by acco40)

The celebration in the US and Europe was not because Hitler was dead but because "Victory in Europe" was achieved. I don't see us declaring a victory on the war on terror and the return of active duty soldiers and marines to the United States in the near future due to this event. I'd compare it more to the killing of Mussolini maybe?

At the end of the day the true worth of most awards are what the person who receives it holds it up to be. How true. One possible effect of awarding this Scout with the Eagle Rank is that he will realize the expectations of the rank and put more emphasis on living up to those ideals than he has in the past. Wouldn't that be great?

I know I'll get a lot of flack for this but the internet does provide some level of protection. Truthfully, I was surprised the citizens of the United States had such a celebratory response to the killing of Bin Laden. Yes, I'm glad he was found and prevented from causing (directly) any more harm to our countrymen. But cheering and whooping it up? Do I know the exact details, no; but from what I can tell we shot and killed an unarmed man. Yes, he had the proverbial blood on his hands but I know that when I see celebratory herds of Arab Muslims parading around dead pilot or soldier's bodies, I'm disgusted. I would think that celebrating the killing of anyone is distasteful and smacks more of revenge than justice. My generation watched Oswald get gunned down on national TV and the response of many was shock, not celebration. Same for "ordinary" electrocution or lethal injection of those in our criminal justice system - it's a sad event, not cause for celebration except for a few.

The COR can also be CC. In fact, CC is the one member of a unit who can hold more than one registered position within the unit. I believe you meant the COR is the one member of a unit who can hold more than one registered position. There are no Scoutmaster/Committee Chair folks.

Think really hard about this one. What are you being asked to sign off on? You state that you are being asked to sign off on an Eagle Project. In our troop, we had the Scoutmaster and Committee Chair as well as the Unit Advancement Committee "chair" sign the workbook cover sheet. We had the Scoutmaster and Committee Chair sign as approval to begin the project to indicate that project plans were reviewed and approved. Those sign-offs have nothing to do with wearing the uniform, Scout Spirit, etc. I agree with Lisabob and ctbailey.

A youth application has a "Information to Parents" section. In that section, it states the the BSA "recognizes the importance of religious faith and duty" - nothing more, nothing less. It also contains an excerpt from the Declaration of Religious Principle (I wonder what the whole principle states?) which is up to interpretation on what it means. So, a youth is not really expected to profess a belief in God to join the BSA.